Does anyone else want to come and be a better parent with me?

[AnotherMonkey]

I've just deleted my original post in an attempt to be more positive.

I'm very low tonight, both of mine (4.5 and nearly 2) are pushing me so far beyond my limits at the moment.

So instead of posting my rant of misery, I wondered if anyone felt like joining me in choosing one thing to be less crap at at time?

Tomorrow, I am going to begin by taking it all less seriously. I'm going to try really really hard not to shout at all (this is difficult because DS is deaf at the moment and often does things which are not safe or bloody annoying but I'm going to find ways around it if I can). Essentially I'm going to try to take a step back and instead of letting poor behaviour bring me down, I'm going to try to isolate problems so that they can be dealt with. I might even make a list. I like lists.

(This evening was so bad I never want to see my neighbours again. I'm quiet, smart and even tempered in real life. Tonight our house must have sounded like a war zone. Or the screaming toddler equivalent. It's shit and it has to change).

Hello. New to mn and chanced on this thread. My children are older now (12, 13 & 24) and still challenging. The issues alter as they grow but I think teenagers and toddlers share a "physically maturing, full emotional range but just catching up with the appropriate and articulate expression of those emotions" kind of issues; as well as the "desperate to be independent but also want to be precious baby" issues. So the work you do now in developing 'calm down' tactics for yourselves and routes to independence for your children will be useful again in 10+ years time, and forever! It's been interesting to read your experiences and try to remember those days. Vague memories come back, not all good. I completely take my hat off to you all. It's relentless and relentlessly challenging and these little people are Hard Work. I love that this is here so you can communicate and support each other. The book that I have found the most helpful has been 'how to talk so kids will listen and listen so kids will talk' I think my relationship with my eldest (and her experience of childhood) would have been better had I read that when she was young. If brought up with a traditional ' you'll do it because I say so' parenting style you need help when writing a new script for yourself if you decide that is not how you want to do it. Oh, and the most useful simple piece of advice I've been given was: if you ask a child a question give them enough time to think of an answer before saying ANYTHING else. Ten full seconds. Count them. It seems like a long time to wait but their brain has a lot of work to do to listen, understand, think what the answer is, put words in order and say them. Saves a lot of frustration. Good luck and hugs to you all x

Letsgoforawalk - thanks so much for that post. The encouragement really helps and knowing that you survived it also helps a lot!

Monkey - you have really got into the swing of it and you are doing so well. Thanks for the advice about the staggered bedtime. That is actually what we had been doing for the last week and half the week it worked really well because DS1 got the alone time and then by the time we put him to bed DS2 was sleeping. After Day 3 it started to not work so well because he was all tactics to keep me in the room and started to make a lot of noise. A couple of times DS2 was still awake or woke up and then it turned into a usual bedtime. Still - it is the right way and certainly gives us the time to attend to them individually which they both really need. Also meant to say that the story about your DD the other day wanting everything exactly so is so much what DS2 is like it's uncanny!

Blueeye - it's definitely an attention thing. I think he doesn't get enough one on one time so it def helps but easier to do it when he's calm than thrashing about.

Jigglebum - hugs. That sounds very tough but you are doing so well working on it (albeit by yourself). And the dummy story is also just like my DS2... they are on a mission to drive us nuts

Today I was determined to make it work out better and get a grip of myself. I can concentrate on more than one thing at once so therefore I can not shout and still be firm and make sure that my children know where there boundaries are. I told my husband he could go out for the evening if he wanted to get a break but he chose to stay until after the little one went to bed (bless him). DS1 and I had a good bedtime (after an awful bathtime). He is not in his bed, he is in mine but (this is funny) he took himself to my room himself and brought his teddy because his brother is snoring so loudly (which he was - must have a cold!). He also took himself to the toilet and never made a sound. He has just called me and I've had to go and ask him to go to sleep but I can handle that when there is no screaming or fighting. I'll transfer him to his bed later. You have to laugh really.

That's a good tip about waiting 10 seconds for a response, letsgo.

Nellie - I'm always amazed that DS1 can sleep through DS2's snoring!

Woohoo! Made it to school without any yelling every day this week.

I know that being rushed and disorganised is a big trigger for me, so have been getting one boy through the bathroom and dressed at a time. Stops them distracting each other and driving me potty with their mucking about. (Just being normal small boys!) As a result we've been heading out 5 mins earlier and far less stressed.

Next challenge is to make it as far as tea time...

Nellie, great attitude! Keeping humour in the picture really helps. Well done
Blue, school mornings without yelling. A challenge met!
The waiting thing can be magical, i need to remember to do it with my older girls. The first time I tried it I was astounded how much more info I got. If you get a one word answer, wait again with expectation ( say nothing, count silently...) and sometimes a whole other splurge of lovely info comes out
Mum: Did you like the firework display?
(Waits)
Child: Yes
(Waits again, child remembers and thinks)
Child: I really likes the ones that went up up up high and then made a really big huge ball of colour in the sky. The were my favourite but I don't like the really bangy ones and I like the one that went round and round in one place. What was your favourite mummy?

It was a long time ago and I forget the exact words but that is pretty much the gist of what happened when I was discovering the 'wait 10 seconds' trick. Sunny here today! Hope it is where you are. That helps too!

Nellie, I can't believe how far you've come with bedtimes. That's just brilliant. And so funny! That's pretty grown up of him though, it was a thoughtful way to deal with the problem!

Blue - you've done it! Fantastic :)

Letsgo thanks for posting - great tip about leaving some time to think.

I could do with people's thoughts on this if you have any advice. I mentioned upthread that DS was having some meltdowns, so far they've basically been much like a tantrum if he hasn't had his own way.

This morning, it reached a whole new level. DH had bought a twin pack of toothbrushes. He gave the yellow one to DD, but DS had told me earlier that was the one he wanted. DD had spent 15 mins with the toothbrush in her mouth (she loves cleaning her teeth...) and she is a snot monster. I told DS they could swap if he really wanted but didn't he want the superhero toothbrush (blue and red). Yes he did. But he also wanted the fire toothbrush. But... he wanted them both. I felt so sorry for him, you could see that he actually was trying to make a decision but was getting so confused. Then DD wandered past with the offending toothbrush, he kicked her really hard, realised what he'd done (he's been trying so hard) and it all went downhill from there. But it was like a rage this morning, proper anger, sobbing tears, he broke one of our small chairs throwing it in the kitchen, threw a toy plane at DDs face, I got hit, it was horrible. I managed to stay really calm and the plane was confiscated, which was horrible for him because it's really special to him. In he end I took him to where he used to sit for time out (simply because I needed somewhere he couldn't hurt anyone or break anything) but I sat with him until he calmed down.

At the end of it all, he was very huggy, gave me a huge kiss and told me he loved me on the way to school.

I have no idea if I handled this in the right way. I am certain he couldn't control the emotions this morning and he needed support to get through that. I'm not sure if the sanction (removal of the plane) was enough given that there was so much else damaged or hit.

Please tell me what you think.

The weekend is nagging at me. It's been such a positive week here overall, but I do feel a bit frayed at the moment.

A very feeble hello here, not doing well at all. A conbination of dts at home most of the week, sleepless nights, dh working very late and superstressed at work has been lethal.

I really do not like myself much these days.

Sorry for short, depressing update but I get v. Little time to sit down and think coherently

((((((Claires)))))))) that does not sound like fun at all :(

Hope you're ok. Is it too early to send ... I can definitely send you xx

I'm going to be honest and admit that I'm feeling a bit shit today too. My focus is to encourage positive behaviour in my DCs by using a respect-based approach, and that does mean keeping check of my own behaviour.

This week I've stuck to that, and I know that there has been a lot of good to come out of it. But bloody hell it's been hard work. And takes a whole other level of planning and research and thought and time.

And I am shattered. I feel like I'm getting by at work by the seat of my pants, I don't have anything like the level of organisation I should. I'm tired of trying to keep on top of a very basic level of housework. I'm so exhausted by the evening that I'm not getting any time to just be in my own headspace at all. I keep thinking 'this isn't sustainable' but that's tough because there isn't anything which is movable. I have a work event tonight and people will be drinking and I love a drink. But the thought of doing the weekend with a hangover is not a happy one. And I have nothing to wear because the trousers I ordered don't fit and I never get time to go shopping.

Blah blah sob sob. Just feeling a bit rubbish today.

Sounds like you have a lot on your hands anothermonkey.

Not sure why keeping on top of the housework is important to developing the kind of relationship you are trying to vultivate with your children.
Do you work full time?
When you say a "basic level of housework" what does that actually entail? Everyone has a different idea of "basic" - is there room for some slippage there?
I don't own an iron and I dust once in a blue moon- for me basic is keeping sinks, toilets, fridges and food preparation areas clean.

You are right about your own behaviour, it will be reflected in your children, and they are more likely to pick up on your stress and act up.
My kids are like barometers, the more chilled I am then the more easy going they become, so I concentrate of keeping myself in a good stressfree place. For me that's abandoning housework and going to the gym/yoga 3 or 4 times a week- the kids come home from school to a slightly messy house but with a happy Mum who is in the zone.

Hugs to you Claire's TC. Hope things improve soon.
Monkey, it sounds like you coped extremely well with the major meltdown and the overall outcome was good. Hugs, calm going to school etc. the thing that maybe to do different ( and from how you described it I suspect you already know this as you described his confusion...) was the 'choice' that he could swop if he really wanted. It might have worked into his way of seeing things more easily if you'd acknowledged that you remembered that he'd told you he wanted the yellow one. ( it shows you were paying attention and that is sometimes enough...) But then gone into a silly ' oh no it's covered in girl germs now eeeugh ... ' routine and let him see that the superhero brush was going to be the only way forward (no options...cos swopping wasn't really an option that made sense was it?) with a "it's disappointing but I know you can deal with disappointment being such a superhero" kind of attitude.
It's easy for me to say this. I wasn't there. The meltdown might have happened anyway even with that, sometimes they just wake up primed to go boom. Good luck with the next one, sometimes it's about learning to accept that, as Mick Jagger said 'you can't always get what you want..'

Atthestroke - it's slightly relevant in the sense that keeping things out of the way reduces tantrums (for example DD has food separation anxiety at the moment - really - and this morning a tantrum over the breakfast I was clearing could've been avoided if I'd done it a cpl of hours earlier at the usual time). But in truth, that last post was about me, not the DCs. My basic level is slightly below yours but it takes so much time with messy little ones.

You're right though about time for yourself being important too. That was my New Years resolution and it's not going at all to plan.

Thanks letsgo. In retrospect, I think you're right - I like the silliness :) that's a really good tactic.

Re housework 'basic level' settings. Aaahhhh, I can relax, I'm amongst friends.

Monkey - that meltdown sounds very much like DS1's meltdown last night in the bath. I won't go into it but I think I dealt with it in the same way as you, firm and with consequences but kind and holding him till he calmed down. I focused on us both fltrying to solve the problems, mine (him needing to apologise for hitting DS2) and his (wanting to have a bath which I had taken him out of). It lead on to a great bedtime. Well done to us both for holding it together. Mood wise, I was where you describe the night before last and I think it's ok to have a shit day. But don't dwell in it and let it go. Which is what I tried to do last night too.
Claires - I'm so sorry. You sound exhausted. Will be thinking of you.
Letsgo - the point about letting them know you thought about it and empathising is something I am trying to make a reall effort with at the moment. It seems to really help.
Blueeye - amazing, you should be proud!
Hope you all have a great weekend.

Tbh I think I'll feel better when tonight's over - what I really want to be doing is drinking wine on my sofa in my pjs and getting myself in the right frame of mind for a great weekend with my DCs!

Nellie we're learning so much. I love that there are people here to share it with.

Sounds like everyone is doing well (even without partner help at times!) MIL now gone home - DD is much better behaved for her, which partly is nice to see she can do and partly frustrating that she obviously can avoid tantrums (as at the park yesterday when we actually left for the first time EVER without tantrum) but doesn't see the need to impress us.
Not been able to shout with MIL in attendance. Be interesting to see if all the tension has built up and I have a shouty meltdown later. Hope not!

I think it can be easier without partners help sometimes!

My OH works away a lot and long hours when he is home. When the kids were young they could go weeks without seeing him. Gave me free reign to parent as I saw fit. My food choices, my way of guiding begaviour, my bedtimes. OH is often the one winding them up with exciting games before bedtime. The house runs like clockwithout him here.

Thanks everyone I AM exhausted.
Two years of broken sleep and counting, we've recently moved and I have very few friends (as in 2) whom I see rarely. No family nearby. 4 dcs (12,9 and twin 2 year olds).
Always do bedtime on my own, dts are hard to get to sleep and more often that not I end up falling asleep with them which means no evening.
The dts are at nursery 4 hrs a day but i find they all go in shopping, housework, laundry.
I don't mean to go on a self-pitying trip, just trying to explain why I find it so hard.

Getting them in the car or to go upstairs, or changing nappies, getting dressed. These all turn into battles with one or the other. I try to make it fun, give choices, be empathic, but it doesn't seem to work. I really need advice on coping strategies and hiw to avoid snapping when it all gets too much.

I realise I'm not giving out much help on this thread, I wish I had better advice to give, but I feel rather helpless myself.

I do want to stop the shouting, I hate it, I want a better relatioship with my children.

Thanks for the support everyone.

ClairesTC - I am in awe of anyone who can manage twins (let alone with other children as well) so please don't be hard on yourself. It must be exhausting, especially without much support.

I really like that 10 second tip and am definitely going to try it. I do jump in with another question before they've had a chance to answer sometimes.

anothermonkey DS has rages like that sometimes, when a "red mist" seems to descend and he is not in control of his anger. I am not sure how to handle it really - I often send him to his room to allow him to have space away from people to calm down but I wonder if a big hug would actually be more effective. I might try that next time.

No shouting her today but had to be very firm with DS but didn't need to shout. He was in a really silly mood (the in laws pick him up from school on Fridays and as I have mentioned before are rather lax with behaviour) I know they think I am far too strict! My mum thinks I am not strict enough!

It is very hard to get time and head space for yourself isn't it but I definitely parent better when I am happy and have had a chance for a break - it just doesn't always happen.

ClairesTC - I am in awe of anyone who can manage twins (let alone with other children as well) so please don't be hard on yourself. It must be exhausting, especially without much support.

I really like that 10 second tip and am definitely going to try it. I do jump in with another question before they've had a chance to answer sometimes.

anothermonkey DS has rages like that sometimes, when a "red mist" seems to descend and he is not in control of his anger. I am not sure how to handle it really - I often send him to his room to allow him to have space away from people to calm down but I wonder if a big hug would actually be more effective. I might try that next time.

No shouting her today but had to be very firm with DS but didn't need to shout. He was in a really silly mood (the in laws pick him up from school on Fridays and as I have mentioned before are rather lax with behaviour) I know they think I am far too strict! My mum thinks I am not strict enough!

It is very hard to get time and head space for yourself isn't it but I definitely parent better when I am happy and have had a chance for a break - it just doesn't always happen.

ClairesTC - I am in awe of anyone who can manage twins (let alone with other children as well) so please don't be hard on yourself. It must be exhausting, especially without much support.

I really like that 10 second tip and am definitely going to try it. I do jump in with another question before they've had a chance to answer sometimes.

anothermonkey DS has rages like that sometimes, when a "red mist" seems to descend and he is not in control of his anger. I am not sure how to handle it really - I often send him to his room to allow him to have space away from people to calm down but I wonder if a big hug would actually be more effective. I might try that next time.

No shouting her today but had to be very firm with DS but didn't need to shout. He was in a really silly mood (the in laws pick him up from school on Fridays and as I have mentioned before are rather lax with behaviour) I know they think I am far too strict! My mum thinks I am not strict enough!

It is very hard to get time and head space for yourself isn't it but I definitely parent better when I am happy and have had a chance for a break - it just doesn't always happen.

ClairesTC - I am in awe of anyone who can manage twins (let alone with other children as well) so please don't be hard on yourself. It must be exhausting, especially without much support.

I really like that 10 second tip and am definitely going to try it. I do jump in with another question before they've had a chance to answer sometimes.

anothermonkey DS has rages like that sometimes, when a "red mist" seems to descend and he is not in control of his anger. I am not sure how to handle it really - I often send him to his room to allow him to have space away from people to calm down but I wonder if a big hug would actually be more effective. I might try that next time.

No shouting her today but had to be very firm with DS but didn't need to shout. He was in a really silly mood (the in laws pick him up from school on Fridays and as I have mentioned before are rather lax with behaviour) I know they think I am far too strict! My mum thinks I am not strict enough!

It is very hard to get time and head space for yourself isn't it but I definitely parent better when I am happy and have had a chance for a break - it just doesn't always happen.

Ok - sorry bit of a glitch - obviously didn't mean to post it 4 times!

Claire's TC me too, totally in awe. It sounds like a tough time at the mo. How helpful are the older children? A 'team' (you and the eldest 2) that includes an enthusiastic on board 12 and 9 year old is going to more effective than one knackered adult trying to manage 4 children. (Herding cats springs to mind) it might be worth some energy investment getting more cooperation from the big ones. (Responsibility bringing rewards?).

Jiggle bum your post made me laugh, especially the bit about the in laws and everyone's opinions (too strict, too lax etc) been there done that got the t shirt, and matching socks.

:) jigglebum! The contrasting opinions made me laugh too.

So I'm on 5 now. Tonight was interesting. DH was in charge this eve, I was getting ready to go out. But he was really stressed about work stuff pinging into his email at the same time and he was impatient and snappy with the DCs.

This had two interesting outc

Oops outcomes.

1. I hated it. It's made me really really determined to try to check my own impatience this weekend. I wanted to go and tell him to sort himself out but would never do that in front of the kids. I'm also not really in a position yet to get too far up on my high horse!

1. When I got downstairs, the difference in their behaviour for him and for me was tangible.

Happy weekend everybody, good luck x