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Original poster

Please help to avoid CantSleepWontSleep's 21 month old dd being exiled from toddler group!

128 replies

CantSleepWontSleep · 13/11/2007 17:21

We were 'spoken to' after toddler group today, and told that several people had noticed that dd is quite 'robust' (a diplomatic way of putting it!), and could I keep more of an eye on her at group, as they didn't want her to put people off coming .

She's a boisterous 21 month old, but was an early walker and has good speech for her age, so I wonder if the other mothers think that she is older than she is, and thus expect more discipline.

Today she bopped another child (who herself went through a similar phase a few months ago, when she was already over 2) on the head with a musical shaker thing. It was unprovoked (and didn't look malicious), but I was 2 inches away when it happened, so can't see how 'keeping an eye on her' is going to help.

I think that possibly the other mother expected me to take a similar approach to the one that she had (time out and made to say sorry), and because I didn't (don't feel it is appropriate at this age) she thinks that I am letting dd get away with it (which to an extent I suppose I am, but I did tell her firmly that it was wrong).

I don't think (or certainly hope) that the group leader would have spoken to me if other parents hadn't chipped in with other comments though.

So, the point of my post, is to ask how I should deal with this? What age appropriate action can I take that will pacify the other parents, but not unnecessarily traumatise dd or make toddler group an unenjoyable experience for both of us?

Sorry for length of post - has been annoying/upsetting me all day and wanted to get relevant info down.

OP posts:
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onebatCaoilfhionn · 14/11/2007 14:08

realistically, i think it would take more bravery than i actually have not to offer the sop of 'sorry, a bit of a phase at the mo' to anxious mother of latest victim of my darling bully.

FluffyMummy123 · 14/11/2007 14:10

Message withdrawn

hunkermunker · 14/11/2007 14:10

OK, CSWS

Cod, that's different - CSWS is clearly not yakking away, oblivious to her DD.

Original poster
CantSleepWontSleep · 14/11/2007 14:11

Oh yes, I always apologise to the other parent myself onebat. In fact it was only because I apologised and told the other mother what had happened that she knew that dd had bopped her dd, as she wasn't watching!

OP posts:
FluffyMummy123 · 14/11/2007 14:11

Message withdrawn

FluffyMummy123 · 14/11/2007 14:12

Message withdrawn

Original poster
CantSleepWontSleep · 14/11/2007 14:13

Hence the thread fishy one!
(and I'm not with her all the time normally, but I was on this occasion).

OP posts:
Original poster
CantSleepWontSleep · 14/11/2007 14:13

There were witnesses .

OP posts:
FluffyMummy123 · 14/11/2007 14:14

Message withdrawn

Original poster
CantSleepWontSleep · 14/11/2007 14:15

But she's perfectly normal cod, so locking her in the house for a few months would be ridiculous!

OP posts:
Original poster
CantSleepWontSleep · 14/11/2007 14:17

But yes, I will certainly watch her more closely throughout for the next few weeks (as long as necessary), which will probably lead to me being moaned at for not helping out with any of the clearing up instead .

OP posts:
FluffyMummy123 · 14/11/2007 14:18

Message withdrawn

onebatmother · 14/11/2007 14:20

have to say your tg sounds bloody grim csws!
Ours is (fairly)relaxed but have heard they vary immensely.

Original poster
CantSleepWontSleep · 14/11/2007 14:32

I thought that this one was relaxed too (if a little difficult to break into the inner circle), but I think they all just think I'm a bit odd because I asked if we could have dolly mixtures instead of smarties in the bowl of cornflakes for messy day (dd milk intolerant), I still breastfeed, and, worst of all, I'm not going to send dd to the village school [hippy snob].

OP posts:
CoteDAzur · 14/11/2007 17:36

Sorry if this offended you, but a kid just cannot whack another on the head with a toy if you are right next to her AND watching her 'like a hawk'. You catch her raised hand. You pull her away. You do everything but let the other kid get banged on the head with a hard object.

I am not saying you are negligent. But I am saying that your perception of how well you keep an eye on your DD during toddler group is slightly disconnected from reality. Case in point: You were told to 'keep an eye' on your daughter. Obviously, others do not agree that you are 'watching her like a hawk'.

Original poster
CantSleepWontSleep · 14/11/2007 19:12

CDA - you still seem to be entirely misquoting me. If you re-read the thread you will see that at no point have I said that I do watch her like a hawk, but that I will have to watch her like a hawk for the foreseeable future.

There was no raised hand in the incident in question. The other girl knelt on the floor with her head an inch or two above the level of the table that dd had been happily banging on for some time. One of her ensuing bangs was on the girl's head - simple as that. No different motion, no glance to show intent, nothing - just bop.

OP posts:
lazygirl · 14/11/2007 19:36

I think its not woth going to a group if you feel you have to be witthin inches of your child and flinching everytiome she approaches another child. sounds waaay too stressful for me. I think that toddlers get hurt and hurt others sometimes, intentionally or not. I don't see it as neglectful parenting I think its because they are put in a room with other human beings. and toddlers more than most are not fully aware of their own bodies or strength. You explain to be careful and express sympathy with bumped tot.

kindersurprise · 14/11/2007 19:52

CSWS
Can you clarify something please? I got the impression from your OP and subsequent post that your DD does not go around bashing and bopping other toddlers all day.

I think that some of the comments on this thread are, like the reaction of the mothers at the playgroup, a bit ott. I liked the comment about the disiplining being more for the mothers of the boppees, never thought of it that way.

FGS, children of this age test their boundaries, some more than others. As long as your DD is not bopping toddlers left, right and centre then everyone needs to chill a bit.

CoteDAzur · 14/11/2007 19:59

I just reread and yes, I did misunderstand what you were saying

Original poster
CantSleepWontSleep · 14/11/2007 20:21

No worries CDA.

kinder - no she doesn't bop and bash all day long - she likes to take a break to eat and sleep .

But seriously, no, she's not. She'll try and keep hold of her toys for dear life whenever anyone tries to take them off her, but other than that, it's an occasional thing. Some days she might try it 2 or 3 times, other times she'll go a week without doing it at all.

OP posts:
Flame · 14/11/2007 20:23

It is my child that is the thug

VeniVidiVickiQV · 14/11/2007 21:12

OH no no no no. Tis my DS that is the thug. He repeatedly barged another child maybe a few months old out of his way today at the docs. Not maliciously, but, just because he deemed the other child an obstacle and that's how he deals with all obstacles.

He then snatched a book off the boy. He was swiftly removed for a minute and told to "play nicely" and "share" or he will not play. It seemed to work.

HairyToe · 14/11/2007 21:26

I think boisterous behaviour especially around the 'sharing' issue is pretty normal at that age. However I have an issue with a girl of a similar age to the OP's who constantly pushes DD2 over for nor reason. DD2 can be happily playing by herself and the other girl will make a beeline for her and push or hit her. She even attacks her when I am holding her on my lap! Apparently she does it to loads of kids. The mum is aware and does say 'No' but doesn't really follow it up and it is still really upsetting to see DD2 frightened and upset and feel unable to let her wander off for fear of being shoved. I end up holding her on my lap and restricting her play whereas surely it should be the aggressive child who is restricted?

looneytune · 14/11/2007 21:54

Not read whole thread but I'd say yes, this is normal behaviour for this age but the reason the people at toddler group were probably upset is because of the lack of dealing with it (if I've got that right?). I'm a childminder and would you believe that when I first started, my ds was a biter It was HORRIBLE going to groups and I was worried he had the nick name 'Jaws' But because I knew what he was like, I watched him like a hawk and if he did ANYTHING out of order like that, I would IMMEDIATELY deal with it, remove him from the situation and make it perfectly clear how unacceptable it was! If he continued, we'd leave group, that simple. He had to learn the consequences of his actions! Now, it became difficult when I had mindees with me but luckily the little girl I looked after at the time LOVED going to the park and so was absolutely happy when we left on those occasions, and ds would stay in his pushchair for a short time whilst she played happily with me. Yes, it might sound cruel to some people but it worked quite quickly and whenever he said sorry and meant it, he'd get a lot of praise and we'd chat about it. Ok, he was about 5/6 months older than your DD but I think at 21 months, you can at least remove them from the situation.

We have someone at toddler group whose kids actually make parents leave when they arrive, it's quite worrying what her boys get up to. The younger one once went up to then 6 month old mindee (just sat happily right near me) and looked at her, 'aimed' and kicked her in the stomach!! I was mortified. The thing is, the mother purposely doesn't look at them when they are playing, prefers to drink coffee and chat to sort of forget about it I think. EVERYONE else tells them not to xyz and when we tell her, she rewards him with a cuddle!! AND....she's a childminder aswell - I'll NEVER recommend her to anyone I can tell you. She's a nice person but she needs to sort her boys out. One must be near 4 and he's terrible still. This woman lets her toddler in the 'baby' section with lots of young babies in there and he throws toys hard and it's scary - a lot of us cling to the little ones and don't let them down to play Oh...and her one and only mindee started playing up like this and she said 'oh, he's learnt from the master' all casually and in front of her ds!

Sorry, went on a bit there.....I know this is different as you are watching, just hit a nerve I suppose as she does NOTHING and that's what gets the gossip going. I arrived on Monday and was so relaxed and was enjoying group and then they arrived and my heart went as did many others!!

As long as you're seen to be doing something about the situation, they'll be fine

TheMags · 15/11/2007 09:55

Just wanted to add I also have a "little thug". DS1 is 2.3 years and has been going through an aggressive stage since about 18 months. When he was younger I used to go down to his level tell him off, apologise to the parent and the child and take him away. Now hes older I do the same but have added in an apology from DS to the hurt child. I'm not sure whether he really understands why he is apologising but he is at least doing it. I do thing this helps other parents recognise you are trying to do something about their behaviour.

I also had my first experience of actually leaving a group the other day. DS1 was jumping on other childrens backs (really have no idea why!) and making them cry. This was totally unexceptable so when my telling off etc didnt stop him I just left the group. I shall miss next weeks session then try again the week after but if he does it again I wont go back - lifes too short for the stress! I also have a 7 month old and its really hard catching DS1 when I'm holding DS2!