seeing thru the breastmilk propaganda

[thegauntlet]

Phew. It is really hard to see any impartial raw advice about the benefits or problems of weaning/ mixed feeding after 6 months.

Gorgeous girl is 5 and a half months, having a couple of teaspoons of baby rice now ( eek!) I am finding breastfeeding increasingly hard; since I had a horrid strep throat last week, and haven't actually slept for more than 4 hours at a stretch since she was born... my milk supply is duff. I am pumping like mad to try to get it better- and trying to get some rest and good food ( sod the diet for the time being!) so... I am thinking ( just thinking.... ) about follow on milk...

I dont want to feel guilty. Because once she has it I cant take it back....

My mum suggested cows milk ( i know!)
Im back to work when she is 7 months.I was planning on pumping.

So.... whats the evidence for the benefits of breast over anything else past 6 months please? ( be impartial.... breastfeeding milliants!)

Although I frankly cannot believe that anybody needs to be told to cuddle their baby during a feed.

i guess the problem is that combined feeding is tricky and there is more to it than just swapping between breast and bottle.

it would be hard to give out information about it because any amount of supplementing with formula in the early days is likely to interfere with supply.
and if that happened you'd get a whole load of angry women saying "but this leaflet says it'll work...."

i don't know what the answer is tbh. people with internet access are lucky i guess because there is a fountain of information out there if you know where to look.
not so helpful for those who don't have a computer tho!

i think the kind of person who thinks it's alright to wander around the shops with a bottle propped in their baby's mouth probably wouldn't listen to any "advice" about how to do it tho

and yes, i am generalising/casting aspersions

See, my problem is that I forget that all information needs to be aimed at the lowest common denominator. So, for example, when I read stuff about not expressing or giving bottles in the first 6 weeks, and I was in a desperate state on the verge of giving up b/f, I took it totally to heart and struggled with myself long and hard. What I actually needed was proper, intelligent, evidence based information which told me why it's not a good idea normally - scientifically speaking - and armed me with the information I needed to ensure it wasn't a problem for me. I kind of had to work it out myself - thankfully it turned out well for me.

But I totally get that any suggestion that it is possible would have loads of women thinking they can do a bit of this and a bit of that, oh I don't fancy b/f today I'll give him formula, etc. etc.

"propaganda...implys dishonesty to pursuade people into doing things" (sorry on phone so can't quote.)

What, like making false claims about iron content?

Funny, who should that advice you speak of come from? What source?

Well yes, you're right there thisisyesterday. The awful thing was I had been talking to this mother, I'd kind of gathered she was bottle feeding (I therefore hadn't commented on my own feeding method) but I would never judge someone for that. But I really was shocked when she just got the bottle out and stuck it in front of him.

aww gaelic it sounds like you had a really tough time of it

i think that all midwives and health visitors should have far more breastfeeding training,
that EVERY maternity unit should have breastfeeding counsellors on duty to help establish breastfeeding, and that there should be breastfeeding counsellors attached to surgeries too, so that once you are home you can access reliable help

so many areas don't have good breastfeeding support networks

I want to be one of those breastfeeding counsellors attached to a maternity ward - I feel so strongly about it. The support I had in hospital, both times, was utter shit. I truly wish I'd complained at the time. My memories of it are too hazy now.

Later on, well I have trouble asking for help. That's my own fault I guess, but I was in a very bad place - both times actually - and in no fit state to go to a support group or ring a helpline. Having a contact from the hospital would have been a very useful ice breaker. Although I did actually ring the NCT helpline with DS - had a bfc come to my house but she couldn't find anything wrong. Crucially she didn't look in DS's mouth and therefore didn't spot the tongue tie.

GS I think that the whole lowest common denominator thing is what I object to the most. What I wanted as a new and second time mother was proper impartial advice aimed at me as an individual, not a whole load of guff which assumed I was stupid and wouldn't have the wherewithall to draw any conclusions for myself.

And yes, I do think that some people have to be taught that feeding their baby is a special intimate time for both mother and baby. If you have BF at all you will know this, but if not, then perhaps you don't.

I too have seen babies being pushed about in their pushchairs with a bottle stuffed in their mouth, and I can't help feeling that a lot of the info about infant feeding in general assumes that all FF treat their babies like this.

funny... that is why we need feeding support tailored to individual women, which would be do-able if it was face to face support.

but you can't pick and choose who you give the literature to can you?
some people NEED that basic guidance, and you can't have 2 sets of instructions, 1 lot for one set of people and 1 lot for those you think are smarter

what advice MFM ? The advice from the hospital?

do you know actually i think they have to have the bit about breastmilk being better for your baby

because otherwise it could be seen to be pushing formula which is against the code of marketing of breastmilk substitutes

maybe someone who knows more about that can clarify?

"ff mothers need good solid impartial advice too and that is sadly lacking" (again, apologies not exact quote)

From previous threads i've got the impression you don't hold the who in much regard. So i'm just unclear as to where guidance re ff should come from. Obv hospitals get their, often underwhelming, guidance from somewhere.

what I would have appreciated was perhaps more tailored MW support, once I had got to know my plethora of midwives during my antenatal appointments! Apart form my fab doctor, who treats me as an individual, the general advice given at the hospital certainly treated me as one of the 'stupid majority' who needed to be told what they thought

MFM am tempted to make a silly joke about the World Health Organisation- WHO? But I won't

FF mothers get precisely NO advice since all hospitals do is say Breast Is Best and have no regard for anyone choosing or otherwise to FF. We need some proportionality here.

Funny - I'm not sure that that is true - it seems to vary greatly from hospital to hospital. My mate FF and got lots of help and support for it from the midwives in hospital.

Do they really not Funny? When I was discharged my MW had a ticklist of things to tell me, there was a section for BF mothers that included stuff like how to hand express but was quite small, and a huge long list for FF mothers including how to make up bottles and all that stuff, I didn't go through that bit as I wasn't FF, but to tick the boxes and therefore properly discharge a patient, the midwife surely must have to give some advice?
I kind of felt like she should have done that bit with me too, in case I changed to FF, but I didn't intend to so I didn't ask.

Considering they make such a bloody song and dance about feeding your baby and wake you and the baby up in hospital to do so they don't seem to be successful in offering correct advice for either method of feeding.
It's an absolute joke, which is why mumsnet is invaluable I wouldn't still be BF at 5.5 months without it.

I left hospital as BF mother both times and had precisely no advice on how to FF. That may be because I live in a part of the world where most women BF, but I would have welcomed advice as to what to do if BF didn't go to plan.

at the term 'breastfeeding propaganda'

Yeah, mothers have got millions to invest in advertising the breastmilk industry unlike formula companies

gauntlet, in case nobody's said so already, the best way to increase your milk is to let DD feed regularly over a 24 hour period. Don't express, just let her suckle. Much better to give her more frequent feeds of a shorter length than the other way around.

Since people have already flamed you for using inflammatory language I won't add to the fire...

Best of luck.

Funny, actually i ment the band.

What i mean is that previously iirc you have seemed unconvinced by the necessity of following the who guidelines.

So i'm wondering where the advice you wanted should have come from iyswim. Sorry, way past my bed time. May not be making sense.

sorry but I think alot of breastfeeding is best is a load of rubbish. I did breastfeed for 3 months then started on formula...however out of the 5 babies that I know that have been ebf over 6 months they are constantly ill with colds. So don't agree that bf can eliminate all those things because it doesn't!

Where does it say/have you heard that 'breastfeeding eliminates cold viruses' laughinglil?

Obviously, if you think that breastfeeding information is solely about eliminating colds, you will be disappointed if you breastfeed.

Yeah thousands of years of humans feeding their young their own milk is rubbish. How on earth has the human race survive until the last century without formula?