Enola for DD?

[scarletm]

me and DH watched Enola Holmes recently with his nieces and would love the same name for DD. We do thinks it's a little different though! Any thoughts??

Yes and to honest I find it pretty offensive that @NiceGerbil seems to be assuming those of us saying Hiroshima is important might be blind to the importance of other world events.

@theradioison i just now had to look up the name of the plane that carried the bomb to Nagasaki. A relative was a POW there so we learned about the atomic bomb at family gatherings. The significance of Hiroshima and Nagasaki is not merely the terrible loss of life - the tens of thousands killed. Dreadful things happen in war. The reason everyone does need to know is that those tens of thousands were killed instantly. The discussion around the way the bombs were used. The behaviour and decision chain that led to Nagasaki being bombed just 3 days after Hiroshima. This is what you need to know. The pilot writing his mum's name on the nose of the plane is a distracting sentimental detail. The three sets of monitoring equipment that was dropped before Fat Man was detonated is way more chilling.
So many awful things have happened since, but the horror of these unconscionable weapons is falling out of memory. As teenagers in the eighties we were used to grownups being genuinely fearful of a nuclear war. Only now do I realise how hearing a personal account must have alerted them. PTSD is a kind of group survival mechanism: when traumatised survivors tell their story over and over, then others may listen and make sure it never ever happens again.
I do wonder @sionnachrua is it best to spread out knowledge of terrible things. You may be right. But tbh I want you all to know what happened and why and what happened since as a result.

@SoupDragon

The song isn't that important, the event obviously is.

What you seem to be failing to understand is that it isn't about the song itself.

Oh I understand perfectly well. However I don't think the song has lasting impact - clearly Hiroshima does. People around my age on the thread don't know the song so I highly doubt kids her age will.

However I don't think the song has lasting impact

It's not about the song! 🤦🏻‍♀️

So many awful things have happened since, but the horror of these unconscionable weapons is falling out of memory. As teenagers in the eighties we were used to grownups being genuinely fearful of a nuclear war. Only now do I realise how hearing a personal account must have alerted them. PTSD is a kind of group survival mechanism: when traumatised survivors tell their story over and over, then others may listen and make sure it never ever happens again.
I do wonder @sionnachrua is it best to spread out knowledge of terrible things. You may be right. But tbh I want you all to know what happened and why and what happened since as a result.

As in have a general knowledge of history? Yes. I'd hope people would tbh, I'm very surprised that people haven't heard of Hiroshima at all. However I wouldn't class the name of the plane that dropped the bomb as being absolutely key knowledge.

However when you look at modern history you'd have to wonder how much people really apply knowledge from events like the Holocaust or Hiroshima to our own lives...I know a Holocaust survivor who is very saddened by how little people have learned from it all. But that is a whole other thread on a whole other topic!

Fuck me there are a lot of of people around who don't read, watch documentaries or know much about the world.

yep, @BrazenlyDefying. It's quite scary.

But what's scarier, for me, is the number of people on this thread who have been defensive, even proud of, their ignorance.

"I wasn't taught it in school."
"It's niche."
"I'm too young to know that stuff"... etc ad infinitum

Yes, lots of us don't know things, but surely being open to new learning is important, as is being aware that there are important things we may not know?

As a pp said, you can see how Brexit happened...

@fellrunner85

yep, *@BrazenlyDefying*. It's quite scary.

But what's scarier, for me, is the number of people on this thread who have been defensive, even proud of, their ignorance.

"I wasn't taught it in school."
"It's niche."
"I'm too young to know that stuff"... etc ad infinitum

Yes, lots of us don't know things, but surely being open to new learning is important, as is being aware that there are important things we may not know?

As a pp said, you can see how Brexit happened...

What you define as important and crucial is not someone else's thoughts.

Quite ignorant of you to think that everyone thinks the same as you, but then you seem proud of that

It is objectively important though. It’s not like not knowing about folklore or Egyptians 🙄

@MsTSwift

It is objectively important though. It’s not like not knowing about folklore or Egyptians 🙄

Again though, that is still your opinion, and others might not see things the same way.

@MsTSwift

It is objectively important though. It’s not like not knowing about folklore or Egyptians 🙄

What, knowing the name of the plane that dropped an atomic bomb is crucial knowledge? I think not. Knowing about the when/where/why etc and the terrible impact on people is important.

Being able to name the plane? Good for a pub quiz, not life changing otherwise.

Almost no-one suggested not knowing the name of the plane was important. The incredulity arose when some people said they had never heard of Hiroshima. Itself.
That's like someone living here and now saying they've never come across 9/11. IMHO. And I feel society has failed them and us, not that the individual who doesn't know has in any way failed or should be found wanting.

Sorry, Op.

It's a negatory from me.

Don't mean to be unkind but for all the reasons above, just no.

Eleonora is a nice unusual name

What you define as important and crucial is not someone else's thoughts.

Quite ignorant of you to think that everyone thinks the same as you, but then you seem proud of that

The idea that the dropping of two nuclear bombs on two cities full of totally innocent citizens doesn't fit into ANYONE'S idea of important or crucial just beggars belief. I don't quite know how anyone could defend that for any reason whatsoever esp if you are out of your teens.

@Theradioison

What you define as important and crucial is not someone else's thoughts.

Quite ignorant of you to think that everyone thinks the same as you, but then you seem proud of that

The idea that the dropping of two nuclear bombs on two cities full of totally innocent citizens doesn't fit into ANYONE'S idea of important or crucial just beggars belief. I don't quite know how anyone could defend that for any reason whatsoever esp if you are out of your teens.

This

Jeez

What you define as important and crucial is not someone else's thoughts.

Agreed, but are you saying that you consider the first ever use of nuclear weapons on a civilian population to be unimportant? I would be surprised to see anyone trying to make that case tbh.

@Theradioison

What you define as important and crucial is not someone else's thoughts.

Quite ignorant of you to think that everyone thinks the same as you, but then you seem proud of that

The idea that the dropping of two nuclear bombs on two cities full of totally innocent citizens doesn't fit into ANYONE'S idea of important or crucial just beggars belief. I don't quite know how anyone could defend that for any reason whatsoever esp if you are out of your teens.

We were discussing the name of the plane, not the bombing

Sounds strange to me. How about Nola, Nuala or Leona?

Awful association with the name of the plane that dropped the bomb on Hiroshima. Also sounds too much like Ebola. I’m not a fan.

We were discussing the name of the plane, not the bombing

But you said that you had not heard of Hiroshima itself. That is what people were reacting to, not that you didn't know the name of the plane. I don't think anyone here is seriously arguing that such details are crucial and important, rather that the event itself is too important for us to allow it to be forgotten.

Fuck me there are a lot of of people around who don't read, watch documentaries or know much about the world.

Absolutely. But every time such a debate comes up there are hordes of people hiding behind "We didn't learn it in school so how can I possibly be expected to know about it?" As though the few short hours spent in class can possibly cover all the important events, facts and issues in the world.

@DangerMouse17

People that dont know about Enola Gay should be seriously embarrassed....educate yourselves! Read!

I'm stunned.

I’m not embarrassed about not knowing something.

I’m not rude about gaps in your knowledge. So why do you think it’s ok to be so rude to others?
I am pretty sure there are things I know that you don’t. Does that make you a bad person? Or me better than you?

Of course not.

I think it’s a lovely name but I’ve also never heard of Enola Grey so don’t associate it with that.

@BrazenlyDefying

Fuck me there are a lot of of people around who don't read, watch documentaries or know much about the world.

You have to know about it and / or have an interest in that topic to Seek out that information.

Now I know the bomb existed, I know it brought about the end of the war but that’s it, I am probably not going to watch a documentary about it or read about it.

It’s a little bit like the google algorithms, which I find incredibly scary. They will only show you responses based on what you’ve previously searched for. So two people googling the same news story could get two totally different responses.