Mighty oaks from little acorns grow - slow weight gain support thread

[FireworksScareMossyPets]

Thread for those of us whose los are:

• Healthy
• Meeting developmental milestones
• Producing plenty of soaking wet nappies
• Producing several pooey nappies (quantity varies after first six weeks or so)
• Gaining weight...

but just much more slowly than the centile charts tell us they should.

This is a thread for help, support and understanding from other Mums who have "been there, done that".

It's where we can share links, share our stories and what if anything we have done to help our lo's weight gain - or whether we've just ditched the scales and looked at the baby.

However, we also don't want to lull other Mums into a false sense of security; if your lo is not meeting the criteria at the top then it is best to get help from a breastfeeding counsellor (or general infant feeding specialist - not all slow gaining babies are breastfed) or supportive health care professional.

Mossy xx

Hi ladies, nice to see some new faces

Just wanted to say academicmum - We went to 'well known childrens shoe store' also to get ds some proper walking shoes. He is a size 3 at 17mo, the style of she we wanted starts at a 4 . They had only one style that would have fit him and didn't have it in stock in his size. I wasn't paying all that money for a shoe we didn't even like! I think it's silly that the shoe shop that claims to cater for all sizes and width fittings hasn't got a wider range of sizes, not everyone is average you know!

Anyway, we went to sports direct and got him a size 3 pair of trainers for £7, they've been great

Don't remind me about the comments from other mums at the clinics, I go there as rarely as poss. He usually gets weighed by the paed of dietician now. One mum told me, when ds was 7mo that he looked like he was 4mo old?! Thanks a lot! Some people don't engage their brain before opening their mouths.

My baby is 14 weeks old now...went for a weighing last week and my doctor got very concerned that she has nit gained much weight since she was born and suggested that I should bottlefeed her...
here's a summary of her weight gain:
Birth 10lb 11oz
1 week 10lb 4oz
2 weeks 10lb 12oz
3 weeks 11lb 1oz
4 weeks 11lb 9oz
5 weeks 11lb 14oz
11 weeks 12lb 13oz
12 weeks 12lb 14oz
13 weeks 13lb 2oz
She feeds about 4 good feeds a day and probably 2-3 smaller feeds. have about 5-7 wet nappies a day and is nice and alert most of the time...shall I be worried too???
Please help

Hi yummydee. I can't say anything about whether you should be worried or not, but is your doctor basing his/her opinion only on weight gain? If so, you might be able to get them to do blood tests to check the nutritional status and overall health of your lo. Also, do you think she would accept more feeds if you were to offer more? If so, you could try offering her more frequently. If she's unlikely to accept more feeds I think it is unlikely that bottles will help either. Bottles are only really likely to help if it is your supply which is the problem. Also, have you had anyone check how she is feeding?

I seem to remember that at about 3 months (when weight gain for ds2 was still really good) he was feeding about 8 times in 24 hours (6 times between 7am-7pm and 2 times overnight) with his feed before bed at 7pm generally being more of a cluster feed lasting up to 2 hours.

It doesn't look though like she's doing all that badly for weight gain - she's averaging a bit under 4oz per week with the last few weeks being slower than the first few. If I were you I'd go and ask the doctor for blood tests to check whether she is healthy and offer more feeds, it would be a pity to switch to formula if she is actually healthy and just slowing down her weight gain a bit. Also, have they checked for urine infection? This can sometimes cause problems with weight gain.

Hi yummydee,

from what i have been able to discover it is really normal for a baby who is born relatively big to slow in growth at 3-6 months old, similarly for a baby who grows quite fast at the outset. That sort of makes sense: if they carried on growing at the same rate they would be ENORMOUS by the time they were three years old. if I were you i wouldn't worry too much, especially as you say she is generally nice and alert. Would you be worried about her if you hadn't taken her to be weighed??

fwiw my dd2 grew quite fast over the first three months (moving from 50th to 80th percentile); over the next 6 months she only put on 1 lb 7oz, and several times over that period she actually lost weight, though all the while continuing to get longer and stronger. She was never ill during that period and at nearly three years old now there is absolutely nothing wrong with her. She is on about the 25th percentile now. It totally puzzled the doctor when she got weighed who couldn't seem to believe that her curve wasn't smooth, but she was so evidently healthy that she decided that there must be a problem with the scales. There wasn't a problem with the scales: some children are just like that.

I hope you manage to enjoy being the mummy of a little one and make the most of it. It is so easy to worry and feel like we're not doing something right, but often its just the statistics which don't fit our babies!

Thanks peasandbeans and academium,

I was always worried about Dd from the beginning, she has never been such a good feeder from the word go, only feeding 5 minutes at a time and if I keep offering it to her she would just throw up, what seems to be like all her feeds.

Peasandbeans, I tried to give her a cluster feed in the evening before bed-time, but she would not have it. I would be lucky if she even feeds more than 5 ? 7 minutes, I have started to try to wake her up and offer her the otherside as well now, but she wont always take it. I have also tried to feed her more often, but she latched on, have a few gulps and ended up looking at me, smiling and laughing, not wanting to go back on. I am not sure if I should keep doing this or should I just wait until she ask for a feed, in which case she would probably feeds 3 times during the day and once or twice at night. Would that be enough feed???

I was starting to feel better with her 5 minutes feed, until when Dd was 10-12 weeks old, I seem to have a supply problem, and she seemed to be restless when feeding for about 1 week (I wonder if that was the reason she only gained a little). I am not sure if this is the time when babies normally have their growthspurt or not. On second thought, my period came during this time, could this have any connection as to why I was experiencing supply problem???

Academium, the doc refered me to see the consultant lastweek, he took a sample an said that Dd does not show signs and symptoms of urine infection, he seemed happy with things, but wanted her to be weighed fortnightly this month.

Hello all - have been keeping quiet this week as ds gained 6oz!! I can really relate to what you've all been saying about celebrating gains at weigh-in - I fear I have been marked down as a mentalist at baby clinic by my reaction to the news. He is now following a line just underneath the 2nd centile, but I don't consider us to be safe yet - I don't know if I ever will.

Best wishes to all the little acorns!

hi yummydee - I'm no expert, but I reackon your period starting is almost certainly the cause of feeling you had low supply at 12 weeks. Mine re-started when ds2 was 7 months and I now find that I have distinctly better supply in the first half of the month than the second.

I wouldn't worry too much about 5 minute feeds and if she throws it all back again if you try to get her to take more then personally I wouldn't bother. I also wouldn't try to force her to have feeds she doesn't want as this will get both of you upset and dreading feeding time. That said though 3 feeds during the day doesn't seem very much. If she has not demanded a feed say 3 hours after the last one, could you offer her one and see if she is interested?

It doesn't sound like offering formula will help with anything other than measuring her input though.

Also, I don't know if I've just been lucky to have a really good consultant looking after us, but I've found ours has been great to alleviate any worries we had about ds2.

downbutnotout - 6oz, that's great! I think that people who have never had a weight gain problem don't really understand this , they just put baby on the scales at weigh-in and assume the number will be bigger than last time. I certainly did with ds1 (and ds2 until his weight started tailing off).

I know what you mean though about possibly not ever feeling 'safe' though, I still feel this way with ds2 at 10 months.

I've also got good news - after a worrying weigh in last week I registered ds2 with our GP (mine and ds1's) on Wednesday and saw a consultant at the hospital on Thursday. Both very happy with his weight gain overall and general appearance, and consultant doesn't want to see us for another couple of months. No suggestion that I should use formula. Quite a lot of evidence for me as well that my milk supply is picking up.

Time to feed in bed now, night

Hi Yummydee,

lots of good advice from Academic but I also wanted to suggest that your dd could be experiencing 'catch-down' growth. 10lb 4oz is a big baby and by my reckoning she must still be around the 25th/50th centile for weight just now. Personally, I wouldn't be very worried with that and would give her a bit more time and see what happens. Maybe she's just meant to be a bit more petite than her birth weight would suggest!

I also have some good news. Got dd weighed this morning (I just pop into the surgery when the other mums won't be there ) and she has put on 9oz in one week!!! ...I knew she felt a bit heavier but I wasn't prepared for that! At 14 months she has finally broken the 17lb mark, weighing in at a heady 17lb 2oz. At this rate we might even be able to change her car seat soon!

God bless Mr Petit Filous and his chocolate desserts.

Katy - that's great, isn't it so motivating when you finally get a good weight gain.

For the last few days I've taken a good deep breath and decided to start (slowly) dropping breastfeeds. I'm just crossing my fingers and hoping that he corrects for this himself (he will drink out of a cup, just not normally more than about 2oz at a time - but I can't sustain the 5 breastfeeds per day + 1 overnight that he has been having), so since Sunday he hasn't had one early evening before his nap and it actually seems to have been helping! He is feeding better before he goes to bed (aside from the fact I almost get attacked by him in desparation to feed by then), he's also sleeping better and eating his dinner better. I'll give it another couple of weeks and then try and see if I can get away with dropping another one.

All I have been reading this thread with interest for the last month and thought it was about time I posted.

I have a 16 month old daughter who has just reached 9 kg, (a big milestone). She is a very happy little thing and as bright as a button but it is a constant struggle to put weight on her. She was born 3.1 kg (25th centile) but from about 5 months her weight gain slowed until she was on the 2nd centile.

She is allergic to cows milk protein, (eventually diagnosed at 6 months after numerous trips to various GP's & A&E) and has always had a small appetite. She is still breast-fed & I'm desperately trying to get her to take prescribed milk so I can stop.

I feel I spend most of my day either trying to get food into her or worrying about what she hasn't eaten. Family & friends babies are all big bruisers so it can be difficult to get people to understand the anxiety.

I was hoping to get some advice on feeding schedules that work for babies with small appetites.

Thanks all

Hi MonkeyPuzzle. DS2 is also allergic to cows milk. It's a nightmare, isn't it? Are you dairy free yourself? I have been for the last 4 months (and really missing cheese and milk chocolate), but on the few occassions I've tried a bit of dairy, his eczema has flaired up really badly. We have had some success with the hypoallergenic milk but the only one ds2 will entertain is Cow and Gate Pepti. He wouldn't even let the nutramigen touch his lips (can't say as I blame him), plus he seemed to react to this. Then we tried neocate for ages (laced with nesquick, apple & mango juice, pureed fruit, on weetabix, mixed with EBM) and only ever had limited success, then we tried pepti as a last ditch attempt and hey presto he took it! He only ever takes a couple of oz at a time though, but I'm hoping that this will be enough.

I don't think people do understand the anxiety though and just say "well, he'll take what he needs". [cue banging head against wall - no he doesn't that's the point...]

I don't know about feeding schedules that work, but ours goes something like this:
6am BF
7am breakfast
8.30/9am BF (but currently dropping this)
10am snack
12.30/1pm BF
2pm lunch
4pm snack
4.30/5pm BF (trying to drop this too)
6.30pm dinner
8pm BF
sometimes BF at night, but not always. It seems like quite a lot, but I seem to find little and often works better as he won't take large meals.

Thanks for your schedule Academicmum, it looks similar to mine when she was younger.

Yes its a nightmare, my little one has milk protein induced enterocolitis syndrome. She starts vomiting about 2 hours after ingesting cows milk protein, goes all lethargic, and stops after around 7-8 hours. I went dairy free once my little once was diagnosed for about 5 months. Now she is taking less milk from me I have introduced small amounts back into my diet, although I still use Soya milk . I felt exhausted and constantly hungry when I was dairy free although I did lose weight . Our paediatric allergist said approx 6% of the dairy you eat transfers into breast milk, currently she seems to be ok with this, (fingers crossed).

We have tried the nutragimen, she also reacted to this. We have had some success with neocate active. She takes it on cereal and I hide a little in her food but she will not drink it. We also tried nesquick etc etc. Haven't tried Pepti, is this partially hypo?

We are now trying to get her to drink soya formula, not ideal but it's the last resort. I have stopped feeding her first thing in the morning & I'm substituting it for soya formula. She will only take around 30-40 mls & that is when she should be hungry & thirsty but it is a start. It's hard to drop bf for these hypo formulas, you know they will drink far less and it goes against your instinct to get more food into them. I am telling myself that she has to start taking it as she may be on it for a few years.

I'm dreading weighing her in a few weeks in case she has lost weight...

Hi Monkeypuzzle, Pepti is based on hydrolysed whey whereas nutramigen is based on hydrolysed casein (but it is extensively hydrolysed). DS2 wouldn't drink the standard pepti, but will drink the pepti junior. As ds2 is anaphylactic for milk we first tried rubbing a small amount on his lips to see if there was any reaction before giving it to him and he seemed OK and I was quite amazed that he would actually drink it! Unfortunately I don't think he will ever be a gugg down a 7oz bottle kind of baby, but he will drink 2-3oz at a time so I'm working on offering it to him constantly during the day (I don't know how good this is for his teeth, but I figure his weight is more important) and for the time being I'm just trying to drop down to 2-3 breastfeeds per day. I've also discovered in the last couple of days that making thick milkshakes with it goes down OK (3oz formla, 1 scoop swedish glace ice cream and a handful of berries pureed up together).

In my case though, I am quite annoyed that my HV did nothing to help out with ds2's allergy since looking back all the symptoms were obvious (mainly eczema and blood in nappies to start with) from at least 3 months on, but we didn't connect it together other than I asked her once whether it was possible that he could be reacting to something in my diet and she simply said no. Even when he had an anaphylactic shock from yoghurt, still she didn't do anything to help even though I now know that milk allergy often goes together with weight problems and his pattern of weight gain is common in milk allergic babies!

Hi Academicmum - thanks for the milkshake idea will try tomorrow.

Same story for us re GP's and HV's. Like you, I'm still annoyed that it wasn't picked up earlier. I saw 4 different GP's an A&E doctor plus various HVs.

• Projectile vomiting up to a few hours after most feeds - GP and HV said "normal posseting or possibly slight reflux"

• Explosive green nappies - "normal"
• Blood in nappies -"from straining"
• We gave a bottle of formula at 3 months and had to call an ambulance as she was choking, purple, limp and vomiting bile, ( she stayed like this for 7 hours) - " over-fed"

- 5 mls of formula at 4 months she was the same as above - " formula too rich for her". - Yoghurt at 6 months - same reaction, " can't be an allergy as it is not an immediate reaction"

You think you are going to go crazy! I ended up getting a private consultation with a paediatric allergist. He could not believe that she had not been diagnosed as she was a textbook case like your son.

Luckily for us her allergy is non -IgE, I imagine that must be even more stressful for you.

Would love to know how you go dropping your breast-feeds, it's reassuring to know someone is going through the same stage with a child in a similar situation.

Hi Academicmum - thanks for the milkshake idea will try tomorrow.

Same story for us re GP's and HV's. Like you, I'm still annoyed that it wasn't picked up earlier. I saw 4 different GP's an A&E doctor plus various HVs.

• Projectile vomiting up to a few hours after most feeds - GP and HV said "normal posseting or possibly slight reflux"

• Explosive green nappies - "normal"
• Blood in nappies -"from straining"
• We gave a bottle of formula at 3 months and had to call an ambulance as she was choking, purple, limp and vomiting bile, ( she stayed like this for 7 hours) - " over-fed"

- 5 mls of formula at 4 months she was the same as above - " formula too rich for her". - Yoghurt at 6 months - same reaction, " can't be an allergy as it is not an immediate reaction"

You think you are going to go crazy! I ended up getting a private consultation with a paediatric allergist. He could not believe that she had not been diagnosed as she was a textbook case like your son.

Luckily for us her allergy is non -IgE, I imagine that must be even more stressful for you.

Would love to know how you go dropping your breast-feeds, it's reassuring to know someone is going through the same stage with a child in a similar situation.

DS2 is not well again. He has lost 6oz basically over the last 24 hours . He won't eat a thing and at the same time has decided he doesn't want to latch on for breastfeeds either . Its just so frustrating....

Oh Academicmum, for you. Hope he takes something soon whether it's food or milk. Is he drinking water/juice? Do you know what is is thats wrong or does he just seem out of sorts?

Not too sure what it is really. It could just be a tummy bug I guess. I've spent the whole day expressing and pipetting EBM into him since it was the only way to get any liquid in at all and it was the only thing he didn't bring back but I'm really crap at expressing. I just started to think we were getting somewhere as well.

it's so frustrating when this happens isn't it. Guess he'll get better soon enough and put the weight back on, even if slowly. At least you're managing to get something in to him. Hopefully he'll eat more tomorrow.

Oh Academicmum, how frustrating! It's just typical isn't it? That's pretty much how things have gone for us over the last 4 months. Just when you think you're turning a corner they start being sick again. I don't think other people understand what a big deal it is either. I'm sure our GP and my colleagues think I overreact to normal childhood illnesses...but given their size it really is a big deal!!

How is he doing today?

Monkeypuzzle my dd's schedule is a bit like this:

8am - breakfast with cup of high calorie milk
10.30am - high calorie milk
12.30pm - lunch
3pm - snack
6pm - dinner
8pm - high calorie milk

Also, I must confess to a terrible sin. I've found that because dd is such a snacky feeder (she only takes a few ounces of milk at a time and used to only bf for a few minutes at a time) if we leave a bottle of milk in her cot with her she will finish it overnight . I know how atrocious that is for her teeth, I know we should be weaning her off milk and I know we should be weaning her off bottles but since we started doing it she has been putting weight on and right now that is my priority!

Sometimes I think you have to throw the rule book out.

Academicmum - so sorry to hear about your little man I hope it passes quickly. My daughter seemed to be sick off & on for about 2 months last year & I know how worrying it is. Not only because of the sickness but also because of the weight loss. I am keeping my fingers crossed that he will be up & running soon with a ferocious appetite.

KatyH - Thanks for your schedule, I am trying something very similar at the moment. I have also found that bending the rules is necessary if you want to get extra food into them. I give my daughter her dinner as usual & when she has finished I let her watch some TV with some pieces of chicken and pasta in front of her until its time for the bath. It seems because she is distracted she tends to finish them all. I know they say not to use distraction but I think needs must.

Hey ladies,
I still give ds bottles and he's 17mo. He will only drink juice out of a cup. If it was the case that he would finish a bottle in his cot I would do that too, he would just spill it however. I think the rules don't really apply to us as the main priority is weight gain.

I use a LOT of distraction to get ds to eat, he would probably eat next to nothing without it. He has to play with toys and books all through his dinner. He doesn't need the toys so much when eating finger food but does when he's having the jar food (he has a mixture of both).

His schedule is something like this...

8.30am Breakfast - usually fromage frais and about a quater of a piece of toast with butter and jam for eg

10am 4oz high calorie milk

1.30 Lunch - Half a jar of savoury(at the most), Half a jar of desert(at the most) and finger foods such as fruit, cheese, quavers, bread and butter etc

2.30 4oz high calorie milk

3.30 ish some kind of casual snack, this doesn't happen every day as he doesn't always want one. Might be fruit, biscuit, crisps, cake etc

6.30 Tea - Same amounts as lunch exept different jars and finger food

7.30 - 4oz high calorie milk

8.30 4oz high calorie milk

Hooray, ds2 is looking a lot more chirpy today after another day yesterday of expressing and pipetting milk into him. Today he actually had a normal sized breakfast (1 weetabix) and almost a whole pot of soya yoghurt for snack. I have yet to see how he will take to lunch, but I'm keeping my fingers crossed. Yesterday was frustrating though, we took him to the GP to get him checked over (he had developed a rash all over) and the GP assumed he was less than 6 months old . I mean OK, I know he's small but before he was ill he'd just broken the 17 lb mark which I was really quite proud of (and ds1 was only 20lb at this age). It might just be me but you'd think they might bother to actually read the patient notes wouldn't you?