Why do you think the MIL hatred thing is so prevelant?

[mrspir8]

Just wondering...I am not by any means dissing anyone choice of thread subject or current situation. If half the MIL threads on here are true then some of you are having quite a shitty time with yours.

I love my MIL, she is a loving, warm, freindly, funny woman. She is kind, helpful and non judgemental. Dont get me wrong, she irritates me to the point of distraction sometimes, she is so damn polite and unassuming that she never says what she really wants to do and never takes part in any decision making of family events etc.She also never lets my husband know if they are poorly or anything because she couldnt bear that she had inconvenienced us in anyway. But I still love her. She is my husbands Mum and a wonderful Grandmother. I wish she lived closer.

In contrast my own mum, although I love her heaps and heaps and cannot bear the thought of her not being in my life, is bone-achingly negative about everything, overbearing and often critical. I have sought to make things better recently and not really gone the right way about it, consequently we have had a rocky ride especially since my daughter was born. Things are peaceful at present.

For example, do you think that I enjoy a better easier relationship with with my MIL because my relationship with my own Mum is so unpredictable? Is this a factor in the relationship at all, for you?

or is it possibly some deep biological alpha female thing?

Bonsoir:

AAh that's the theory but we will all feel differently when it's our own little boys.
maybe 'claim' is teh wrong word but both women share his affectionsand love- and I think that definitely causes jealousy!

pisces - wondered if number of children had something to do with it. I think you could obssess a bit and over focus on say your only child or only son (especially son as DD's tend to gravitate towards their mother anyway.) Women with bigger families just don't have the same time.

Completely agree with pisces. However, take all those factors and add in the fact that all MILs have a view on how you should bring up your children and "what they did in their day". Because they don't have that same tie as a woman does to their own mother it is harder for them to get their point across and they probably feel like they are taken less seriously and feel left out of the childcare.

If the MIL is decent and stands back from it all a bit then it probably makes the relationship easier as she becomes easier to approach IYSWIM.

In saying that - I think I prefer my MILs method of bringing up children to my mum's and I would probably listen to her more because she is just a bit softer with DC.

'AAh that's the theory but we will all feel differently when it's our own little boys.'

Not if you do your job properly and start letting go gradually.
I am convinced it boils down to control and possession. I have 3 DSs and they are almost all cut the ties. I am always here for them whatever and love them to bits-they are still 'my babies' but I accept that although I may think of them like that they aren't really! They are equals and if they marry a woman with , to me, odd ideas on childrearing I let them get on with it. I go with the flow-love the DCs unconditionally-and let the parents get on with it (unless they are drug addicts or similar and are harming the DCs).
It helps a great deal if you have let them have their own ideas from an early age and not expected to jump to yours-as in 'I don't go to cubs because mummy doesn't want the to make the promise'. Mummy isn't making the promise-the DC is and should, by 8yrs be deciding if he wants to make the promise-or 'I can't have a sausage roll because mummy is a vegetarian -by 8 yrs a DC should be able to choose to eat one if they wish (and are not allergic). If the DH has a pattern of not upsetting his mother when he disagrees things are not going to go well when DIL digs her heels in and says she wants him to stand up to his mother! He should have started at 8 yrs old by telling her that he can go into a male changing room on his own at the swimming pool etc!

Sorry-I will shut up again. I just have a whole issue with people's control of their DCs. The MIL problems come because the mother has never relinquished the control. You get the horror stories of them arriving uninvited, (sometimes even with their own key!)and staying for hours and being too overbearing for a DIL, who is finding her feet as mother,-it should never, ever happen.

I do have every sympathy for DIL with that sort of MIL but some DIL are just as bad! If you have a situation where MIL can't even pick up her grandchild without permission you are going to have trouble. Do as you want to be done by when your turn comes. I'm sure that, by and large, people get what they deserve (apologies for those who get it when they don't deserve it).

"wondered if number of children had something to do with it. I think you could obssess a bit and over focus on say your only child or only son (especially son as DD's tend to gravitate towards their mother anyway.) Women with bigger families just don't have the same time"

Oh don't you believe it!!! My MIL has 10 children, and trust me, she MAKES the time. She talks to her DDs every day for AGES, and a few of her DSs at least a few times a week, including my DH - but that is because he calls her so often.

Sadly though, my MIL and I had a fairly good relationship (I won't say great, because we were in some ways quite wary of each other because we're both quite strong personalities) for well over 10 years because we both put the effort into it.

However, after my DS2 was born it all went pear shaped. I KNOW the comments she has made about some of her DILs and their child rearing, and now I can only imagine what comments she has made about me after their last visit. Things were pretty horrendous and at the moment I don't want her back in our home (PIL live abroad and when they visit they stay with us). She was truly awful, and talked AT me, said highly critical things about me to our 'very new' nanny, made comments to my nanny that were actually rude comments directed at me when we were all present, tried to infer that every problem I had with DCs was clearly MY fault because the nanny had no problems at all with them, or conversely, clearly my DCs were really dreadful because the nanny had had an awful time with them and obviously that was MY fault (not sure she saw the irony of how contradictory those two type of statements were!!) (and DS2 was only 3 months at the time, not sure what they actually expected, please and thank yous???!!!).

I hope it will get better, but because of the distance I am (and I think my MIL is also)very wary of getting together again any time soon. They uusually visit every year for at least 3 weeks, sometimes twice a year, but so far nothing has been planned for the forseeable future by them. We visited them and my family shortly after the fiasco visit and although civil, it was very cool on both sides, but at least she didn't come out with any more comments.

It's hard for DH because he is really close to his DM, but he bends himself into a pretzel when his parents are here and it drives me crazy. He defers to them so much, and previously that had not been an issue because MIL rarely took advantage of it. But now? Now DH is off to visit them on his own without me or the DSs - financially it makes sense for him to go on his own, but if the relationship had been warmer than it currently is I know I would have been more insistent on trying to find a way to visit them as well, and I know that if DH wasn't so worried about us getting into an argument he would have tried harder to get me to go too.

I think that I missed a huge chunk chitchat-those who don't deserve it and just have a DH who is too nice!
If the mother is over controlling they need to start early-primary school age- in making it clear that they have their own opinions. Usually it is just easier for them to play lip service to mother and do their own thing and therefore they are not in the habit of telling her what they really think.

I do think MN gives a very, very skewed impression of the relationship between MILs and DILs because in general people come on MN to rant about problems rather than share their utter joy in their good fortune.

I have problems with my MIL but then her own dcs would probably agree that she is as mad as a box of frogs. She has said some awful things to dh and his siblings in her time, things which, had they been said by anyone else, would have resulted in never being friends with that person again.

Of all the other women I know who have MILs, most of them get on just fine, maybe with the odd irritation or falling-out. Therefore no need to come online and go on about it!

I have issues with my MIL to the point where my partner and I are considering not getting married to stop her behaviour. If anyone has read the secret life of husbands that is my MIL. She will come round uninvited and walk into the house then start trying to nose around. She lies to other people about my life, tells me off for telling my kids off (yesterday for example I was cruel for putting my five year old in timeout for driving his scooter at the barbecue, which was lit, for the third time). Her first words to me yesterday were "oh, you finally managed to find clothes to fit then". This is because I just had a baby and couldnt find a dress for ascot cause of my massive boobs. She then told me what I needed to do to get rid of my "load of fat". Then she told my partner she was booking us all a holiday with her. Then she proceeded to slate dss's mother IN FRONT OF HIM, who she sucks up to in person.

The list goes on and on. She is the most boundarieless, innappropriate, rude person I have ever met and I have no idea how to handle her. DP is mortified by her and almost everyone else runs the other way when they see her to avoid an hour of how awful her life is.

grrr.

p.s I am nearly five foot ten and a size fourteen. Really not obese.

prettyfly, she does sound horrendous - but if she is like this now and you are not married, how is not getting married going to improve things? Can't quite follow the logic there, sorry.

Re her coming round uninvited, if it's happening too often, don't let her in! Start by saying "I'm sorry it's just not convenient now, I have friends coming" or something. If that doesn't work, and she barges past you, get an early warning alarm system (silent outside) on the gate, so you know when someone has opened it and you can look to see who it is and then choose whether or not to answer the door.

Has she always been this bad, do you know? Or is it fairly recent?

i think the comments about the relationship between the dh & his mum are interesting - dh would happily never see his mum again, and, in fact, wanted to move to australia/nz to make sure this happened. needless to say, i find her difficult to get on with.

i also think it's true that some mums find it hard to let go - i know that when i go home to visit, both my parents & the pil treat me like a naughty teenager - i'm 41, with a 6 yr old dd. i sort of get asked what dd wants, then get ignored. i don't mind if they are taking care of dd for me, but when i'm in the room, and they ask what drink she'd like, then get something else, it is frustrating.

my mum was far too involved in my life & i felt suffocated, dh's mum all but ignored him & obviously wished she had no kids to look after. hopefully, we'll manage some kind of middle ground.

i do also think there are some dil who just like a moan, and on mumsnet, we're likely to hear about the dh's mum then that happens.

there's the low level but intensely irritating things, like they stir their tea wrong. then there's the really awful people who, actually, have so many problems themselves, that they should never have become parents. i think it's important to differentiate between the two & let the little things go. if you're unlucky enough to have pik with BIG issues, you & dp really need to work together on the issue.

Is there a correct way to stir tea? I usually put milk in first and don't take sugar so have never been judged on that.

2rebecca there may not be a correct way to stir tea, but my MIL genuinely believes that tea tastes nicer out of "real china"

prettyfly she does sound awful! Poor you.

My MIL on the other hand won't say anything against me, or against how I bring up my DCs (don't think she would dare), but she leaps to the defence of her son, my DH, who I love to bits but tease because he can be such a plonker!! My family teases. That's how we show we love each other and I can't relax around my PILs as they are so uptight. I was talking to my DH about my relationship with them, with MIL in particular, just the other day as I don't know why she drives me to insanity, and I wish I had the same relationship with them as he has with my Ps (who can also drive me to distraction btw).

I think the root of many MIL relationships is as another poster alluded to and that is that your MIL used to have control over your DH but now doesn't, and she probably has ideas about how your lives should be run, but doesn't really have the right to say so. So she either does say so, and pisses people off, or she doesn't, but infers it, which is probably all the more infuriating. Then the DIL in turn either feels she can speak out against her MIL and does so, pissing people off in the process, or feels she can't, and winds herself up into a wee frenzy about it!

Oh lordy, I did go on a bit, didn't I .

It is hard, isn't it. I'm at the stage where I am hurt by my MIL, and upset/angry about it. I don't hate her, I don't even dislike her. I am wary of her, and I hope we can work things out.

I'm lucky in that I think she would like it to work out, too. I know the real problems she has with other DILs doesn't stop her from having a friendly relationship with them, even though she isn't necessarily close to them.

But what do you do when it is expected that your children and your family is supposed to be the centre of your world, and so that is how you make it, and then they move away from you and are not dependant on you? What does a person actually DO in those circumstances? Is it actually possible to change your outlook?! I think that is the problem for quite a few MILs. I think we're lucky in that we've got the opportunity of having other things in our lives, children are not the beginning, middle and end of life!

'If she has done her job well he comes to see her and invites her around because he loves her, likes her company and wants to share his life.'

Pisces this is exactly the conversation DH had to have with her. That we didn't NEED her, that we would thrive without her but that we did welcome her to be a part of our family life. BUT she would have to behave appropriately.

Being snidey, rude, manipulative, showing favouritism etc wasn't going to make us rush round to be with her. That it was going to make us run in the opposite direction!

I think for her it is about being the centre of attention. Her mother and daughter are exactly(!) the same which leads me to believe that it is all learned behaviour.

'But what do you do when it is expected that your children and your family is supposed to be the centre of your world, and so that is how you make it, and then they move away from you and are not dependant on you? What does a person actually DO in those circumstances? Is it actually possible to change your outlook?! I think that is the problem for quite a few MILs. '

I would say that it is a problem for a lot! My whole point is that you gradually let go and you do NOT make them the centre of your world. They will always be the most important thing in my life, BUT they have to be left alone in peace to live their own lives. I will be upset if they emigrate to Australia, but you have to wave them off and look for the positives.
You start early-people post on here 'I am devoted to my DCs' as if this is a virtue. The best thing for DCs is to see you having a life for yourself, with hobbies and friends who are not just mummy friends. You need to go out together as a couple (or if a single parent, as I was for some years) and get a baby sitter-it is pathetic to say that you can't go out because you have no family-advertise for a responsible 6th former. People can be trusted to look after your DC and you don't have to be with them at all times!
If you build it up gradually you won't get the empty nest syndrome.
If you do, that is the time to get new interests/job etc and things that don't focus on them.
By the time that you become MIL you should be having an adult relationship with them-where they can do things without telling you and they are able to tell you, in a nice way, that some of your views are rubbish!
If you have stopped living through your DCs then there is less likelihood of you trying to live through your grandchildren. The grandmother may get away with smothering the baby with attention, but the older DC won't like it! DCs will much prefer an interesting grandmother who goes skiing, takes up tap dancing, learns a language etc.

Yes, but many of them didn't have the option of gradually letting go, did they? Most mums of our generation do have the option (and still some won't manage it though!!!) but it was much harder for those of our MIL's generation. Besides, it's a bit late in the day to tell them what they should have done isn't it? They didn't do it, so how do they (and the DILs!) deal with it NOW?

I fit frikonstik's theorum, too. (It's definitely a theorum).

DH's mother is toxic, and we've decided (having been alerted to it by MN) that she has Narcissistic Personality Disorder.

Can't be bothered to even start with the stories. No-one would disagree.

Everyone brings their own agendas to the MIL threads, though.

Even if someone's OP includes the MIL spitting in their face and calling them a cuntmonkey, there will always be someone else along who starts on the 'I'm sure she's perfectly nice and you should be grateful she's in your life' spiel.

Agree about the letting-them-go-gradually stuff, though. (Looks at DS and takes note).

Think you might have nailed it bubbaandbump. I feel constantly guilty because my very nice mil drives me up the wall. She is unerringly polite, always helpful, will not sit down and runs around tidying up and ironing. She has never been unpleasant to me but I still want to scream when she's around (and that's quite a lot as she does stay a week at a time). Think its partly my feeling an inadequate partner for her one and only child and partly that "inferred criticism" which you can't defend yourself against.

Think it might also be some cavewoman territorial thing becos when she told a relative to come and look at "our baby" (my dd)I wanted to rip her head off.
Breathe..calm..

Pisces I agree with your comments about the child being centre of your world.
I get on very well with my MIL, but she had 4 children, and in their teens was more preoccupied with the fact that her relationship was falling apart, so DP went his own way. Now she has a four your old DD who is, essentially, growing up as an only child. And MIL's life revolves around her 'princess' It's the one aspect of MIL that irritates me. All her friends, activities EVERYTHING centres on her princess and it almost strikes me as a bit unhealthy at times. she cannot bear for mini-sil to be out of her sight for five seconds. So I do wonder how she'll manage when princess starts resenting being tied to her mum's side. On the other hand, I think having a child of her own to look after means that she is less bothered about being involved in the raising of DS, so has maybe removed one potential source of tension.

'Yes, but many of them didn't have the option of gradually letting go, did they? '

They were much much better at it-so it is no excuse!
When I was a DD I went out with my friends, and as long as I came back for tea, it was OK-my mother didn't know where I was and I was 9/10yrs at the time. I walked to school by myself from the age of 7yrs. DCs travelled to school on a bus on their own. Parents didn't fuss about reading book grades and think that being on a high level ORT book proves they are a good parent! Any 18 yr old would have been deeply embarrassed to have a parent go on a university open day etc etc! I don't think there was such a thing as a helicopter parent.

There are parents with young DCs today who will be unbearable as MIL!
'Our baby' is an expression and meaningless! Utterly meaningless! I know a new grandmother whose DDs both have a baby-she talks to friends about 'my babies'-she doesn't mean it and isn't in the least interfering.

She would be horrified if anyone took her seriously! Luckily she doesn't have DSs herself -only DDs-or she would have no hope whatsoever!