Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

OK, I get BF, but am totally fucked off with the smugness

604 replies

FunnysInTheGarden · 19/09/2010 22:33

Most of us are failed BF, but the tone on here recently has really pissed me off. We generally FF? Non? So why the smug shit and the passive aggressiveness towards those who have to/chose to FF?

So tempted to name names, but I won't.

Just stop being so smug and holier than thou please, some people

OP posts:
fizzledrizzle · 30/09/2010 23:35

Very strange thread.

I am interested in why Funny is so nasty and why Arses calls formula Evil? Perhaps they are having fun trying to be as emotive as possible?

And Yes TTBB - surely true BF Advocates would support mums especially when it was not going well.

Is that not the most common reason women first go to a breastfeeding cafe?

tittybangbang · 30/09/2010 23:36

"arses you are starting to explain and justify your reasons for using formula......big mistake. Just gives more ammunition"

Ammunition for what? Hello? Nobody has criticised Funnys for supplementing her baby. Whatever the reasons for doing so - whether it was because her baby wasn't thriving on her milk or whether it was because she wanted to go out and get rat-arsed. Nobody cares what she did. Or what you do with your baby.

arses · 30/09/2010 23:36

"Quick question, though: just how many of you are now itching to say: 'what do you mean you couldn't breastfeed, many women who have children with high arched palates and tongue ties continue to EBF'?"

Oh piss off. Nobody has said or implied that supplementation is never necessary or beneficial! You're arguing as though they have. THEY HAVEN'T. So stand down!

"Stand down"? This is warfare? Christ, chill out! And "piss off"? That's just rude.

I have actually had it said to me on the past on MN that it was 'inaccurate' to say that I 'couldn't' breastfeed, you know?

arses · 30/09/2010 23:37

If you don't care what she did or what I did with my baby, why are you here?

Now I am Confused

tittybangbang · 30/09/2010 23:38

"Why Arses calls formula Evil?"

Because there is mileage for them in implying that many of us here see how you feed your baby as a moral issue.

fizzledrizzle · 30/09/2010 23:39

Just an aside really but there is nothing tounge in cheek about the following:

"FunnysInTheGarden Sun 19-Sep-10 22:41:55
Thanks TTTT. OK namey so you are not a failed BF........please feel free to feel smug.........and launch into a tirade about how shit companies who produce formula are.........

God it winds me up. After a small amount of research, it transpires that the number of babies who fall ill in the UK having drank a poorly prepared bottle of formula is less than 1 a year.......according to WHO stats.

Don't be fooled FF mums, tis a conspiracy I tell thee......"

As you were.

sparklycheerymummy · 30/09/2010 23:39

as I said earlier its the same old names on here arguing the whole bf/ff thing. yawn yawn. Pat on the back for ALL MUMMYs!!

arses · 30/09/2010 23:40

What?

You are way off base here. And not reading my posts, I feel.

I never said formula was evil, actually. I said it was the impression I got from some encounters with other mothers, which I explained pretty comprehensively, I think.

I also have explained, several times, that I feel that bfing advocacy and celebration is an important thing, that I don't contest any of the evidence etc, merely that I feel that sometimes it would best be discussed in different contexts.

You are being unreasonable and I'm not really sure why?

fizzledrizzle · 30/09/2010 23:42

arses - if you agree that "piss off" is rude...

then can you also tell funny that "fucked off" is rude too.

Grin
tittybangbang · 30/09/2010 23:43

"I have actually had it said to me on the past on MN that it was 'inaccurate' to say that I 'couldn't' breastfeed, you know?"

Oh sorry - it was some casual comment from... when? Where? Hmm

Arses, you've engaged in an argument about the attitudes and behaviour of breastfeeding mothers - I think you've been unfair and unkind and that's why I've challenged you on this thread. I'm not concerned about your personal choices - only the opinions you've expressed about other mothers on this board.

arses · 30/09/2010 23:44

I've been clear here that I don't support funny's stance on this, I think. Yet somehow, because I have a different view to some posters (partially mediated by my own experience, tis true) I am a 'them' who is getting 'mileage' out of summat Confused.

This isn't warfare as far as I am concerned and I've posted as an individual, not as part of a team Confused

arses · 30/09/2010 23:44

I am a breastfeeding mother!

arses · 30/09/2010 23:45

(or else God knows what I was doing with my breast in my 10 month old's mouth an hour ago!)

tiktok · 30/09/2010 23:49

arses, your post of Wed 29-Sep-10 21:43:45 came after mine, in which I speculated that a bf experience that went pear-shaped might change a woman's perceptions when feeding is being discussed. I was the only poster who had raised that, I think, so that's why I thought you were directing your comments at me.

I could have used another word than 'accused', I agree - but it ill-behoves you to criticise me for using a word that makes me 'seem aggressive'...look at your own phraseology!

I do agree that anyone telling a mother what she 'could have done' to breastfeed, when they haven't been invited to dissect her experience, might sometimes do better to keep silent. However there are cases when someone will say something like 'I had to stop breastfeeding because I was prescribed [insert name of medication known to be safe with bf' or 'I switched to bottle after 2 days because my baby was just not satisfied with my milk'....and a hopefully-sensitively worded post could actually help that mother and others in the future.

arses · 30/09/2010 23:57

Misunderstanding then.

I have no issue with the idea of sensitively worded posts, tiktok. I do have an issue with casually dismissing people's perceptions of their own experience, which really has been my argument.

I don't feel I have been aggressive, not when compared with being told to 'piss off' and 'stand down'. I thought I was making a very clear point about the ways in which I felt some discussions might best be had elsewhere: that engaging in discussion about formula feeding rates in the context of a thread like this might be counterproductive.

There is a whole forum out there where women with breastfeeding experience can inform and advise. I have done an awful lot of it on other fora, mainly sharing my experience to ensure that a) people check for tongue tie early on and b) that they feed sufficiently frequently in the first few days to stimulate supply. So the fact I am being cast as some sort of ffing 'baddie' against the 'breastfeeding mothers' is kind of, well, amusing to me.

fizzledrizzle · 01/10/2010 00:05

Arses I was reading earlier posts and in that Evil Formula post you made a very strong statements that I read as anti-BF but I took it that you had a very hard time of it, I will try find the post, so you can see what I mean.

And I did wonder if you were team tagging...

fizzledrizzle · 01/10/2010 00:07

This was it Arches ...."I think people who bang on about how amazing breastmilk is and the research this and the research that and who make ffing mothers feel like SHIT should be given a sharp kick up the backside"

See I took it that you might think that going on about breastmilk may in itself make FFing mothers feel like SHIT.

Anyhow.

As you were.

I would not have thought you were pro BF. but this is my interpretation.

gaelicsheep · 01/10/2010 00:08

I'm not sure how that post by Arses could have been read as anti BF seeing as she said she fed exclusively for the first 20 weeks or so and was still feeding to this day.

fizzledrizzle · 01/10/2010 00:12

Yes I see now that is the case - I was skimming through, and it is how I picked up on the evil formula comments too. Easily done though.

arses · 01/10/2010 00:15

I posted quite a lot since then.. quite a lot.

The day I posted it I had endured a particular mother having an absolute tirade about how appalling it was that women would choose to feed their child a non-human milk substitute when it was obvious that if you did that your supply would dwindle so, ipso facto, you were just not trying hard enough because really you didn't want to breastfeed.

This was about another mother we know in common who switched after nearly six months to formula. I was livid about it. As I would have been if any other judgey comments were made..

Perhaps it was written forcefully that particular day, I guess it was. But I have posted A LOT since then..

Thank you, Gaelicsheep, for pointing out the obvious. It would be pretty stupid of me to be anti-bfing and still doing it 2-3 times a night Grin

arses · 01/10/2010 00:18

And there's the call.. Time to get out the anti-boobs Grin. Should have been in bed hours ago.. ((yawn emoticon))

slhilly · 01/10/2010 07:23

So....I see Funny has replied to plenty of people. But after posting a direct response to me, asking me to retype what I'd said earlier, and after I replied telling her to answer the questions I'd already put and more besides.....no response. Seems Funny likes to debate on her own ground, not on other people's: asking questions, not answering them. Implying they hold absurd positions ("no-one should be formula fed in developing countries!" "mothers who FF are just like smokers!" etc) and then arguing with those straw men.

I've been involved in better debates, I must say Wink

Annec, thank you for the kind words. I'll now take your advice and bow out, unless Funny responds directly to my previous posts, in which case I think I ought to do her the courtesy of replying.

tittybangbang · 01/10/2010 08:40

Arses - the fact you breastfeed doesn't give you carte-blanche to make cynical comments about the issue and to expect not to be challenged. Someone of your acquaintance made a stupid and unkind comment, and this has led you to generalise about attitudes towards bottle feeding in a way that's really not supportable in light of the attitudes expressed here on mumsnet.

As fizzle pointed out - comments like this: "I think people who bang on about how amazing breastmilk is and the research this and the research that and who make ffing mothers feel like SHIT should be given a sharp kick up the backside" are divisive. Women are constantly challenged on this board to defend their view that breastfeeding is worthwhile, but when they do so they get abused for it. How fair or sensible is that? Also using comments about 'evil' formula - well that's supremely unhelpful and shit-stirring. There is nobody here who has implied anything of the sort.

pommedeterre · 01/10/2010 08:48

Arses, if you are confident in your choices and proud of how you're baby is growing up then you do need to try to just ignore these people you keep meeting. I know it is hard and as discussed earlier in this thread I have watched a friend of mine become destroyed by people saying similar to her (bf counsellor though so worse - b*tch), but you do need to find your inner centre. If you know what you are doing is right for you and your baby and you are loving every minute with them then it does not matter. You don't even need to reply, it should just wash over you. it does not matter what they think.
I know it is hard to get to this point and, despite having had lots of advantages in life allowing me to get to this point early on in life, my confidence was rocked by bf/ff but I have no refound it. Having refound it I am so much happier. I am able to appreciate the bf experience I did give dd and able to feel confident what moving to ff was right for us at that moment in time to keep my family unit strong and happy. It also frees me up to analyses that experience and set my mind free to think how things could be improved for the next one I hope to have and bf for longer.

pommedeterre · 01/10/2010 08:49

Sorry lots of typos.