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5 yr old DS is driving me crazy!!!Please help.

157 replies

chocciedooby · 14/01/2009 21:44

I have been concerned with DS's behavious for some time now and I am really getting to the end of my tether. So many behaviorial things to mention but a few are that he is: -

Attention Seeking
Persistant
Stubborn
At times - aggressive
Very fussy eater

The list is endless. He does of course he has many great positive qualities but I really need help as I don't know how much more of this unacceptable behaviour I can take. I am exhausted physically and emotionally, am expecting baby no.3 in June and don't know how I will cope.

One of the things that I find very difficult is that he wants to be in control of EVERYTHING. I stand my ground, don't give in, say NO and stick to it but he continues to throw huge tantrums (sometimes over an hour long), has peed on the floor and in his bed for attention and will go to any lengths to win a battle.

He will not go to sleep in the evenings and constantly calls dh and I upstairs for silly things just to get our attention. I am so concerned that he is not getting enough sleep. His mind seems to be overactive.

I have tried many discipline techniques (in fact about all of them) over the years and nothing seems to work. I am now considering talking to a challenging behaviour therapist and wondered if anyone else out there is dealing with the same problems or has found a therapist of use.

Please please help.

OP posts:
chocciedooby · 06/02/2009 11:21

Glad to hear DD has calmed a bit for you Mrspurple. Keep us posted on how her tests go.

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MrsPurple · 06/02/2009 18:17

Hi Choccie, sounds like you're having a rough ride.

Your DS doesn't mean what he says re baby, Ihope you can take some comfort in that, it's just him knowing what gets the most attention.

My DH apparently used to get up alot when he'd gone to bed and it may sound awlful, and lots of mumsnet people will have opinions on this (we are talking 30 odd years ago), but his mum put a little hook and eye on outside of door, so he couldn't open door.

He got bored after a few nights and gave up trying to come down. Of course remember to take eye out of hook when you go to bed (in case of fire etc).

It's sounds like your at your wits end , and this may do trick, as he'll get bored before you do.

I've resorted to pretending to go for afternoon sleep so DD2 goes for a snooze and this appears to keep some kind of order. Although she still has some tantrums, it has calmed her a little.

I'm also trying the distraction tactics again with sticker chart. Have done this before, she usually gets bored after a few weeks, so we're on week 2, will let you know how we go.

I'm also trying to let my DD2 think she's winning a little e.g she won't eat tea and pushes across table agressively ,so I've gone to basics and said if you eat 5 spoonfuls I will give you pudding.

Although she thinks she is winning, I'vew got her to eat 5 spoonfuls. The next day I increase etc.

Emsiesmum · 06/02/2009 23:51

Hi
I have had a quick read of your post. It does sound hard coping with a 5 year old like that whilst being pregnant. It sounds to me as though your child needs some quality time with you on a one to one. DS's behaviour would seem to be all about getting attention from mum.
Perhaps you should put time aside each day to play a game with DS, take DS to the park, offer praise when DS behaves well. I used a 'time out' step with the kitchen timer and no other distractions. Fortunately my children never moved from the step until time was up. Perhaps when you put DS to bed you should make it very clear that you will not return to his/her bedroom, ignore tantrums no matter how long they last - they are just for attention - no show without an audience. You have probably heard all that before.
Does distraction work? I have had moments when if something was going on that irritated me, I walked out the room.
I have found though that spending quality time and not begrudged time with a child has its rewards. Make DS feel special and yes keep putting DS back to bed every time DS gets out.
Does DS have friends round for tea? How does DS behave then?
My 11 year old can be a bit off with me sometimes but last week we had 3 games of Cluedo, played cards, went shopping, chatted on her bed and had cake and coffee out - all without her little sister! I really notice the difference in our relationship when we spend time like this on a one to one. Sorry to waffle on.
Emsiesmum.

chocciedooby · 07/02/2009 13:01

Hi Emsiesmum. Thanks for your post.
You do have a good point as it is very difficult and rare for me to spend time with DS1 one on one. I actually don't really do it with either DS's very often. dh leaves the house for work every day at 7am, and returns after 8pm when the kids are in bed. That just leaves the weekends and dh likes to spend time with them then as hasn't seen them all week. I am starting DS1 in a soccer club in a couple of weeks time and am hoping this will help to get him into a routine away from home and with his pals. Whenever I do ge tthe chance to spend time one on one we have a lovely time together so you are exactly right about it improving our relationship. The only other times that we spend alone would be bedtime and when doing his homework.
I will have to see what I can work out.

We bribed DS1 last night with a cheapy painting kit if he stayed in his bed and was quiet at bedtime. DH promised him we would check on him every 10 minutes or so as he keeps telling us he is lonely. It seemed to work and he got his set this morning. Then his behaviour took a turn for the worse and he had about 3 tantrums, hitting dh etc etc etc. So tiring. We never know what triggers him off, it can be anything!

OP posts:
chocciedooby · 07/02/2009 13:02

I have this terrible feeling that the sticker chart is beginning to lose its novelty and we are going to end up back at square 1

I know that seems terribly negative but we are all trying so hard and yet ....

OP posts:
chocciedooby · 07/02/2009 13:02

I have this terrible feeling that the sticker chart is beginning to lose its novelty and we are going to end up back at square 1

I know that seems terribly negative but we are all trying so hard and yet ....

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MrsPurple · 07/02/2009 21:56

Hi Choccie

your DS is doing the same as my DD2, the novelty wears off and it all starts again. my DD2 has done this cycle for a while, we are on the appreciation of reward chart at the moment.

Good luck, feel free to rant if it gets to bad.

chocciedooby · 08/02/2009 09:35

Hi Mrspurple.

DS wasn't too bad the last 2 nights. We bribed him Fri night with a "Cars" painting kit that cost e1 and he REALLY wanted it. Last night there was no actual bribe but we did have to keep going up the stairs for about 45 minutes until he fell asleep. He was well behaved and did not leave his room. I am praying we have broken the cycle but also feel maybe I need to keep a few small bribes up my sleeve.I will do anything to rid of the usual stress.
How are you all getting on?

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MrsPurple · 08/02/2009 11:09

my DD2 had major strop going to bed but as DH was here and took her he carried her upstairs (something I can't do, she's too strong and heavy!)

Had bad night myself,so am shattered (see my post in health need advice).

Just been speaking to DH about sticker charts (as all filled this week) so need a treat (not the usual daily stuff), normally give extra if all days filled.

Nothing expensive but still trying to think of something, would usually go swimming or to the zoo (as I've got membership), however not feeling great so need to think of alternative.

chocciedooby · 08/02/2009 12:51

HOw about a picnic lunch or tea in front of the tv? My kikds always love turning the lights off and watching a movie whilst eating yummy popcorn.
Or maybe something nice thats edible or a small toy?
Sorry you didn't have a good night

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MrsPurple · 08/02/2009 13:24

Yeah my 2 like to pretend it's the cinema and close the curtains, thanks will go for that or a cream cake after tea.

Am going off to sit on bed and revamp all kids clothes due to growth spurt (both at same time.

Therefore before I challenge Anneka to my pile of ironing, I am going to sort out, so I don't waste valuble energy ironing clothes that don't fit.

Will be back on later

chocciedooby · 08/02/2009 21:24

Well did you win on the ironing?
DS in bed but already thrown bottle of water all over bedroom floor and told us it was wee!
Keeps calling us etc. I want to ignore unless he comes down. DH wants to keep running up! Not good that we don't agree on this.aaaaaaarrrrrrrrrhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

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MrsPurple · 08/02/2009 21:52

No ironing done,however have halved pile by sorting out both DD cloths. DD1 passed down to DD2. And DD2 going to friends DD. So feel relaxed.

DH away tomorrow night so can tackle it then. Although the way DD1 is probably stay at home all day as she's not well.

DH remarked how DD2 behaviour has improved remarkably over last week. (down to my regime of sleeps and reward charts etc)

Sorry felt like some self praise as don't get it anywhere else.

Can you play devils advocate with your DS as water will not trash anything?

Did you read what I put about hook and eye?

If DH doesn't agree with you it hard, but tellhim he must go up and you've finished work for night.

my DH is good although have let him deal with alot of behaviour so he can appreciate where I'm coming from.

Keep smiling,my SIL told me it does get better,and hers are 10 and 7.

chocciedooby · 09/02/2009 12:21

Hi Mrs Purple.

Sounds like you are getting very organised. Good for you for giving yourself some praise and for your dh to acknowledge that your hard work is paying off too

Yes, read about the hook and eye and dh is keen to do it. I am a little more reluctant right now as I feel that it may just push DS1 over the edge. I just can't decide but he does complain a lot at night about being lonely and sometimes frightened so putting a lock on his door could possibly only make matters worse?!.

He wasn't too bad last night. He fell asleep by about 9.15pm. I have tried telling dh that my work is over for the day and that I need to rest but he just doesn't seem to listen. Sorry for ranting. DH is normally very good but he doesn't seem to understand that I need to have some rest time in the evenings. My pregnancy seems to be swept under the carpet quite often. I think maybe thats a man thing. he was the same with other 2 pgs.

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MrsPurple · 09/02/2009 21:36

Hi Choccie how was your day?

How many weeks are you?

could you get your DH aman bump?

i've been to therapy session this afternoon, and am in agony from bladder spasms(as dr called it). Awaiting a referal.

Anyway DH away and due to my pain, I collected DC from inlaws (they go after school on a Monday).

Bathed them (no tantrum re washing hair by DD2 which is usually a big tantrum). and said if they were good and went to bed without complaining etc I would give them a treat for breakfast.

Don't usually resort to bribery but it seems to have worked . So am giving them brioche with choclate inside, not very healthy breakfast but needs must and it's a one off.

chocciedooby · 10/02/2009 15:10

Mrs Purple you are gas. I recently bought some chocolate brioche for my kids breakfast time but they don't see it as a treat as I do buy it every now and then . Hope DD liked it

Last night was a bad night

DS was great all day. A really well behaved boy and then bedtiome was a disaster! I just don't understand. He was pretty good getting ready into Pj's etc and even had his story and washed etc without any bother. Then as soon as I kissed him goodnight to come down stairs he started. Leaving his room, kicking up a fuss, refusing to go back to bed etc etc. The usual stressful experience.

DH got so fed up and DS played on pressing his buttons. He started hitting etc. Then he tried to get out of his bedroom window saying that we didn't love him so he was leaving I don't understand why he says this things as he gets plenty of love, hugs etc but still seems very insecure at times. I tried to ignore the horrible things he was saying and every time I returned him to bed it was quietly but just didn't work.

Anyway, DS then resorted to doing a big poo on the carpet .

dh went up and cleaned it up, told ds it was not acceptable etc etc but didn't lose his cool. DS was put back to bed. There is no end to what he will do for any kind of attnetion. He fell asleep about 10.15pm and we were both exhausted.

No offense but I have decided against using a lock on his bedroom door. I am going to try more bribery and sitting in my room for a while until I think he has settled. Oh the joys of bedtime .

When he woke up this morning it was like nothing had ever happened and he has been as good as gold all day.

OP posts:
chocciedooby · 12/02/2009 10:18

Hope you are feeling better Mrs purple. Sorry, I didn't manange to find your helth thread.

I forgot also to say that I am 22 weeks pg with dc3 so I am not as physically strong or able as I would normally be when ds1 kicks off.

He wasn't too bad last night. We have started to put ds2 to bed earlier and spend some time downstairs with ds1. He really enjoys having that extra attention. We then brought him up and read stories etc and tucked him in at about 8.45pm. He still didn't fall asleep last night until about 9.30pm but he didn't leave his room except to use the toilet.

We seem to get 1 good night and then 1 bad night so fingers crossed this improves. His behaviour during the day is better but we also have to stay prepared for anything! He was pretty stubburn this morning, wouldn't get up, get dressed, eat breakfast etc etc and I simply put uniform into a bag for his teacher and ignored him. After about 15 minutes he had calmed down and decided it was time to get dressed with my help. All in all though we seem to be coping with the days much better now.

Saying that, he did have a huge tantrum at soft play centre yesterday afternoon. Again I ignored him as it was all over which drink to choose. I walked away and he calmed down. He got a drink later on once he was behaving again.

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MrsPurple · 12/02/2009 12:51

HI Choccie

Not been on as been ill all week (roll on seeing consultant on Saturday as can't take much more pain)

Soundslike you seem to be making progess although in small steps, keep going it will get better.

my DD" seemed to improve but has starting beeing a complete nightmare at bedtime, the same as your DS. Both myself and DH not well so it just seemed to be twice as hard.

DC really are sent to try us.

p.s still done no ironing

chocciedooby · 12/02/2009 14:21

My ironing is sitting in the same pile it formed at the beginning of the week .

Sounds like you are having a rough time of it. I cannot imagine the pain that you are in but any pain is difficult to mamange when looking after small kids. I really hope you get some good results from consultant on Saturday and can get back on track.

Funny (not really) that your DD has been a nightmare at bedtime as well. I think they must be very clever and spotting the times that we are at our most tired and therefore vunerable.

I got 3 hours max sleep last night so not feeling too well myself. I have horrid head cold again. Still, I am not in any pain so should count myself lucky.

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MrsPurple · 12/02/2009 16:52

oh bless, I would say have a whiskey Toddy but as you're pregnant not a good idea .

got school disco in couple of hours for DD1 and not looking forward to it as pain and need toilet very quickly when need to go (if you get what I mean!)

DH got terrible eye infection - ahhhhhh the world seems to be falling apart . Surprising I'm not feeling depressed, which is what would normally happen. Tonight's plan is DH is cleaning (well making it presentable) whilst I go to school disco and share some ironing when I get back.

Lucky in that DH is supportive. God now I sound positive and not negative . Thank god it's half term tomorrow no early starts to day can live in PJ's all week.

What have you planned for hols to keep DC's amused?

MrsPurple · 12/02/2009 16:53

Just read message (I really must check it through before posting, how many faces can you get in one posting?)

MrsPurple · 12/02/2009 17:28

got this email made me initially laugh but makes sense.

Bedtime Battles

?And they lived happily ever after?The End.? Bedtime story read? Check! Water glass filled and secured? Check, Check! No monsters under the bed? Check! Good night hugs and kisses? Check! With the bedtime checklist complete, you can finally settle in for some peace and relaxation. That is, until you hear the wide awake chorus of, ?I have to go to the bathroom!? ?I?m hungry!? ?I?m not tired!?

Has bedtime become a nightmare for you? Read on for tips to make bedtime a sweet dream routine for both you and your kids

Bedtime Battles
The clock strikes ten and your energetic little one sits beside you wide-eyed and bushy-tailed. You are exhausted, why isn?t she? When you begin dreading bedtime as much as your kids do, you know you have a problem. Still, when it?s 2 a.m. and your sleepless child stands at the foot of your bed with tears, pleas, and a litany of excuses, how can you resist turning down the sheets and letting her crawl in with you? Sleep-deprived yourself, the simplest solution seems to be avoiding the arguments and scooting over. However, the next morning, everyone pays the price.

Thinking the late night bed times and wee-hour bed swaps have got to go, but have no idea how to change habits? JumpStart parents pipe in with some simple tips and tricks to help your kids sleep happily ever after night after night?in their own bed!

Establish a sweet dream routine- One Jumpstart mom suggests creating a "Bedtime Chart" to help your child visualize the pajama process. Create a large poster with illustrations of each step involved in sleepy time. Items to include on the list might be: putting on PJs, having a pre-sleep snack, brushing teeth, reading a bedtime story, using the restroom, switching on the night-light, time for cuddling and kisses, and lastly, sweet dreaming. The chart might use stickers or checkmarks as an incentive for completing each step. Be sure to post the chart in your child?s bedroom at eye-level so the steps soon become a sweet dream routine.

Let your child be the decorator- Taking pride in his slumber space is one of the first steps to ensuring your little one will stay put all night long. You may want to consider letting him help decorate or maybe even pick out special bedding or a theme for his room. You and your child can work together to arrange the furniture and hang pictures to make the space unique and special just for him. The more your child likes his room, the more apt he is to stay there- even into the wee morning hours.

Be creative and make bedtime fun- Spice up the sleepy routine bedtime often brings by thinking outside the box to keep your kids inside their beds. Airplane and piggyback rides will have your kids lining up for the next departure. Final destination? Their bed, of course! If you have an anxious little one who worries about monsters and the boogie man, whip up some ?monster or safe sleep spray? to spray around the bedroom before the lights go out. Sing a silly song together while you tuck in and turn out the lights. Lightly rub your child?s back or draw letters or numbers on it for her to guess while she drifts off to dreamland.

Okay, so now that you?ve gotten her into bed on time, how to you make sure she stays there?

First, it?s important to consider: What's really happening?
Take into account the reason behind your child?s late night escapes and solve the problem based on this reason. For example, maybe your child isn't tired and is ready for a later bedtime, maybe she's hungry and needs to eat a larger dinner or a light pre-bedtime snack, maybe she hasn't had enough time with you and is longing for some "cuddle time," or maybe there?s something on her mind that needs to be discussed before she settles down for the night. Once you diagnose the problem, the solution will definitely be in sight.

Be Clear and Concise- When you don?t have a plan for them, they?ll surely have a plan for you! Established bedtime routines and rules will eliminate the negotiation process kids often try to start. If you and your child are clear about how bedtime works, it will work that way without any issues or questions asked.

That's the Ticket! If you have a child whose head fills up with questions, excuses, or fears as soon as it hits the pillow, maybe this will be the ticket to keeping him tucked in. When you put your child to bed, give him a set (most parents recommend no more than three) of ?Get-Out-Of-Bed-Free? cards. These cards, easily constructed out of tag board or cardboard, will limit the number of excuses and times he?ll leave his bed. Let him know that each time he gets out of bed, no matter what the reason, he?ll need a ticket. A drink of water, a potty predicament, a question, etc. will cost him one card. When all of the tickets are gone, he?s out of luck and needs to stay in bed. Getting out of bed when all the cards are gone, results in NO cards the next night.

Follow these suggestions to increase the sleep around your house and restful nights will be in sight!

MrsPurple · 12/02/2009 17:29

sorry link is www.jumpstart.com/FunForParent/JSTime.aspx?id=3092for future reference.

chocciedooby · 13/02/2009 10:11

That e mail is soooo funny. I never have a problem getting DS to bed but keeping him there can be another matter. I don't think the chart will work (too many charts on the go already and bedtime is a big part of it).

I like the ticket idea but again (trying hard not to sound too negative) I reckon DS would push it past the 3rd ticket every time and would not care too much about not getting tickets the next night. I suppose its worth bearing it in mind and maybe giving it a go.

DS was ok last night but did not sleep until 10.30pm. I know that he was very excited abuot going to school this morning as they have a cake sale and we spent all yesterday afternoon baking for it. He was so looking forward to buying cakes for all of us which is very sweet but it kept him awake very late.Was looking forward to going out with dh tonight for a meal and leaving the bedtime stuff to the baby sitter but I have rotten cold and think I may have to cancel now

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MrsPurple · 13/02/2009 11:44

know what you mean about charts etc, DD2 was also ok going to bed, but she did have some time on own with DH as I went to school disco with DD1.

Go out tonight you'll enjoy it once you get there. .

wish I could get a babysitter, do struggle as most friends have kids and don't want to swap babysitting as they don't really go out.

Mind you don't think I could face going out till sorted out gyny problem.

Let me know how you get on tonight.