slapping or no slapping?

[Vindaloo]

I am a single mum, DD is 2 and half years now. She's a live wire and just being a normal cheeky toddler really. I have found myself slapping her on her bottom or raising my voice when trying to dicipline her. I always assumed I would be a chilled out mum, but I suppose being a single parent with DDs father choosing to play no part in her life and family living far away doesnt help. I hate it and it really upsets me and I feel so guilty and crap about slapping/shouting. I think I have some anger management issues. Any advice on what I should do? where to go for help?

No, elibean, you don't sound smug and I agree totally. My dd1 is very laid back and only really needs a hug to be 'filled', as it were. Dd2 is much less affectionate on the surface but needs a lot more attention for her to feel secure. It means that when she kicks off at the back of it there is her insecurity and her testing of us - she has been through it lately with illness. It's so hard to get the balance between meeting each of their needs (plus baby ds) and giving both dds equal attention.

Kittywits, you say smacking didn't do you any harm, but it did, because you have grown into an adult who thinks hitting someone smaller and defenceless -and who you undoubtably love - is a good thing.

So tell me this. What does smacking teach your child? Does it teach them how to deal with someone doing something they don't like? ('If I don't like it I hit them and it stops'?) Does it teach them which behaviour is good, or does it merely show which behaviour is wrong?

I totally agree there needs to be more discipline. Smacking is bullying, not discipline. The problem with the majority of kids who cause problems is that they've never been given any love, never given any boundaries, which is why they have so little love for themselves that they are unable to empathise and are often capable of great cruelty. Love and discipline go hand in hand. There is no such thing as a loving smack, even if you believe there is.

"I have not yet said that anyone's methods are rubbish." by kittywits

"many of the discipline methods described here amount to psychological abuse" by kittywits

It's only my opinion of course, but I think you talk out of your arse, kittywits

Nearlythere, that's your view and of course you're entitled to it. my view is that smacking did me no harm because i do not think there is anything wrong with it! i wasn't somehow brain damaged during the process so that I have a warped view of the world you know .
You think there is. Yet again no one is "correct" here, it is only opinion.
What does smacking teach your child? Er discipline!!
What does shutting your child out of a room teach them, or actually putting them outside even when it's cold teach them? Time out? Now THAT's abusive in my book.
yes more boundaries are needed. More love, perhaps for some, but with the ill disciplined I know, theyve got bags of love, it's just completley misplaced.

Smacking can't teach discipline. Discipline means (roughly) 'to show the way'. So by smacking all you can ever be doing is showing that smacking (i.e force) is the way to get what you want.

For the record I have never timed out a child in the cold! I've timed out dd1 twice when she endangered dd2 as a baby. That's it, in four and a half yrs. I prefer either timing myself out (I leave and come back when they have calmed down) ot taking time out together (we all go outside, or have a change of activity). I also label my feelings - I say 'I am so angry!'rather than 'You nasty girl'. Maybe it's luck but neither dds are aggressive and I've never felt the need to hit. When I have shouted at them it's been because of my own weakness and I have apologised.

Unquestioning obedience to adults is a dangerous thing to teach a child. I am teaching mine to question everything and everyone, including me.

I think its all about personal choice and essentially where the discipline is coming from (and thats any type of discipline, smacking or non) - if its because you lose control or you're doing it out of spite to the child then its wrong whether its smacking, locking a child in a cupboard etc.
If its to keep the child within boundaries previously laid down or prevent dangerous results etc then I believe any type of discipline for those reasons has its place.
I was smacked as a child and the only smacks I remember are those that were given to me in fits of tiredness, anger, loss of control because I didn't understand and felt so attacked by it. I don't remember the ones where I'd actually done something seriously wrong because they were over and done with in an instant and I understood what was going on.
Non smacking discipline can be just as harmful as smacking if it is meted out for the wrong reasons.

Stop picking on kittywits.

There's a bunch of gang-bullies operating on mumsnet at the moment.

Therealcam, what you say is very true. There are alot of gestapo like operators on mumsnet.

I've seen people on other threads complaining about them.
Greensleeves is one of those, that goes without saying. I always find it truely amazing that those who bang on endlessly about peace love and understanding are usually the most inpleaseant and aggresive too with a zero tolerance attitude to anything they don't agree with!

I realise I have got duped into having a conversation with them because they never have anything of worth to contribute. It's all about shouting others down with differing views and patting each other on the back. I just know to never to enter into a conversation with certain people the future.

Thanks for your input though

What a rude and unnecessary post Kittywits. I have noticed you generally like to make personal attacks against people who disagree with your point of view.

Blimey.
A dingdong that doesn't involve moi.

Is it too late to join in?

I would call it a timely and necessary post.

Ok so going back to the OP......again!!!! Come on guys lets not turn this into a mud slinging match as thats not what this is about. We all have our opinions and don't need to make it personal.

By the way where is Vindaloo???

It's always unnecessary to discuss another poster in a spiteful way because you don't agree with them. If you have a problem with Greensleeves, do her the courtesy of addressing her personally, and not talking about her in a high handed manner as if she were not here.

Kitty, laugh and walk away, I'll come with you.

Greensleeves, "What a lot of rubbish you talk, kitty".
Greensleeves again, "Thankfully your views represent a dwindling lunatic fringe".
Greensleeves yet again, "It's only my opinion of course, but I think you talk out of your arse, kittywits".

Who was it who is rude again Franny? Isn't the above nothing other than abuse?

Hi guys

I think its true in my case that when I loose it with DD (I mean shouting or the occasional smack, which I do want to stop!!) its usually because its about me being tired/stressed etc. So I have taken some of the comments on board and it seems to diffuse my initial anger, which results in no smacking or shouting.

Just wanted to let you know that today I went to the gym, and have maintained a fairly calm mood all day. I think even DD has noticed!

God it must be great to have a clam child, mine bounces off the walls.

I have come to the conclusion that the smackers and non smackers need to mud wrestle naked and get it all out of their system, you both seem to have issues

Clam child? LOL

'dwindling lunatic fringe' is very funny actually.

oops..

As a non-smacker I couldn't possibly condone wrestling AngelaC

Hey good to see your still here!! Glad you've been able to take some action to help in feeling calmer and even more so that you're finding its helping. See whenever I voice my concern about my little ones hyperness I get told better that than be a wallflower - i have to say I disagree at the moment!!!

Hope you're only going to use it to describe a hairstyle though Moondog

FGS.

From reading most of this thread (but not all) I have gathered that a lot of mum's out there deduce smacking is nothing short of child abuse?