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Original poster

Threatening a misbehaving child with a cold shower

162 replies

Bonsoir · 01/02/2010 16:11

I just witnessed DD's class teacher having a word at pick-up time with someone who I think is the grandmother of another girl in DD's class. The teacher was obviously very angry about this little girl's misbehaviour because she was raising her voice a bit and looked very cross.

Two minutes later the grandmother was telling the little girl off good and proper - so much so that the child had a screaming meltdown tantrum on the pavement opposite school. Grandmother hit the little girl and threatened her with a cold shower.

Poor, poor little girl. She is adopted and has some developmental/behavioural issues. But that doesn't seem like the right way to go about helping her overcome them...

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thedollyridesout · 02/02/2010 11:10

Kindness is something we could all do to work on .

CaptainNancy · 02/02/2010 11:11

I find it concerning (behaviour aside) that you know the child is adopted. Is this common knowledge? Does the child have to face the world every day with everyone knowing her intimate business? Far more worrying and damaging in the long-term I would think.

Original poster
Bonsoir · 02/02/2010 11:14

Totally common knowledge. Why not? There are other adopted children at school and everyone knows that - parents IME are very upfront about adoption here.

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CaptainNancy · 02/02/2010 11:26

IME people still take quite a dim view of adoption/ees- if they have problems, it's because their (birth) parents were bad, lots of people still think there's something wrong with the child etc, they expect them to fail or be disruptive. Adoption being common knowledge can be very damaging.
I do not currently live in France though.

Original poster
Bonsoir · 02/02/2010 11:39

All the adopted children I know in France are brought up in full knowledge of that fact and usually with a nanny or language lessons or both from their culture of origin (if appropriate) to ensure they will be able to reconnect with their place of birth in later life if they wish to do so.

I don't know much about it but that seems to be usual practise here.

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2010aQuintessentialOdyssey · 02/02/2010 11:43

Bonsoir, I think what thedolly is trying to say to you, is that even if the great thing about parks is that they are free and that you dont need an invitation to join in, what YOU can do is to say to the grandma, "hi there mrs XYZ, would you and Milly join me and Tabitha in the park, so the girls can play together a little while?" I am sure it will not be frowned upon, and I dont think this will be looked down upon by anybody, even if you and grandma dont move in the same social circles.

Original poster
Bonsoir · 02/02/2010 11:45

I know what she is trying to say to me but believe me, it would be deeply weird to do that - an invasion of her privacy/personal space. It's free to join but no-one is co-erced.

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Original poster
Bonsoir · 02/02/2010 11:47

This is a country where, if you say "Bonjour" to another French parent to whom you have not been introduced and/or with whom paths have not been crossed on the school run for at least 6 months, you are being forward and rude...

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OtterInaSkoda · 02/02/2010 11:59

That's just Paris though, isn't it? Total strangers say hello to us when we go for country walks in Brittany, just as they do in the UK countryside.

Back when I was an au pair I got a bollocking from a total stranger in patisserie in the 16th for not allowing my charge to have a cake that I knew contained egg - to which the dc was allergic. My French was (is) rubbish but she definately said it was incroyable that I was depriving the petite.

I can't imagine anyone getting between a grandma punishing a child in Brittany or Paris though.

CaptainNancy · 02/02/2010 12:01

Ah... they are cross-culture adoptions. Kind of hard to keep it private if parents are caucasian french and child is ethnic chinese or senegalese or something!

thedollyridesout · 02/02/2010 12:05

You don't have to be entirely governed by social etiquette do you Bonsoir? Can you not use the fact that you are 'foreign' to your advantage in situations like this? I am sure that you would be perfectly polite, neither forward nor rude.

CaptainNancy · 02/02/2010 12:10

One does in Paris dolly, believe me, if you want to stay there you do.

Original poster
Bonsoir · 02/02/2010 12:11

I am not "foreign" in other people's eyes here, from a distance - I know the behavioural norms like the back of my hand, and it would be weird if I didn't after so many years.

I know what you are thinking, thedolly, and why - what you are proposing would be construed as normal, friendly behaviour in England and, in England, that is the way I behave (I will chat randomly to parents with not a care in my head when I take DD to swimming or gym when I am in England in the holidays, and it all goes down just fine). Here it is just plain rude to do that, unless you have made eye contact at the very least!

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thedollyridesout · 02/02/2010 12:11

Maybe it is possible to be perfectly polite and forward at the same time.

Original poster
Bonsoir · 02/02/2010 12:13

thedolly - I think you are out of your depth, here! A bit like with the threads on bilingualism!

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2010aQuintessentialOdyssey · 02/02/2010 12:15

My rather juvenile comment would be "gosh I am glad I dont live in Paris".

mii · 02/02/2010 12:18

oh I know of someone who makes her child sit in the shed with a bucket over his head as a punishment

reported to ss over a year ago and nothing came of it

Original poster
Bonsoir · 02/02/2010 12:18

Any place is daunting when you don't know the language and customs

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thedollyridesout · 02/02/2010 12:33

I don't mind being out of my depth . How else am I to learn? You can't read this stuff in a book. You couldn't even make it up .

I doubt that I would succumb entirely to the French way of doing things if I lived there but then I probably wouldn't be as popular as you are.

I'm sure it doesn't have to be that hard Bonsoir - the whole bilingual/bicultural thing. Also, one doesn't have to be a perfectionist in all walks of life. There are lots of different ways to be the best person you can be.

Original poster
Bonsoir · 02/02/2010 12:37

Yes you can read it in a book - there is a whole literary genre of Britons/Americans/other Anglo-Saxons and their experiences in France. Just go to WHSmith on rue de Rivoli or at the Eurostar terminal and help yourself!

There is of course no conversation with the author, however

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thedollyridesout · 02/02/2010 12:38

Who knows, maybe the best version of you is the one that invites that little girl and her grandmother/mother to the park - they might just surprise you and say 'yes'. Nothing ventured, nothing gained and all that.

thedollyridesout · 02/02/2010 12:40

So that is where you are going wrong Bonsoir . One can be too much of an academic you know.

Original poster
Bonsoir · 02/02/2010 12:41

I'm not exactly an unadventurous type of girl, thedolly . I don't like putting my foot in it at school though - I leave testing others' limits to MN

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thedollyridesout · 02/02/2010 12:44

So did you mention anything this morning to the teacher? If not, do you think you will?

Original poster
Bonsoir · 02/02/2010 12:48

I didn't do drop off this morning - and in any case, parents cannot see the teacher in the morning. The only available time is 4.20 pm.

Yes, I am going to talk to her - I am going to let her know, as diplomatically as I possibly can, the outcome of her spontaneous chat yesterday afternoon and hope she gets the message that those spontaneous chats are a bad idea.

And I have mentioned the teacher's spontaneous chat to the head of the PA. The issue of teachers doing this in public is a recurring one that is not supposed to happen. The head of the PA will have to talk to the headmistress about it again.

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