Name for a snow baby

[BlackberryandNettle]

Any ideas for a baby girl born in this snow/cold?

I know. Most of my family can though!
What I mean is that I wouldn't presume to know how every dialect of spoken English pronounced different words. No one can no that about their own language unless they are travelling constantly round said county/countries doing research.
mike's comment to TheOriginalEmu is supercilious and insulting. I think she knows how people pronounce her child's name, Mike does not because he isn't there. It's simple.

gah for typos .

that was a joke tbh...I have lived in Wales for some years and am just now getting around to pronouncing it...

Also I think Mike might be a woman..

the English do mash up perfectly good Welsh names/words though, in general.

For example, I have one acquaintance who insists on saying 'Dowie' for 'Dewi' and another who corrects me when I pronounce 'Meurig' (Mayrick) as she is convinced it is 'Myoorig'.

"when I pronounce 'Meurig' (Mayrick)"

Sorry, but Meurig is not pronounced like Mayrick. It's pronounced like the month of May and then rig as in rig a boat.

I can understand people not being able to pronounce 'ch' and 'll' and 'rh' and sounds that don't exist in English, but people failing to pronounce Dewi properly baffle me. There are no difficult sounds in it.

Robyn

Holly

Well mike several hundred welsh speakers i know personally wouldn't agree with you! Ay (like in hay) is in the name Eifion for instance. and I would say ay and air are different. Ay= hay, way, say Air=well, Air for fair.
Accents can vary between different towns, unless you've been to every single town in wales, i don't think you are qualified to say it 'doesn't exist'. My grandparents didn't speak english at all until they were in their 30s, they used that sound.

dull I am also a welsh speaker, so i feel I am qualified as both a welsh speaker, and the parent of my child to know how it is pronounced!

Emma

Bronwen?

Bronwen is a lovely name.

Eifion doesn't sound like Ayv-yon. The 'ei' is a shorter sound. It's like the 'ey' in Freya.

well, to me those sounds are the exact same. and to many many other people. as I said, different accents= different variations on a sound. it still stands that some parts of wales say ayv-yon and some say Eyev-yon. the same as some say eye-ree and say ay-ree.

Also. as it goes. I personally think Eirwen is a much nicer name than Bronwen. It's almost...ALMOST....as if taste in names is subjective!

TheOriginalEmu, so if you call out "Hey!" to someone, it sounds like "Hay!"? I think not.

yes! it absolutely does!

It's pointless to argue about pronunciation in writing unless we're going to use phonetic symbols.

I agree gwen, completely. I'm also a linguistics graduate and what i'm mostly about is mike seeming to think her pronunciation is the only one that exists! it is simple fact that different regions of Wales has variations in accent and pronunciation the same as any other country/language. It's patronising and condescending to insist her way is the only way.

Yes, there are regional pronunciations, but on a thread where many people are not Welsh, I don't think it's wrong for Mike to emphasise the standard pronunciation, especially since the 'ai' for 'ei' thing is often an Anglicization.

Also, in the case of a minority language the fact that one parent uses a certain pronunciation doesn't automatically make it correct. Dylan Thomas pronounced his name Dillon, but that doesn't mean I have to accept that as the correct pronunciation of Dylan.

But she is telling the 'ei' is wrong. that the 'ei' i use as a first language welsh speaker from a welsh speaking part of the country carmarthenshire) is wrong. I accept the 'ai' is probably anglicised thing from the area I currently live in (south wales, near swansea), but I don't accept at all that 'ay/ei' are in anyway wrong, or that Hay and Hey don't sound the same in my accent. because they do.
I also accept people butcher welsh. Seren as a perfect example of this. but it is ALSO true that the way Seren is pronounced in the north is different to how it is pronounced in the south. neither are wrong.
I also don't especially like being spoken to like an idiot. Mike is not as far as I know The Boss Of Welsh on mumsnet.

" that Hay and Hey don't sound the same in my accent. because they do. "

It was because of Hay and Hey that I said this discussion makes no sense without using phonetics. If you're reading them as the words Hey like Americans say hello and Hay like grass then they're pronounced the same for everyone in Wales. I presume Mike meant phonetically in Welsh hei or hai, which are pronounced differently in standard Welsh.

"it is ALSO true that the way Seren is pronounced in the north is different to how it is pronounced in the south"

In what way? The first 'e' might be elongated in parts of the south, but that's a general southern accent. I'm not aware of different pronunciations for Seren.

"I also don't especially like being spoken to like an idiot. Mike is not as far as I know The Boss Of Welsh on mumsnet."

I think Mike is generally trying to explain to the average Mumsnetter who is not a Welsh speaker and does a good job at that.

Eirawen (At-Ra-Wen) female
Eirwen (Air-Wen) male*

Disagree with your phonetics there.

no Eirwen is a girl's name.

*wen = female
wyn = male

They both mean 'white'.

And how is Eirawen pronounced 'Atrawen'..? confused*

Obviously it’s a typo and I meant Ay not At.

My Nain was called Eirawen and that’s how we pronounced it.... She and my mum’s family including my mum were/are Welsh speaking. I’m Wenglish speaking!

My good friend’s fil, who is a Welsh farmer and Welsh speaking along with his whole family is called Eirwyn and the above again is how we pronounce it.

Sorry, but I meant wyn for Male, not wen

Leave Eira alone. Pronounced correctly it is a lovely name. The Ei bit is very difficult to get right. It doesn't sound like Ava and Ada. The Ayra pronunciation is a bit yukky to a fluent Welsh speaker.
There are Welsh names that are popular on here that Welsh speakers would not use because they are very dated or because they are naff. The names make it plain that thre parents don't speak Welsh.
And there are always people on here who know loads of people with a name and they all seem to pronounce it in some strange way.
Call the baby Emma or something.

I called my ds Tom and my health visitor called him Tomos when she came to see him. I corrected her that it was Tom and she said that he’ll most likely be called Tomos by teachers when he’s older

The English mash up French names too but no one gives a shit.

"but no one gives a shit."

What do you mean by no one, just English people?

No one really does give a shit how anyone pronounces their own name, regardless of where it came from originally.
And if they do then they don’t have much to worry about in their lives.