to let my 16 month old wander round a quiet tea room...

[GumtreeGirl]

...rather than keep him in his pushchair or high chair when he's bored and fidgety?

Scenario today: a quiet NT tea room with a couple of friends with toddlers the same age. We'd sat round with snacks/ teas for 15 minutes or so, then DS having hoovered up all the snacks I'd brought started getting fidgety and asked (gestured - he's not talking yet) to get down.

The tea room was quiet - there were two other groups in there, one couple and another family group. DS wandered about, had an explore, didn't disturb anyone else either physically or noisily, then came back and started playing next to me with the toys that were supplied there. I kept an eye on him the whole time, and if he'd started disturbing anyone or making a noise I would have brought him back to our table.

One of my friends then let her son down, and he also wanted to explore but she then made a huge deal about not letting him - "I don't like him running around - he can run around at home, but not somewhere like here". My other friend then said "But he gets fed up in his pushchair, right?", to which the answer was "Yes, but tough, he has to learn he can't just wander around".

So I was left feeling v. uncomfortable and implicitly criticised for being a Bad Feckless Mother.

Personally, I (obviously!)feel that it's OK for a small toddler to wander around, supervised, if he's not disturbing anyone, and that at 16 months, 30 minutes of enforced sitting still is an eternity. I certainly would aim to start teaching him when he's a little older that he can't just get down and race around, particularly if others are disturbed, but right now his comprehension isn't there, and sitting still would mean he'd complain, noisily, which would be more disruptive to everyone else.

So, am I a Bad Feckless Mother, or OK to let him do this, for now? And what age did you start instilling the 'Sit nicely at the table' rule?

"The idea of 'inflicting' your child on the general public? What a strange way to look at children"

I think that really means inflicting responsibility for her child's safety on others, rather than the presence of her child IYKWIM

I'm happy to have a little chat with a passing accompanied toddler, but I am on edge if I am the physically nearest adult and am ready to jump up if they go to grab something dangerous off the table or if the waitress doesn't see them. I feel a duty of care has been inflicted on me to keep hot drinks etc away from reach at the edge of the table. If mum/dad goes on the toddle with them I don't give it much of a second thought

I think the unreasonable bit is deciding that somebody who does things differently to you is criticising you. I think you're being way over defensive on that score.

Personally I wouldn't let a small child wander around and I would happily say this in front of somebody who did let their child wander round. It's just different ways of doing things isn't it. It's like that old joke, 'How can you tell if somebody is calling you a bad mother? Their lips move'.

I'm pg just now and I have had to give up loads - alcohol, sleeping tablets, travel etc. When DC arrives (safely I hope) I will continue to have to do without certain things for a while, and for me personally, having tea room chats with other adults is one of them. I'll live with that until my kid is old enough to not need to wander etc.

Spot on salbysea.

Kids are lovely, they aren't monsters to be inflicted on anybody. But the duty of care for them is the parent's or carers, not whatever random adult is nearest to them as they wander.

I can't relax with a small child tottering towards me, suddenly I am responsible for that child.

YANBU or a feckless mother - it is your choice. The other lady may have been feeling just a criticised and there is no need, it is just different strokes...

I would never let a 16 month old wander round a tea room however quiet it was though. I would not let them out of the pram or I would let them wander around our chairs and table. I wouldn't be concerned about him pestering people though, I'd be concerned about him getting scalded on hot drinks. I doubt we'd be in a tea room with a 16 month old long enough for them to get significantly bored though, too much like hard work and tea rooms bore me.

Isn't it also about collective agreement/responsibility? If your child will toddle about happily not disturbing anyone but your friend's child would zoom around like a whirling dervish, wouldn't it be kinder to either keep yours sitting up or go somewhere where her child can roam without bothering anyone?

Agree with all who've said hot drinks + toddlers = potential disaster

No wandering here sorry. I don't mind when other people do it (unless the kid becomes my problem in some way), but my kids are not allowed.

I also like my tea/coffee boiling hot and order it that way so a tea room/coffee shop is possibly the worst of places.

I am (wrongly?) in the let them wander camp. Thats why I dont get out much.!!! as it can feel like people are frowning

I HATE HATE HATE seing toddlers strapped in buggies for hours, I think its mean

so in a quiet tea room? YANBU

Who spends hours in tea rooms?

YABU, although not a Bad Feckless Mother.

Cafes and restaurants are simply not safe environments, as many others here have stated.

If you are carrying a large tray (or a small one for that matter) it can be nigh on impossible to see a small child - they are simply not in your line of sight. I am assuming that the NT tearoom is a self service place, which is even worse. People carrying their own hot drinks (or any other food or drink for that matter) are even less likely to be aware of the risks than waitstaff.

I'm all for allowing dcs to wander around, just not in places that aren't safe.

YABU.Cafes/tearooms/restaurants etc aren't a suitable place for children to wander around.

It's dangerous when there are staff moving back and forward with hot food and drinks. IThe child could be scalded or have a plate or dish land on their head.

It's also dangerous for the staff or customer who has to try and dodge a toddler.
I've seen a staff member end up in a heap on the floor, having injured herself as a result of trying to dodge a child who was running around.

I think it's also inconsiderate for customers who have also have to dodge your toddler.

I really don't want to interact or have a conversation with your child while I'm trying to enjoy my meal/talk to the person I'm with.
I realise that you would intervene in that situation but some people wouldn't and it can be very irritating.

"I HATE HATE HATE seing toddlers strapped in buggies for hours, I think its mean"

that's not the only alternative to letting them roam on their own
there were other options available to the OP, like:

• go with them on their toddle
• get down on the floor in the toy area with them and keep them entertained there

your being over-sensitive. She could probably claim you were making a big deal about letting yours run around and trying to imply she was a bad mother for keeping hers in her chair.
You are just assuming she was making a point when in fact you just do things differently.

What Salbysea said. I have got to the stage where I don't want to be worrying about someone's toddler and my cup of tea. I have been there and done that and am hugely relieved I'm past that stage.

Our local NT cafe has a little area tucked safely to he side where toddlers can have a little potter if hey have had enough sitting at the table.

Not read whole thread, but I would say YABU.

A quiet tea room would be the last place I would let my toddler roam. Firstly, your idea of causing a nuisance and others may differ. Secondly - what if he knocked into a table/ waiter etc where there were hot drinks? Thirdly - how do you expect your toddler to understand why he was allowed to roam one week and not the next (when you do start teaching the sitting at the table nicely)

What worked for me in this situation was keeping a little bag of toys to one side. I would then bring this out in a restaurant. Bought me a good 45 mins to 1 hour. After that, I would expect a toddler to get restless and leave anyway. But I pretty much started the staying at the table rule from day one.

What I meant re the 'bag of toys to one side' was keeping a stash in the back of the car so that DS hadnt played with them for a while. The novelty of having them back kept him occupied.

I scalded myself as a waitress it's very,very easily done. Also
you can't see over trays piled high with plates so could easily trip over a toddler.

I'm afraid once you have kids your days of sitting chatting to friends for hours in cafes are on hold for a while.

I don't like seeing toddlers trapped in buggies for hours which is why I'd never plan sitting with friends in a quiet NT cafe as part of the day-it's no fun for a toddler after he's eaten his cake.Maybe it is for you but not for him after he's presumably exhausted the entertainment value in his toys and books.

I'm all for older kids learning to sit properly at tables but 16 months is too young,wandering around cafes and restaurants is not an option imho. You could have always taken him outside.

What is NT?

NT is National Trust

I would have let mine wander in OP's situation.
I would never had any social life at all if I didn't!
I reckon 16 months is a bit young for them to learn much of anything about social conventions.

I used to take boxes of raisins,books,Duplo blocks,little cars etc,a ball of playdough,tin foil to buy me time. I also always did the sitting nicely at tables but I think 16 months is too young to expect much after eating is over and books/toys have been looked at.

By 3 mine used to realise they'd have to sit quietly for longer after eating but it was a gradual process,slowly lengthened. I never tolerated noise or silliness(would take out immediately wherever we were,never walked around the dining room but did outside).

By 4 mine would understand they'd be frogmarched out and told off if they didn't sit quietly and do the things I'd brought and could sit through a 3 course meal with breaks for a wee/quick stroll outside.

Mine are 6,6 and 5 now and will respond to glares and hissing now if they make any noise. I take very small things to amuse but they're starting to chat and now they can all read and write they can read the menu and play hangman etc.

I think you need to start as you mean to go on but in the early days you need to realise their limitations and build up the sitting still time. Treating a cafe as a creche is never an option in my book,there are plenty of soft play areas for that.If you start letting them roam around they'll think it's correct behavior for cafes-it isn't.

Sorry but you did post in aibu.

My children sat in a highchair or buggy. I don't let them wander around cafe or eateries but I don't judge others who do.

I did it because I like children to understand that a cafe is not an extention of a park and that they are not entitled to play anywhere they chose. We are there to sit and eat or drink and chat. I always had something in my bag that they could play with. Luckily for me they got the idea quickly as children tend to accept the rules once they know them

I do remember though sitting in a cafe with DS2 who was about 7 and DD who was about 18months and they were both sitting having their drinks and we were chatting. On a table next to us a woman was struggling with a child of about three who wasn't going to sit and was rolling about on the floor.

A guy on the table next to her suggested she control him and she snapped 'he isn't doing any harm - they arn't all little goody goodys like those two'

The irony of DS2 ( severe ASD ) being described as a goody goody was hilarious .

For us - implementing that rule early has meant that DS2 was able to 'get it' and DD folowed suit. Their not being allowed to wander means we can go out to eat and we can fly without DS2 expecting to be allowed to wander etc etc.

I don't have a problem with wandering toddlers - but I hope other people judging those of us who are teaching our children that wandering isn't allowed can recognise that there is an upside that we think is worth it