support thread for women who have chosen to terminate IV

[bezzyk]

Hello ladies old and new.

Here's hoping this thread brings better luck and much happiness.

Lots of love

BK xx

Whoah Linspins.

((((((((((hugs)))))))

What a hard thing to hear out of the blue. Bless her, they process everything these little souls.

Oh Linspins, they don't forget do they. Somewhere in their little minds they store these things and then out they pop. That must have been a real lump in the throat moment.

Oh Lins, what complex emotions that must have brought. It's lovely that she thinks of them, but how sad a reminder of their absence.
xxxx to you and DD...

(sorry not been posting, been lurking regularly, just tired/sore throat/feeling bit rubbish - laughed at the various DD/DS sayings though ).

Hello my dearest mumsnutters
I have been so absent but you are not absent from my thoughts and I read here and smile or frown with sadness or think back to my own sadness or compose words in my head to you all but do not always have the energy somehow.
Lins - I think you must have done a wonderful job of keeping Amy and Daisy's memories alive for your wee poppet to be able to articulate such thoughts. Truly I do. What an intelligent and sensitive little girl. She has said exactly how it is - we all wish that our babies were playing here with us.
Cantdo - what a strange and overwhelming week of dates and memories to process. It is a necessary journey for you honey but hard, harder, hardest. Thank God for the distraction of wee girl.
Bezzy Boodles - thinking of you muchly at this time soon - early days.You and I are becoming old soaks it seems. Good.
Tree and Justa have communicated with you both today in other worlds - but hello again ladies.
Brighton Lady - did I hear a change of spirit there darling? A readiness to confront the possibility of trying to try again? I do hope so honey; I really feel this could be good.
I am fine. Fine really. Have had a few weeks of overwhelming work and domestic commitments - some anxious times, some non-sleeping. But realise I need to rest, I need some time. And now I have some as it is half term, thank God and have shut down to the commitments and can regroup.
To all the other women here- I read your posts regularly and I feel so proud to be a part of such a supportive, caring community. It is a special, gentle place - it is all I wanted to find when I was so desperately looking for a sanctuary. I miss the time when i was so very intensely here - but this time has passed for now. I need to be more present in my real life now. It is part of recovery for me I am sure. But I miss being here - it is such a strong connection to the pregnancies; yet in order to recover I have to let go a bit.
I must to bed, said sleep head.
Night
Bee xxxxxxxxxxx

Hello everyone

Lins, so sad. How do they manage it big cuddle (or cuggle as mini bez would say)

We had a similar experience last week. DD didn't know I was pregnant this last time, but suspect she put 2 and 2 together. She stood on a chair looking out of her bedroom window.

Bezzy: "What you doing mini bez"

Mini Bez "Just waiting"

Bezzy "What are you waiting for?"

Mini Bez "My sister"

Needless to say I wailed and held her so tight. Poor little thing. I felt terribly bad for harping on about the babies we've lost and not the one that I have in my life with me.

Love to everyone

BK xx

These sibling stories are so sad and moving. DD has no idea, I think, of anything at all. Don't think she registers a universe outside herself yet - which makes it easier in a way.

Hi Bee, Lins, Numpty. Hope some of Bee's gentle tranquillity can pass itself on to us all.

Hi Katiecubs - just looking out for you again. In answer to your question on thread III, I think it was about six weeks until I got my period. Maybe it takes longer if you've had a surgical intervention like we did? I decided to wait for three months before I started trying and then it took six months to get pregnant, having conceived first time with ds1, ds2 and my lost dd. I was a bit surprised and disappointed about this as I was desperate to be pregnant by my due date but in the end wasn't. I guess my body just wasn't ready. Fingers crossed for you and a mumsnet (((hug))) coming your way.

To all you other wonderful ladies, it never ceases to amaze me how compassionate you all are after all that you have been through. I know I've said it before but even though I don't really belong here given the thread title I have found, after all these years, such comfort on here. Because my dd died early on in my pregnancy, I've always felt a bit of a fraud for feeling so sad. You make everyone feel welcome at whatever stage the loss and don't judge. I thank you all once again for that.

The sibling stories also struck a chord. After my scan, we had to explain to our then 6 and 9 year old ds's that the baby had died. The following morning we were all in our bed and our six-year old said "Last week there were five of us in the bed and now there are four of us and a dead baby". He was too young to understand the pain of that at the time. My nine-year old was lovely. He kept asking if I was okay. I guess I didn't think too much at the time about how it affected him. It was only about 11 months later when he blurted out that he was sad because he'd lost his baby sister that I realised it had. Fortunately I was already pregnant by then so we made the decision to tell him and only him (he was a very mature 10 year old by then) as we'd decided to keep it quiet until my 12 week scan. He was delighted and there is a very special bond between them even though he is approaching 21!

A bit of a long post and I feel I've hijacked the thread a bit, so sorry about that.

Hi everyone - hi Longtime - thanks for looking out for me and thanks for your advice! i think i mentioned before that i just wan't my period to arrive as until it does i'm sort of stuck in this wierd post tx hell!! anyway still not here so will have to be patient i guess. I hope you are doing well?

The sibling stories are quite profound - what comes out of the mouths of babes hey.

Brighton girl - the wedding plans and dress sound very exciting! Congrats on the new job and i wouldn't worry about TTC right away - people are always starting work and announcing their pg right away at my place!

Can'tdo - i hope you have managed to get through the week ok so far - sending lots of hugs your way.

Lins - i hope the counselling is a big help to you.

Love to everyone else xxxxxxxxx

Hi all on the shiny new thread, shed a few tears there catching up but lets hope the new thread is a lucky one.

Congratulations on your wedding and new job Brighton Girl. I only got married last Dec and I LOVED organising it, okay I forgot to order the cake and we had to get last minute 'love buns' but apart from that it was great. Will definitely focus your mind but by all accounts you're doing really well, at this point difficult to imagine feeling happy again but from what you've said it does happen. I believe you.

Tree lovely family you have there, your children are so lovely. As are the nappies I have to add.

Katie still sitting patiently there?

Off to check my cottage pie and open the illicit mid week bottle of wine hastily bought on the way home

Hello Justa
I am not uptodate with your dad's condition but it sounds as if things are not good. I hope he is comfortable and that you are able to visit him - must be hard, so far away and you are pregnant and with two small boys in tow.
The sibling stories are moving I agree. Just as the words of the women here are too- I have had an emotional therapy session today and feel utterly beaten up. Utterly worn down.
Take care of you.
Bee xxxxx

Thanks everyone for your support here, - last night I didn't know what to 'do' with my feelings about Dd sad comment on Amy and Daisy, - thankfully this thread is here. So glad it is and that you are all here on it.
Went to my first counselling session, lovely lady called Ruth, who specializes in bereavement/loss/pregnancy, and had met her through NHS stuff already so she knows much of my story. (She works on NHS as a screening midwife, and privately, counselling).
Boy, did I need to talk. Said all sorts of things out loud, that had been cooped up in my head, weighing me down for weeks. Admitted to some tricky emotions...so lots to work on next time! Got next appt in 2 weeks.

Bezzy, it's hard when they talk about sisters isn't it. Bless mini bez. My dd likes to play sisters (along with mummies/aunties/teachers/doctors) and it always makes me...wistful? and a bit sad.

Bee my lovey, know exactly how you feel about not being on thread so much and needing to deal with stuff in real life. You and I will have to pop past as and when. Love to you and 'happy half term' (yay for half terms!!).

Big hello to all. Lins xxx

Oh Justa. I am sorry. I have no idea what to advise. How old is DS1? I remember my granddad dying when I was 9 - shock heart attack, so very sudden. I can remember just not getting it that he wouldn't be there anymore (rather than being sad, iyswim). I think honesty and hugs are the only way forward. And not sure about how you visit without DS1-but perhaps your DH could take DS1 and DS2 somewhere else for the weekend, so they didnt really know? Though as you're due your C/S in December you must feel heavy and tired by now, and not really up to travel anyway...

Lins, sounds like counselling was a bit of a revelation. Glad you found you had lots to say and more to come. And I hope you are doing okay - how many weeks now?

Busier, your termination anniversary is next Sat, isnt it? I recall it was exactly a week after mine. Mine is today. I have found the run up harder than the run up to the due date of my second baby because the memories resurface (and termination memories are horrible!). But I am fine today, so I think as Shangrila said, the anticipation is worse than the reality. Speaking of Shangrila - how many weeks are you now, too?

Got to go, being dragged by DD. Thinking of everyone even when I don't post....

Came to give Cant virtual hugs and hand holds. Am delighted to see her DD has meant that you maybe don't need them as you have a busy Saturday in rl. Saturday is the best day isn't it? I'm glad you have distractions, tomorrow this anniversary will have past.

Llins - amazing thing the brain. Your dd's comments must have flicked a trigger switch on so many emotions. How good. How good it comes now, and not at 3 days postnatal, when it would be so hard to cope with it all. You have time and space and a guiding hand in your councillor. I guess you have some gruelling, exhausting but cathartic sessions ahead. Thread will be here for support. x

When you can look back and be gratefull you were able to work through the feelings, how lovely that you can say your dd began your healing

Justa - Thats all the bloody use I can be. I think because if I were advising your dad I'd be telling him to do the opposite I think. I can't see much value in living in a bubble trying to prolong life, if it makes accessing the things that make life real and worth living 'dangerous'. Now I don't know if I'd be the same in his shoes. I haven't walked a mile in them afterall. It's hard for you to hear though Justa.
Would ds like a webchat with him? On the 'aren't we all so busy just can't seem to get down the motorway, I have done this this and this' line? Hardly a substitute but all I can think off to help your ds.

I just think that if you are going the ds's may as well too, as you will be as bug ridden as they are. I can see your dad is in a wierd and hard hard place metally and physically though. My best wishes to him.

How are you feeling after Thursday Bee? DId the week get any calmer for you? Hope you feel less squashy. You must be knackered. Half term - a bit of space for you to rest your tired head. Much love to busierbee.

Noone minds the hijack, silly mare.

I'd be a bit cross too. Is he scared? He must be, an this sounds like a scared behaviour. Hard reality to face.

There might be more to it too, I can imagine how, when ill and faced with a terminal diagnosis, one would simply go into a bubble and wait it out. Maybe children, so vital and full of future, are just too hard to be with. They might seem almost like aliens to him, if he is in a world of medicines and routine and peace and waiting, waiting , waiting.
I wonder if he said about the germ thing as an excuse, not being able to vocalise how he really feels.

Rambling now......

I think Tree might have a point there - maybe he just can't face seeing children (because he would have to put a brave face on/because they remind him of what he has lost/because they might notice his weakness and retreat, rejecting him, almost? there are so many possible reasons). I guess you just need to wait it out, horrible as it is, Justa.

Have redecorated DD's room this afternoon. It is now a pink paradise. She will be thrilled.

It's so hard, though. I really feel for you. And there's no solution, no simple one, anyway. It's horrible.

If it helps in any way, we are here for you.

Justa - when my grandfather died, I was 9; as I said it was sudden. I can vividly remember drawing a picture of the whole family, with him in it, and crossing him out and telling my parents I had crossed him out because he was dead. I think children need to keep asserting the fact that someone has gone/is going (in your DS1's case) to begin to come to terms with it. Not that that helps you.

At least he is talking about it and not repressing it.

Hugs to all of you; you're coping very well.

Hi all, got up early to continue packing. This is one of the only 2 days dh will be home to help, and there's only 9 days left til settlement, so have to make the most of it. Have had a cold for the past week with a nasty cough. Colds normally don't bother me but I think my tummy muscles must be a bit weak with all the stretching of pregnancy, cause I'm sure I've strained something - coughing is agony. Anyway, enough whinging. Really just wanted to suggest something to justa - at work, if someones immune sytem is suppressed or compromised, we 'barrier nurse' them and take extra precautions; surgical mask, gloves etc. Might sound silly in your situation, but perhaps if ds really wanted to see his grandad you could explain to him how important it was that grandad didn't get any germs from anyone, and that a mask and extra handwashing will help protect grandad. Just a suggestion, and only useful if, as tree has suggested, this is the real reason for your dads reluctance to have ds visit. Good luck with it all, must be a hard time for you.

Have to try to wake dh up again now - he was the one who suggested early morning, and yet he's the one still asleep, snoring his head off

Thinking of you all, take care xxx

Reading and thinking and thinking and reading.

I am sad to read this part of your life Justa - it is so poignant and so much where a death should be as opposed to where it often is on this thread; far too early.

Maybe your dad is right Justa? He is older and wiser than us -and maybe it is too overwhelming for him to carry on breathing and accepting his own demise and also to see and let go of young cherished ones.
Really Justa; what I think is this. It is hard for DS1; he is a little boy. He is confused. But he has you and his daddy and you are the world to him.
Maybe your own future loss and letting go of your father needs thinking about and processing and accepting. Myself; God I cannot conceive of letting go of my mum and dad;' whilst knowing that i must. So what I am saying I guess is be selfish. Think of you. Think of your dad. Think of your dad and you too as well as little boy.
Is so like you to care about the pain of another over and above yourself.
So Tree may be on to something. And Can'tdo too - in your father's fear of seeing a small, hopeful child.
But your DS will learn and his tiny. child brain will process and talk and accept.

But you Justa. How are you honey? Follow your instinct and go to your dad if it is right. Explain that your dad is your precious dad and you need to see him before he goes to the better place. Can your son draw a beautiful picture for him? Could you even make a wee video on your phone? Let your dad be in charge of his own death maybe; listen to him. You are so good at listening; you really are. He is the one to think about maybe.
Tell me to shove it. Have had two glasses of wine and am bit maudlin and this is of course all my own issues around my dad being my saviour and protector. If I have got it all wrong I apologise now.
Sending you so much love and thoughts and sighs
Bee xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx