Does anyone else want to come and be a better parent with me?

[AnotherMonkey]

I've just deleted my original post in an attempt to be more positive.

I'm very low tonight, both of mine (4.5 and nearly 2) are pushing me so far beyond my limits at the moment.

So instead of posting my rant of misery, I wondered if anyone felt like joining me in choosing one thing to be less crap at at time?

Tomorrow, I am going to begin by taking it all less seriously. I'm going to try really really hard not to shout at all (this is difficult because DS is deaf at the moment and often does things which are not safe or bloody annoying but I'm going to find ways around it if I can). Essentially I'm going to try to take a step back and instead of letting poor behaviour bring me down, I'm going to try to isolate problems so that they can be dealt with. I might even make a list. I like lists.

(This evening was so bad I never want to see my neighbours again. I'm quiet, smart and even tempered in real life. Tonight our house must have sounded like a war zone. Or the screaming toddler equivalent. It's shit and it has to change).

Hi everyone, how's the weekend been?

We've had a mixture of rubbish behaviour and brilliant behaviour. DS is far more 'loving' at the moment when he's not being a monkey, it may just be a phase but I like to think that the changes we're making are having some impact, even if we're still learning.

At the moment, the rubbish behaviour tends to happen during very specific times or activities (eg the walk back to the car from school; when we all need to get ready to go out) so I've decided that this week I'm going to start looking for a few strategies to help keep them out of trouble at these times.

Well I had a lovely day out with the kids today, helped by the sunshine and my good mood I think! I did still have to deal with a few minor DD tantrums and warn DS a few times but overall it was good. Yesterday DH was in charge of the kids for a lot of the day as I was out doing a sport and then preparing for a job interview tomorrow (help!!) He said they were a pain in the arse with a few lovely moments inbetween but didn't really elaborate so I left it!

What helped today I think was lots of talking, not much rushing, the sunshine and DS just being helpful for the most part. Also DH was not there as he stayed to get work done and they are much better for me and when they don't try to play us off against each other (DS especially). We had snuggles in bed this morning, had pancakes and then went out to a National Trust place. DS was kind to DD for the first part - playing follow my leader, swinging sticks together etc. I felt really happy and thought - this is what having kids should be like! This is what I imagined it to be like! My parents came and met us there and noticeably DS's behaviour worsened almost immediately. I mentioned this to my mum, who wondered if it was because he thought I was paying less attention to him then (which is true), the other thing is he gets away with dreadful behaviour with the inlaws at times (them allowing it not me I hasten to add). He was noticeably less kind to DD as the day wore on but they are beginning to play together nicely at times, which is so nice. Let's hope this weather continues.

Hello, can I join in? I have tried so many parenting books and courses but they all seem to collapse when they meet real life, or else I'm just rubbish at putting them into practice!

I really need to stop yelling at my boys, especially DS1 who is hyper-sensitive. Yelling at him just seems to fry his circuits, but I'm rubbish at finding other ways of getting through to him. I have also been far too likely to smack them - think I'm getting a handle on this, but still prone to grabbing or squeezing hands. :( I will go and check out the Orange Rhino and AHA websites...

Our weekend has been very quiet because DS was ill for all of it. He's still got a temperature, so I'm keeping him off kindergarten tomorrow which is nice (lie in, quiet day for me!) but means I'll be rushed at work later on. Honestly it's been quite nice to have him so quiet and cuddly

Aggression is the one thing I've found that the gentle techniques just don't work on - for us anyway. I take away TV time for violence or verbal aggression now, and we talk about ways for him to handle his anger etc when he's calmed down. This has really helped a lot. Before there was a lot of battling and hysteria and trying to force him into a room holding the door shut etc :( He would get totally wound up (and he has no sense of when to stop or let things go!) and it really wouldn't help the actual incident, now the sanction is handed out and if he really needs to calm down then he will go to his room - this is really bad, but to get him to stay in his room when he's told without getting into a physical battle about it, we threaten to throw away his sweets which he bought with his (good behaviour) reward money :( I feel awful about this one, so I told DH I don't want him ever to threaten or use it for anything else, even if he's done something really bad. I don't like the idea of removing rewards. But, it's totally taken the heat out of the thing. We've had to take the sweets away twice, and we don't mention it any more, it's a sort of unwritten rule. And at least they are replaceable, although he has to replace them himself obviously. But, anyway, the combination of indirect sanction (TV ban) and calming down in another room if needed but without physical force and nothing too final, like getting rid of a favourite toy or something, and then trying to help him with alternate anger expression/communication tactics later has made a huge difference. He seems calmer generally and is generally nicer to be around.

Jiggle, that's interesting. Do you think maybe you subconsciously behave differently yourself when your parents are around? Like perhaps you sort of go more into the role that you had within the family when you were a child and he somehow picks up on that and if you're not in an "adult" role any more he suddenly doesn't have an authority figure, especially if he associates his other grandparents with being a soft touch. DS always used to be the same with my sister and mum as he was with me, even though he was well behaved for everyone else, it was weird.

Ugh, so it's not all rosy - it is day 6 but I don't feel celebratory. Yesterday was a nice day with a few issues. Today was pretty horrible, on the whole. When DS1 was being calm and nice, DS2 was taking over the job of pushing the buttons... And I feel like I have been so focused on how to deal with DS1 that I have forgotten completely how to deal with the same behaviour from DS2 because it's a different ball game with a 2 year old who is just doing what he sees his brother do. We still had moments of brilliance so I shouldn't be all doom and gloom. I guess I am feeling tired and as I've had some time to do emails today I am missing my friends back home a little. I met up with a mum and her kids today and her first intro do DS1 was him throwing sand at me and me having to try to reason with him to stop doing that. I have also been punched more times than I care to think today. I swear I am going to make him read this when he is 25 and I hope he feels bloody guilty!!
I have been mentally noting triggers for his behaviour which are definitely at certain specific times. I feel like even though we sacrificed going out for lunch today due to bad behaviour, I managed to get out of him that he didn't think they would have what he wanted at the restaurant and that was why he decided to start hitting me... As they are in bed now and I am off duty can I now just be a child for a couple of seconds and say "What did I do to deserve this??" arggghhhh! He's actually not asleep yet and it is now 9pm...sigh

Nellie your day sounds like it was hard, hugs. Days when you don't want to think about how often you've been hit are horrible. Those are my trigger days!

Strangely since things were awful last week, in fact since right after I last got angry with DS, he has been happy and engaged a good deal of the time. He seems to have made developmental leaps in the last few days - really into imaginative play today, chatting loads and seems to be thinking about other people more. It is delightful and encouraging and makes me feel so much love for him

You just know when their behaviour is shocking that they're feeling shocking (same with us really!) Seeing them engaged and enjoying life is like the sun coming out!

Mystifying though, what the heck changed?

Oh that sounds tough nellie. For me sand throwing is NOT a reasoning exercise. It's more "DS, we don't throw sand. It can hurt people's eyes. If I see you throwing sand again we are leaving this part of the park." If that means he has to sit on a bench while his brother plays then... (easier said than done to get them to stay there sometimes though!)

I also found that cancelling things we were doing/threatening to go home when out didn't really help - I had similar things to the restaurant comment, and suspect that DS doesn't actually LIKE being out (and also thinks he'll be allowed to play minecraft or whatever when he gets home) so to take him home was what he wanted And actually it's impractical because sometimes I want to go or we're meeting someone who it would be rude to let down or if you have another child you're effectively punishing them for their sibling's behaviour too. But I really, really struggled with being out of the house and I think DS has just happened to come out of the phase now. Gah! We ended up relying a lot on some promised treat which would come at the end of the trip, like being allowed to spend money on sweets/the gift shop or visiting a park on the way home or going to look in a toy shop - not necessarily buying but he likes to look. But then you do sort of end up threatening to remove it all the time which isn't particularly positive. Not really sure of a better way to handle this one.

Dishes I'm so glad you've had a better time of it :) . Could it just have been a bit of developmental madness?!

Nellie, it sounds like you're doing so well, even if it's still very hard work.

A very comfortable 1 today. My score is rubbish, but things are changing. DS is much happier and this shows in his behaviour towards me (he told me he loved me and gave me a full on, head butt cuddle a propos of nothing today, I can't remember that happening before) and towards his sister. And in his drawing which is becoming much calmer without the manic black scribbles.

The grommets have helped his language massively and this must be having a huge impact as well. His mood has been better today than I remember for a long time.

I'm dealing with DD better too thanks to links on here - the lighthearted ways of dealing with physical stuff really work for her, she's mostly just testing stuff out rather than hitting through negative emotion. I think the sunshine has helped too, my mood is better and I'm not taking her stubbornness so seriously, although it's still frustrating at times.

The weekend was challenging but I'm so determined to get to 5 this week - I'm actually nervous! It's such a roller coaster.

What is the number thing about Monkey? I think I must have missed that.

It's the number of days without shouting ( ) inspired by the Orange Rhino blog.

Ah! Great idea :) Well I'm on 0. It seems DS is definitely ready to go back to school

Bertie - totally with you on the sand throwing thing. My struggle was to make him stop without shouting which is hard when. And I also agree on the cancellation of lunch. I only gave in because hubby was already sceptical about going and it was all just looking quite grim. It was also already late for lunch and I find that making them wait when we are already past the time they normally eat never is a good place to be especially if they don't want to be there in the first place. I am glad we did decide not to go because we had sandwiches instead and then cooked our first home roast for dinner which the boys really enjoyed!

Monkey - I am excited for you too because this is going to be the week that you get to 5! I believe you can do it. I am in shock that I have made it to 7. Seriously. I had a Spanish upbringing where shouting is second nature so it's a big deal :) If I can do it you certainly can. And you are moving leaps and bounds with your DC by the sounds of it. Further than I am - I feel like I'm tackling my behaviour but DS's is still questionable so I wonder how sustainable that will be in the long run. Still, the higher the number, the bigger the incentive not to drop it.

Ahh then the lunch sounds like a much better all around decision

I started reading this thread last night. Found Orange Rhino on fb..
I was thinking about it as soon as I got up this morning, especially when my nearly 4yo ds made a drama about a fly in the living room!
He cries so easily! He'll cry when outside playing with his friends, & when indoors on his own playing with his toys. He's cries when he wants to ask me something (turning tv over for example) He cries over socks and pants.. Cries over food and drink.. When he's not crying he's making a horrible whining noise!!
When he's outside crying, he won't let me help, so I bring him indoors because he's disturbing everyone (communal garden) he gets worse & I feel so crap, a total useless inept parent! I'm on my own (NC with his father)my family live miles away.
After reading this thread last night I thought over all our positives.. When he's not upset he's very charming and funny! He tidied his toys away the night before.. Even helped with hoovering the living room yesterday morning..
So, starting today, no yelling! Can I do a dramatic sigh though??

Just remembered, he cries too when we have visitors in the flat :/
He had slight speech delay, he's seen a speech therapist & has a little home tutoring (courtesy of the childrens centre).
I think I'll mention this again to my HV, I can't handle another summer with him wailing & disturbing everyone

Oh foot sigh away! That sounds dire. I do relate, much as I wish I didn't. It is VERY hard to maintain your own happiness when someone you love is continually unhappy. I read somewhere that you are only as happy as your unhappiest child. True for me! But this thread is great, helping each other to see the positives and build on them.

That Aha Parenting website other posters talk about upthread is great and the one I found the other day, Hand in Hand Parenting, has also really helped me and DP. We'd read a bunch already, accepted/supported/talked about emotions, rah rah all the stuff, but were still overwhelmed. How can you do all this positive parenting and still have so much crying and aggression? Still have no answers. Kids are all different I guess.

DS has miraculously turned some kind of corner this week. No idea what's changed but having him happier makes me happier. And that helps me deal with tantrums/meltdowns/big feelings with much less stress. So that must have a good knock on effect. Hopefully this is a spiral that will go up instead of the down we are used to.

It's not that I expected him to be happy all the time, not at all, just not UNHAPPY so much of the time. I wonder if that might fit how you feel foot? (((Hugs)))

Another developmental madness yes! But it was also going back to what DS tended to be like most of the time when he was younger. Not continually but often. Then this last month he seemed happier, less aggressive, more verbal, etc. To revert back and so intensely was a horrible shock. But then it really seems like a developmental leap since. Who knows how these things work? I am at a loss. A happy loss

Nellie you are on 7 that is spectacular!

Bertie DS is feeling better?

jiggle your day sounds lovely, may there be many more like it

Blue let us know how you go!

Oh foot, your posts really made me chuckle, I have no idea why because that level of ongoing misery would break me. "You are only ever as happy as your unhappiest child" is absolutely spot on. DD cries A LOT, but it's more 'you're getting right in my way and I don't yet have the tools to kill you' than any kind of prolonged whining.

One thing this thread has really made me think about is my own definition of positive parenting - I don't want to be a fluffy, please-let-me-be-your-best-friend-pleeeease parent whose kids run riot, but I do want to teach my kids appropriate behaviour in a way which is respectful and thoughtful and which doesn't make me want to hide from my neighbours.

Dishes it's so strange isn't it. I do feel sometimes like every time we get to grips with one phase there's maybe a week of relative calm then we hit a new one!

Just found this thread and will be reading it soon. Sure as hell I need help. I feel DD is out to finish me iff mentally

'Your only ever as happy as as your unhappiest child' is soo true!
He even cries when a shop assistant is serving us too slowly (& he NEEDS his drink/sweets) so embarrasing.. sigh
After he's been at pre-school all day & he's crying and demanding, I actually find it difficult to speak and my face starts twitching! I've got a meal to cook, dishes to wash & he's pulling me in all different directions..

footflapper My DD (2.10)m is a long-term whinger who had a slight speech delay too. Her speech seems to be improving now, but she is still a complete drama queen whinger over any tiny little thing (apart from at nursery, where she apparently is very quiet and shy - this I sometimes wish I could witness!
I have my MIL visiting this week, which means I won't shout as will be on my best behaviour. Unfortunately I am the type who stores all the frustration up though, so I fear I may have a huge outburst once she is gone. Finding this thread really helpful to try and deal with myself (and DD!), even though not a huge contributor. Thanks all.

Thanks Dishes.

I've resolved to gradually try and build up the non-screaming thing. This week I'm trying to get as far as school each morning without yelling at the boys. Have managed it for 2 days. 3 to go.

I liked the AHA website. It seemed relatable somehow.

When I was reading "Raising Your Spirited Child" with relation to DS1, I realised that all of it applies to myself too, and that I need to get a handle on my own emotions to be able to set a good example to the boys.

Something that stuck in my mind after reading it in a different context is that "noise is inflationary" so I am going to try talking really quietly to settle squabbles instead of wading in at top volume too!

BlueEyeshadow, the build up idea is a really good one. I might use that at the weekend. Me and DH talked about your other point recently - we'd both had a couple of arm-grab moments which we felt shit about and realised that we can hardly expect our 4 year old to control his temper if we can't.

Scout, good luck with MIL. Is she helpful or judgy?

Footflapper, DD does that too. I've noticed even shop assistants get a bit wide-eyed and swipe her stuff (it was a multipack of sweetcorn yesterday, no joke) through fast before hurrying it back to us. The sister at the hospital said she was 'mustard' - I've not heard that one before!

Drink it's a conspiracy. Come join us, they don't know that we know

Nellie, I missed your post before as I was on my phone, thanks for the encouragement. It helps so much! I really do believe you'll start to see a difference before too long - you've already had some better bedtimes and have described some lovely moments with your boys (like the roast dinner).

This evening has not been enjoyable. I had to put both of them in bedrooms at one point so that I could sort them out properly (behaviour meltdown from DS and tantrum meltdown from DD when we got back from school/nursery) and it reached the point where I needed to be firm with DS, it was as if he just couldn't get himself out of it. He has a consequence in place, but then I just held him and hugged him until he calmed down.

So tonight was more about surviving it than enjoying it, but we made it and I've made it to 2.