to be in disbelief that this is being shown?

[RydellHigh]

Lady Gaga's new vid...

www.youtube.com/watch?v=GQ95z6ywcBY&feature=PlayList&p=C4B9C7326E087E89&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL& index=1

I personally love Lady Gaga, but felt very uncomfortable when this came on the tv today, my little sister was visiting and I had to switch it over. I watched the video online and loved it, but I can't believe they are showing it during the day. The only thing missing from the edited version is the swearing and the close up of her lady bits!

World gone mad

I love it though.

I have also just read a lot of the previous comments and instead of talking about the issue of whether it should be on MTV at a certain and its suitability for children, it has become a debate on the exploitation of woman etc, that is not what it is about and having watched both versions in the video there is nothing that suggests that anyway

I believe, getting back to the issue, that we should as a society take more responsibility for the youth and not just rely on the parents. It is immpossible to censor these sorts of things when it is plasterd all over the place. I beleive children however should be introduced to "sex and relationships" at a younger age but porn and these videos do not represent this and actually make it worse. Shockingly violence in teenage relationships has risen ridiculously in the past few years and I can, after watching MTV, see the connection because kids are aspiring to something which isnt real.

Yes Vicar, she is 3 and loves music unfortunately can't have her watching it anymore because I am scared of which obviously catchy tune is going to grab her next, Rhianna Rude Boy is another one. (oh and its not just MTV, radio can be just as bad, guess I'll have to stick to BBC 4 lol.)

I think this PC state has gone bonkers though. Why cant we legislate during the day and at night it can be free. I hate how comidians etc are being censored, if you dont like it dont watch it!

BOF -how i am caricaturing whats going on?

by saying parents have the responsibility for what their children see?

BOF i have to say the hypocrisy floors me but i think that is probably another debate all together.

you are asking do we get the culture we deserve -
i read the 'plumber' thread that you started, ive re read it tonight in fact, i was naturally thinking about what you had said and decided to look at the wider debate on caricaturing (and stereotyping) and i think the answer to your question on whether we get the culture we deserve may well be yes we do. i dont particularly want a nanny state but fail to see how you can accuse me of caricaturing? i find that a little baffling all things considered. i would have said some of your posts are more dubious than mine in that respect.

perhaps we will have to agree to disagree on this one.

Day and night are rapidly becoming meaningless anyway. The internet is 24 hour and the TV and internet technologies are pretty much merging. With Tivo, DVDs, international channels etc. there's no guarantee that people will watch anything at the 'intended' time.

Much better to get people in the habit of exercising sensible control over their viewing habits (or just separating out channels into family and non-family viewing).

I do like the US channel Palladium. It's a bit like Jools Holland - lots of live shows, unplugged performances etc. All about the music.

What amazes me is that this video has been hailed by some as the "Thriller" for the noughties generation.

Just makes me wonder if they have actually seen Thriller.

This is such crap. What depresses me is that our kids might think this is in any way creative or groundbreaking.

I consider a thread with sexual content and obvious humpour on MUMSNET (an adult site) to be worlds away from semi-porn and violence in music videos shown pre-watershed when children are likely to be watching, Vicar. By your own logic, if you don't like something I have written, please feel free to hide it or whatever. But it sounds a bit odd to me to be bringing up old posts of mine to add to our point of view.

I was trying to make the point that this thread had covered a wide range of views and touched on some quite big themes which go beyond just what time a pop video is aired, and I felt that you wanted to reduce the debate to "If you don't like it, don't watch and shut up", as if all the contributions had asked for Lady Gaga to join the Tweenies to keep mothers happy.

But yes, we can agree to disagree- especially noe you have made this sound rather personal, I would prefer not to discuss it any more.

very interesting article with gaga's love interest in the vid there kerry.

she clearly thinks that it is political. in a good way. and i loved that last comment from her about the kid in kansas who had never seen any kind of a queer depiction in mainstream media seeing that and asking questions...

Sophable
Don't you think that the kid from Kansas who has questions in his/her mind about his/her sexuality is going to be scared to death after seeing that video?

I don't think that this helps homosexuals in any way. The homophobics will see it as a further indication of why they are against homosexuality.

Why should we as parents bear the responsibility to police not only our children's tv viewing, internet access (which we do anyway) but also anywhere where they might come across videos portraying porn-like images.

It is no longer possible. Ask any mother of a teenager, they are being sent these videos (and lots worse) on their mobiles.

It is not about censorship. The problem I have with such videos is that they bring porn into our living rooms.

How on earth is a light hearted, slightly racy thread on a parenting forum related to not wanting your children to watch scantily clad women thrusting their vaginas into a camera in the name of a music video, Vicar?

I have stopped having music channels on at home, which is a shame as I loved dancing around to them with my boys. I don't want them to see the vast majority of videos that are on mainstream TV at all times of the day.

Children grow up too quickly as it is and copy what they see on TV. While I can protect my children from these images, I will. I wouldn't let them read a Friday night bumsex thread either!

why would it scare him/her? why does it do homosexuals a disservice? have you read that article that kerry linked to? i really disagree with you mmeL...does david lachapelle do homosexuals a disservice? this is tongue in cheek ref leigh bowery, marvel comics and depicts lesbians is an attractive and fierce light. it's not intended for sensible shoe wearing grownups but for kids!

now shall i tell you all how much it cost and we can get into the total immorality of that (because it is)?

800K. 400K recouped in product placement (virgin mobiles/diet coke/a famous american mayo brand and there are 2 more i can't remember), 200K from the artist and 200K from the lable which they have already recouped from youtube views.

lizzy...FAR FAR better scantily clad women thrusting their vulvas (i think) at the camera than being depicted as so much window dressing for the male star of the video.

considering the main fodder on mtv, this is positively fantastic role modelling tbh.

Sophable, I don't want them seeing either, not yet.
I cannot understand why talented and intelligent women need to get their kit off and writhe around for their videos. This is not talking about the Lady Gaga video so much I suppose. But music videos in general.

I am not a prude at all, I just don't want my 6 and 4 year old boys thinking that that is what women do. That it is the norm.

Sophable
For a kid from the bible belt of Kansas, realising that he is homosexual is going to be a big problem, and a scary one at that. Much more so than a boy the same age in a metropolitan city such as London, where it is more acceptable to be gay.

My friend is American and she has gay friends who are from the midwest and found it very very difficult to come out as they knew that their parents would take it incredibly badly.

Seeing this kind of video would solidify the arguments of their parents against them. It is a very 'Soddom and Gommorah' kind of picture that is being painted. If liberals in UK are shocked by it, what do you think that the extreme conservative religious right in America will think of it?

btw, I am not saying that this is a reason to censor the video.

I just don't agree with the statement that it is great for 'kid in Kansas' to see what being gay is like.

This is not what being gay is like. None of my gay friends strip to their undies and dance around.

now you're talking, sophable. I was much more at the product placement than the content

wrt to music tv in general- yes, it's not suitable for kids, being directed at teenagers. And yes if you feel your kids are likely to be prematurely sexualised by the content, don't let them watch.

My main problem with them is tha there are looooads of videos around that show women either in the context of pussy, or desperate/after some man. I don't see many strong women, or women I'm comfortable for my dds to watch (have to say I don't often watch for those reasons, so I might be wrong- things could have Moved On). Lily Allen is a pretty rare exception and the only one that springs to mind.

This stuff obviously works to flog units to kids. I think we are getting the culture we deserve, as someone said upthread, and we ought to be fighting it, and getting our dcs of both sexes to query it/ think about it.

As I think I've already said, I have less of a problem with Gaga here than any amount of Britneys or Katy Perrys wrt my dcs viewing

Sorry to come in so late, but to me the sexuality in this video is not aimed at men. I think it is very much all Lady GaGa.

However I think the most recent britney video '3' is a disgusting example of sexualised music aimed at men, it is very seedy and I saw it shown all through the day on the music channels. And the problem with this is it will not only make boys expect this kind of behaviour, but girls will feel as though they should be doing it. I think this is the kind of thing that is worrying in that way, and don't think gaga's video is the same somehow.

Here is the Britney one, '3'

www.youtube.com/watch?v=QubWKLQUrN0

Ok I have been avoiding this thread, because I haven't managed to link to the video until now!

TBH it wasn't as shocking as I thought it would be, it was Tarantino-ish (I agree with Dittany - a cock) with a bit of John Waters (albeit lacking the humour)thrown in, and a lot of fetishistic/porn imagery to wrap it all up in.

The things about it which I really loathed though were

the blatant product placement

the whole men are all a bunch of dicks to be put down by dominatrix women shit, which is what a lot of this 'taking your clothes of to prove how empowered and in control you are' schtick seems to revolve around.

As Mme Lindt so succinctly put it earlier - 'wank fodder'

eeeeew, cupcake

that is truly awful (only watched the first bit as don't want dcs peering over my shoulder!)- and exactly what I mean.

Interesting to note as well that all the comments below the clip are about her appearance/weight rather than the song

Very interesting article Kerry from Heather Cassils, especially re a point we've discussed here, that of Lady gaga 'borrowing' from gay culture and adopting the bisexual claim for an edgy appeal.

I don't think it does gay people a disservice really. Stylistically it is really good. But I don't think it is hugely different in basic appeal to Tatu or Madonna/Britney or Katy Perry, even though stylistically more striking.

LOL at vid costing 800k. Most indie feature films these days would dream of having that budget, for 2 hours of film, not 10 mins.

so sophable the label have withdrawn the vid from YouTube now for copyright reasons. So did they keep it up till they recouped some costs I wonder?

God, that Britney video is boring. Did I watch the right one? (link did not work). And the song is shite.

I can't believe you are still talking about a LGG video..

This is like the Boys from Brazil..

100's of Mary Whitehouse clones must have been created and unleashed on MN...