Was Mandela a terrorist or a freedom fighter?

[ObliviouslyIgnorant]

I should introduce myself as being white and Irish before I even start. I am sorry to intrude as us Irish folk have our own little space too, but it can be a divided space at times and not particularly relevant to what I'm asking as such, and I suppose others do barge in a bit.

I have a vested interest as my dd is mixed race (Nigerian father) - her father was never involved however and she strongly identifies as Irish.

I've been listening to Irish rebel songs and one of the songs sung was this one

I don't actually know how many of you view him?

Being Irish, we have a strong culture of music confined to a small population about oppression and fights for freedom.

In any case, the IRA is viewed as a terrorist organisation by many. I am an IRA sympathiser which I should not really say I suppose, but it is what it is.

So, I suppose I have a couple of questions. Do you see Mandela as a freedom fighter or a terrorist? How about the IRA? Do you celebrate your freedom fighters in song? And if you know anything about Ireland, I suppose, do you identify a little with the Irish people?

And Happy New Year too.

Kids blown apart the day before Mother's Day is fine then! Great point!

atrick Rooney loved horror movies and Halloween, and wanted to be a priest when he grew up. In August 1969, the nine-year-old was killed when the RUC fired into his home during rioting in Belfast, the first of at least 186 children to die in what would become known as the Troubles in Northern Ireland.

Their stories are told for the first time in a new book by the RTÉ broadcaster Joe Duffy and Irish Times Northern Correspondent Freya McClements. Children of the Troubles, which is published next week, is based on original interviews with almost 100 families and includes children who have never previously been publicly acknowledged as victims of the Troubles.

From the teenage striker who scored two goals in the schools’ cup final, to the boy who loved animals so much he “saved every little creature around him”, and the five-year-old who wrote in her copybook on the day she died, “I am a good girl, I talk to God”, these are their stories.

No one is saying the RUC didn't commit crime.

But sympathizing with other criminals makes the opposing side no better,

@YouBoughtMeAWall

I think someone is trying to get this thread deleted. Best not to engage.

Lol, I feel like I'm being invaded in real time!!! Blooming Ada!

I'll sympathise with the right side.

You can walk on by.

You have done nothing to denounce the planting of the bomb outside McDonalds on the day before Mother's Day in England.

I'm not justifying or defending the crimes you are posting about - quite the reverse.

You are a sympathizer so thinks their deaths are justifiable.

Tim Parry
Jonathan Ball

How can the death of any child be acceptable?

Don't tell me what I think.

Well tell us what you think then?

Are you ok with the murder of those children, as a sympathizer?

@herethereandeverywhere

Tim Parry Jonathan Ball

How can the death of any child be acceptable?

You tell me?

I'm saying the murder of any child can never be justified. Hence I could never be a sympathizer to any side. Only an advocate of peace.

Do you think Mandela would have deflected a question about blowing up babies?

In war, in a fight for freedom, lives are taken. None of those should be children. I think that you should be respectful of the area of Mumsnet you are posting in - a lot of whom will know people who have fled war and famine, like the Irish, with their children.
Don't come on here naming children as some sort of plea for leniency for the Crown? Get ta fuck.
You're in your place now - completely isolated from the world. Enjoy it. You won't even feed your own starving children, let alone avoid shooting 'forrin' children.

the five-year-old who wrote in her copybook on the day she died, “I am a good girl, I talk to God”

I suppose that was fair?

The ignorance of some people never fails to astound me.

My children have Irish passports. I type the name of the children murdered by the IRA because they were kids, like my own - precisely the reverse of some flag waving crown supporting crap you are insinuating I stand for (I'd abolish the monarchy given the chance).

Don't try to co-opt sympathy for the IRA by co-opting the struggle of black people. If you can post here with your regressive views, I can post here in opposition.

There was wrong on both sides of the Troubles. One of the greatest successes of the 20th century was the GFA. Another being the ending of Apartheid. Don't try to rewrite history when it could break a fragile peace. It's always better to look forward.

"For to be free is not merely to cast off one's chains, but to live in a way that respects and enhances the freedom of others."

*"the five-year-old who wrote in her copybook on the day she died, “I am a good girl, I talk to God”

I suppose that was fair?**

You may think an eye for an eye is fair. I think one murdered child is one too many. It is never justifiable. Never.

Peace was achieved talking, understanding and sharing. It is holding grudges that holds people back.

Don't try to co-opt sympathy for the IRA by co-opting the struggle of black people. If you can post here with your regressive views, I can post here in opposition.

You COMPLETELY missed the entire point of my post.

If that's the best you've got I'll rest my case for tonight (and hope your daughter is receiving a decent education to compensate for the omissions at home.)

I'd never want to raise a new generation to think murdering kids was justified. To know the wrongs on both sides - yes. To defend their actions - no. That's not how we move on.

If that's the best you've got I'll rest my case for tonight

Well sing Alleluia!

I'll leave you with this

OP what you call “freedom fighting” other people call “cold blooded murder” - and if you really can’t comprehend why then I suggest you pick up some history books.

I’d never want to raise a new generation to think murdering kids was justified. To know the wrongs on both sides - yes. To defend their actions - no. That's not how we move on

Wise words.

Don't try to co-opt sympathy for the IRA by co-opting the struggle of black people. If you can post here with your regressive views, I can post here in opposition.

I have to agree with this.

OP you invited discussion by mentioning the IRA and Mandela. You don’t get to decide which bits can be debated.
And maybe don’t post about such a controversial topic if you are going to get rude and defensive when someone disagrees with you.