OK, I get BF, but am totally fucked off with the smugness

[FunnysInTheGarden]

Most of us are failed BF, but the tone on here recently has really pissed me off. We generally FF? Non? So why the smug shit and the passive aggressiveness towards those who have to/chose to FF?

So tempted to name names, but I won't.

Just stop being so smug and holier than thou please, some people

I very much hope I'm never smug about something that can cause so much distress to others, but am I allowd to be proud of myself?

I consistently set myself targets I fail to achieve and then beat myself up - so having a significant target I have achieved is a great feeling.

My baby spent 4 days in SCBU being tube fed ebm, but hence was never hungry, so learning to bf was a nightmare - took 5 days. In my extended family, mine is the only one of 6 mother/baby combos to ebf. I hope I never tread on someone else's sensitivities on this topic, but in all the worry and stress and 'am I doing it right' of motherhood, I can look at my thriving baby and think - I did that.

fizzle Yes you can get your notes. I sat in bed and read mine while I was in the maternity ward (they're kept on the foot of the bed). Contact your hospital - you have a right to them and they're often very interesting. You may wish to make a formal complaint - MWs MUST stop "taking babies away and feeding them formula". Utter

cat I LOVE that feeling that "I did this" :) You deserve to be really proud of yourself. Have you considered donating your milk to a milk bank if you have one locally to help other mums with babies in SCBU who can't make enough milk but are desperate to EBF? It can just get them through a few days, and it makes a significant difference to the outcome of the babies.

arses My EBF jaundiced baby recovered just fine, thanks. Must say, despite it being quite bad, formula was NEVER offered or suggested as a treatment (in fact I've never heard of this despite having two jaundiced babies). He would have had light therapy if it hadn't fixed itself, but it did, with nothing but BM. Tell your SIL to put that in her pipe and smoke it

Actually, although I only managed just over three weks of exclusive bf my baby was very, very jaundiced (HIDEOUS birth) and I got it all out of her before the two week deadline for blood tests on just my boobies.
Thanks for giving me something to think of with pride about what I see as 'failed' bf!!

So much of the start breastfeeding gets off to seems to be down to the hospital you give birth in and the attitude of the midwives. Despite being unable to feed my ds directly after the birth, him not latching on for the first 6 hours, my milk not coming in til day 4, and ds being badly jaundiced and needing to go under a light box, formula was not once suggested to me by medical staff.

organic - thank you I think I will request my noted.
I believe that it is possible that the MW added the disoriented part to cover herself as it was the night shift and I believe only 2 staff were on, and the next day my DH went to great lengths to get some bfing help. Funnily enough he managed to get some good help quickly but when I had asked previously they were busy. I put it down to his good looks.

Arses - upthread I did misinterpret your post about speech therapy. The whole WWC thing is awful.

fizzle If you have a clear memory of what happened you were not "disoriented" and this is not sufficient to "cover herself". The question is, why did she do this? It's clearly not from malice - she probably was genuinely trying to help you. So the complaint should be about her lack of training, I suppose.

moon fairly similar here. DS2 latched onto Daddy for 2 hours directly after birth as I was unable to do anything following big blood loss. He did all the skin to skin, too. DS2 remains an optimistic child and will happily suckle on random parts of anyone although my boobies do seem to be his favs, fortunately.

The midwife ended up expressing colostrum from me and DP did skin to skin and syringe fed him his first feed. I feel bad enough about not being able to do that for ds myself - I think if they had given him formula I'd have felt much worse. A friend's baby was given formula for his first feed, and she said it made her feel she'd failed and bfing was doomed from the outset (although happily she did bfeed for several months).

Yes Organic - there was not any malice, she was I am sure trying to help.

After the fill up of the formula the baby slept for hours and it meant that I did not bf him again for a long time after and it took a long time to get my supply sorted.

To be fair when she came back and said she had given the baby 2 lots of formula, she said it was because he was so hungry. I think she probably also wanted me to get more rest.

I must have looked shocked as she quickly added that "don't worry it won't stop you from breastfeeding".

I am annoyed at the notes though as I certainly was not disoriented. Looking back I would have preferred help though to bf first.

I did not show any annoyance at the time, I was shocked but she seemed a very experienced and caring mw and was pleasant.

Do calm down! All I can say 10 or so years on from the breastfeeding stage (I know, what am i doing here? I just strayed into this section through boredom) is that it's a bit of a non issue in the long run. I BF one and FF the other and can't see any difference re health, intelligence or anything else. Parenting is like a long distance run - don't wear yourselves out in the first five minutes! We're lucky enough to live in a developed country so it's safe to give our babies formula. Happy mothers generally = happy babies, so do what's best for you! (I do remember that awful smugness though, and the looks of disdain from the NCT organizer lady when I handed her a bottle of formula to heat up!!)

Of course you can't see any difference in your children, stillfeel. That's not how it works! There may be no difference - individual outcomes can't be predicted.

The NCT organiser may not have looked disdainful (or she may have done - I wasn't there and you were!) but puzzled as to what you wanted her to do....if she was a bf mother she might not have known or known how!

"is that it's a bit of a non issue in the long run"

How foolish then of the NHS to be promoting it in the way they are. Breastfeeding must be the only thing with no measurable benefits that they encourage.

And another thing (warning: smoking analogy coming up. Please do not freak out. I do not think smoking is the same as ff):

My mother smoked all the way through pregnancy and early motherhood with me, and not with my siblings.

You cannot tell by looking at us which of us had the smoking/non-smoking mother.

We are equally intelligent :), beautiful, healthy and of similar (non-obese) build.

This does not, surely, mean that all don't-smoke-in-pregnancy messages should cease?

ohhhh stillfeel18 you have awakened the monster with your down to earth common sense post......

And yes tiktok it prob was a look of distain. How dim must the NCT lady have been not to have realised that babies bottles need heating up

"How dim must the NCT lady have been not to have realised that babies bottles need heating up"

I think everyone knows that bottles of formula need heating but how are you meant to do it ?

In a microwave (and risk hot spots) in a bowl of hot water (how long do you leave it in to get the right temperature), specialist bottle warmer (no idea how they work or time taken)

Like many things in life, heating a bottle is only easy if you know how to do it :)

Actually if you use cartons then they are room temperature so don't need heating. I thought my NCT lady looked at me with disdain about formula but actually looking back I think it was because I'd changed from bf without talking to her. I'll ask her one of these days!

My ds was ff and always drank his milk straight from the fridge. This was before the realisation that preparing in advance was risky. I used to carry a couple of bottles when we went out in a coolbag and usually brought a flask of warm water for warmin and once I had to feed him where I'd expected to be provided with warm water. He was about 3 months old and he actually drank his milk quicker when it was chilled. You really can assume nothing with babies.

Isn't it a bit mean to give a baby chilled/cold milk when breastmilk would be body temperature? I must say I would always heat formula, carton or not.

BTW, the way to heat formula is in a jug of boiling hot water. You test the temperature on the back of your wrist. If it feels cold then it's not warm enough. When you can't feel it or it feels slightly warm, then it's just right. If it feels hot, then it's too hot.

I bfed for a couple of months but really didnt take to it for various reasons and giving up to ffeed really worked for me. However ultimately breast feeding just didnt mean that much to me and it was my decision to give up. I did so as it suited me better.
There is a smugness out there but its just a way for some woman to try and make them selves feel superior - they must be lacking self esteem I think. Most of my bfeeding or ffeeding friends didnt comment one way or the other (I wouldnt be friends with people who would though) The only major negativity I got was from HV's and online.

Of course breast is best as its natural but formula is a very good substitute and plenty of children are doing very well on it.
For those with proof that Aptamil/Cow and GAte etc are evil or damaging please pass it on

gaelicsheep it was 12 years ago and he seems to be over the cruelty :)
The first time I didn't heat his milk was at a mums group and I assumed that I could boil some water there to warm a bottle in the plastic jug I had with me along with the prepared bottles. But for some nonsense health and safety reason it was the only mums group I ever went to with no cup of tea provided. Ds was hungry and everyone else was bf so no one else had a flask I could share so I had no choice. But he drank it quicker cold and definitely preferred it that way. He still refuses drinks unless chilled. Anyway, that's a bit irrelevant.

Funny - how dim you must be not to realise that bottles don't need to be heated up, and even if they do, how dim you must be not to realise that not everyone knows how to do it.

TikTok how smug you must be to assume that by giving a bottle of milk to the NCT lady and presumably saying 'could you possibly heat this milk for my baby' that the NCT lady would have raised one eyebrow, not because she didn't understand the request, but because she disapproved of FF

Whitethorn, you have asked for proof. Prepare to be deluged......not nec with proof - but with the 'all formula companies are evil' nonsense that passes for informed comment on this board.

Most people aren't failed bf. Most people have a go, some carry on for a few days, some weeks, some months some combine feed, you don't fail at bfeeding IMO, you choose to stop for a good reason or because it's right for you to stop when you do... I'm still feeding, second child, only three month old, did first for ten months then it naturally ended, reckon this one same but trying bit of combined feeding but baby not keen on bottle yet...keep trying! It's v hard feeding 95centile baby and legging it after toddler! But......I'm super proud of what I've done and am doing for them, not just feeding, and occasionally I'm rather smug too....why not? It's damn hard work bfeeding..

Oh ffs. Funny - find me a direct quote regarding formula companies being evil. Go on I dare you.

Funny - I made no assumptions. I suggested an alternative explanation.