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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to not want a male worker to take my daughter to the toilet?

551 replies

DebiDean · 25/05/2010 19:03

Hi there,

My daughter wet herself in the nursery toilets yesterday, when I asked her about it at dinner she mentioned that it was a male worker who took her to the toilet. I spoke to a few friends about it who had different opinions about whether it was right or wrong (opinion was a 50/50 split!) and I decided that as I wasn't comfortable with the idea that I would contact the nursery and explain that I would rather a female worker take her to the toilet.

I was very clear with the nursery that I was supportive of having male role models within the nursery however I felt that to maintain my daughters dignity it would be more appropriate for a female worker to take her to the toilet.

I had a rather rude reply accusing me of being discriminative and that they would refuse to discriminate against him.

I was so shocked as I do support men working with children, but felt there should be limitations within that, or the nursery should at least consider my wishes (especially as it costs me £45 a day!!!).

Whats the opinion? Any ideas of what I could/should do?

OP posts:
blinks · 26/05/2010 22:39

i think more than 99% of people reading the thread feel the OP isn't being unreasonable but are too frightened to say so based on the rabble's response.

i'm a long long long term poster here and this thread has upset me. i've seen many an OP being rounded on but never have i seen such cuntishness.

and the thread about this thread is shameful.

today i'm embarrassed to be a mumsnetter.

LadyBiscuit · 26/05/2010 22:47

I don't think that's true blinks, sorry

I'm sorry that so many of you feel that discrimination is acceptable too. It makes me really sad

TiggyD · 26/05/2010 22:51

Yes blinks, 99% of people disagreeing with the OP certainly means 99% of people agree with them. Why would anybody think differently?

blinks · 26/05/2010 23:00

it's not discrimination to be sensitive to the feelings of a 4 year old.

TheCoalitionNeedsYou · 27/05/2010 00:19

It's not about the feelings of a four year old, it's about the feelings of the mother.

blinks · 27/05/2010 00:34

her daughter was uncomfortable and wet herself.

the mother is concerned about this.

she's not keen on him taking her to the toilet.

she's pointed out that she has no problem with him working in the nursery and she has no reason to believe he is sexually abusive.

some children are more shy/nervous than others. if her daughter knew the male worker more and was more familiar with him maybe she would have been comfortable and OP wouldn't feel the same way.

but she wasn't familiar with him and it did make her feel uncomfortable. mum feels that should be respected, as the feelings of an adult would be.

i just don't get the knee jerk reaction thing where everyone piles in accusing her of being prejudiced.

scanty · 27/05/2010 00:44

YANBU in feeling uncomfortable. I'm surprised at replies or are those who agree with the OP staying quiet after seeing the response she got. It may be un PC and discriminatory but I wouldn't feel comfortable with what I would consider, a strange man changing my daughters nappies, dealing with toilet issues ect. Can't help how I feel, probably my Dc's dad is the only male to have that kind of contact with them anyway. Luckily my DC never went to nursery so it was generally me doing all that kind of stuff, maybe that's why I feel funny about a non family member/friend doing it.

CaptainNancy · 27/05/2010 01:10

I am wondering if the OP has introduced the notion of privacy and discretion about bodies because her DD has a step-father, and there was a need to have her act 'appropriately' around a strange male?

gobsmackedetal · 27/05/2010 07:12

Am I right to think that the OP hasn't been on here for at least a day?

stripeyknickersspottysocks · 27/05/2010 07:18

I think OP is being unreasonable. I can see the arguement that an elderly person may not want to be washed/toileted by a person of the opposite gender - they are old enough to be embarrased by this. A 4yo is not. At this age by DD would happily strip off all her clothes at BBQs etc and run about naked infront of all and sundry. She also had a male childminder.

gorionine · 27/05/2010 07:25

I have only read the first ans last page, so do not quite know the sort of answer OP got, from the last few posts I am getting she recieved quite a bashing.

If I am honest for a few seconds I would probably have felt a bit like op but then I would have given myself a good "slap" for being a bit OTT. There is no difference strictly speaking between a female nursery worker changing/helping in the toiler a boy and a male nursery worker changing/helping in the toilet a girl. Why brand a man working in a nusery "a strange man"? he is not a strange man, he is her nursery worker.

I think it becomes really sad when as a society we regard everything male as threatening for our children.

Oblomov · 27/05/2010 08:32

blinks - "i think more than 99% of people reading the thread feel the OP isn't being unreasonable but are too frightened to say so based on the rabble's response."

this is so untrue. most people do agree thta shes being unreasonable. and to makle such a silly comment, turning around saying thta everyone (99%) think she is, but are too scared to say. thta very comment undermines yiour credibility, becasue its just such nonsense its ridiculous.
do you think most MN'ers have so little backbone, that they would allow that to happen ? Not me. Give me some credit. Thats just not true.

And then you get people like someone like scanty :"It may be un PC and discriminatory but I wouldn't feel comfortable with what I would consider, a strange man changing my daughters nappies, dealing with toilet issues ect. Can't help how I feel."
yes, you are right. it is irrauional, unreasoable, discriminatory. but thats how you feel. oh thtas o.k. then .

same old, same ole.
you can't debate with such nonsense. its impossible. they admit its bigoted and irrational and then expect us to just say, but if thtas how you feel its o.k. no. its not o.k. its bigoted and discriminatory. you've just admitted thta it is. so how can you justify it to yourself ?

blinks · 27/05/2010 08:57

i meant actually that more than 1% probably think she's not being unreasonable.

bambipie · 27/05/2010 09:18

This is the stupidest, nastiest thread I have seen on MN.

So many people, so smug and 'I'm so fantastically liberal, tolerant and completely without prejudice' yet prepared to tell someone they don't know, who is new to MN, that she has or will 'screw up her daughter' because she is nervous of being with a man she doesn't know. WTF? Get a grip folks and have a little empathy.

I repeat, do none of you remember being four and a bit shy?

LadyBiscuit · 27/05/2010 10:20

sigh All people are trying to say is that if your child has an unreasonable reaction to a nursery worker because they are not what they are used to (be that whether they are a different race/wear a headscarf/have a big wart on their nose/are male) then it is up to us as parents to challenge those prejudices (yes, even in a 4 year old!) and not pander to them.

Just because this is about a man doesn't make it any less about a fear of the unknown than any of those other examples. And no less acceptable

TiggyD · 27/05/2010 12:38

From the OP
"she mentioned that it was a male worker who took her to the toilet...and I decided that as I wasn't comfortable with the idea"

"...I felt that to maintain my daughters dignity it would be more appropriate for a female worker to take her to the toilet."

The thread wasn't about her daughters view on men at nursery, but her mothers.

sarah293 · 27/05/2010 17:29

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

jangly · 27/05/2010 19:30

It doesn't matter if its pc or not. It doesn't matter if its discriminatory or not. The feelings of the male nursery worker do not matter in this instance. All that matters is the feelings of a little four year old. She is the only important one here. And if she doesn't like it - Final!

mrsbean78 · 27/05/2010 19:52

When we go to the toilet in public places, women go to 'the ladies' and men go to 'the men's'.

This is expected and allowable in our society and culture. Public toilets have notices on the doors if men are likely to be cleaning so that women are alerted to why a man might be in the toilet (in case they are concerned or it is religiously or culturally difficult for them to see a man in the toilets).

This was not a toddler, it was a little girl. Perhaps her 'grand issue' with a man taking her to the toilet stems from an understanding that outside of the house there is a 'ladies' and a 'mens'.

This is NOT the same as race.

AnyFuleKno · 27/05/2010 19:52

I agree with the OP! There is a lot of hysteria on this thread. For goodness sake, when you're little and used to your primary care, toileting, nappy changes being done by a woman by the way, I can understand how the little girl might prefer not to have a man take her to the loo.

I remember when I was little and men looked like giants to me, I think I would have probably peed myself too in that situation!

I totally agree jangly, if the little girl doesn't like it then that should be enough, and the nursery should respect your wishes.

nappyaddict · 27/05/2010 21:09

Riven When DD was at nursery were any of the staff male and if so did you let them change her nappy then as she would have been at an age where they don't really have dignity?

Journey · 27/05/2010 21:33

So for all those people who say it is discrimination then what you're saying is that nobody has a right to a personal preference when it comes to intimate/dignity issues. That's shocking, and a total misuse of the word discrimination. The op should have a right to choose what is best for her DD when it involves such issues.

scanty · 27/05/2010 22:49

Oblomov 'And then you get people like someone like scanty :"It may be un PC and discriminatory but I wouldn't feel comfortable with what I would consider, a strange man changing my daughters nappies, dealing with toilet issues ect. Can't help how I feel."
yes, you are right. it is irrauional, unreasoable, discriminatory. but thats how you feel. oh thtas o.k. then'

Keep your hair on woman, I really don't give a toss what you think! By the way I also tell my young kids to approach a woman rather than a man if they ever get lost - this will probably make you apoplectic, oh the discrimination!

blinks · 27/05/2010 23:42

i always say if lost approach an older woman if possible. oh and my husband says the same thing.

ageism and sexism. to the gallows!....

maryz · 27/05/2010 23:44

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.