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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To expect DD to go to university?

256 replies

WashwithCare · 19/01/2010 20:50

Chatting away on an unrelated issue, I uttered the immortal words "when DD goes to universtiy"... another mother immediately jumped in. She chided that I couldn't just "assume" DD would either want or be able to go to university..

DD is 3 and has just started pre-school. However, I definitely do ASSUME she will go to University, and not just any University, but a "good" one to boot. Preferably to do a 'proper' subject.

AIBU?

OP posts:
Original poster
WashwithCare · 19/01/2010 21:34

By MollieO Tue 19-Jan-10 21:29:10
WWC have you name changed from Xenia?

No - I have only ever posted as WWC

What will you do if your dd isn't bright enough to go to a 'good' university? Will you have her adopted?

No, of course not. Hopefully we will realise things aren't going well and be able to act early on - change schools perhaps?
Do some home schooling? address what other problems are impeding progress?

OP posts:
cory · 19/01/2010 21:35

WashwithCare Tue 19-Jan-10 21:25:46

"Speaking as a former tutor at a Russell Group University, I would say, that given her priviledged background, if she can't manage to get a place in a half-way decent uni, she ought to get her butt soundly kicked."

I hate to say it but I see a fair few students from priviledged backgrounds who come to grief after the first semester because they simply haven't got the ability. Being an old softie, I sweat my guts out trying to provide extra (unpaid) tuition to explain again and again concepts that they simply are not getting. It is horribly hard when they sit sobbing in your office and you have to find an acceptable way of phrasing that 'I have seen no evidence that you actually have what we are looking for'. Kicking their butts seems rather unfair.

And why should she have her butt kicked if she finds that she would rather be a carpenter or work in a bookshop? I know people who are very happy doing that.

CatJosephine · 19/01/2010 21:35

YANBU. I assume my children will go to university. They are only 5 and 3 and god only knows whether they will be academic or not.

My parents expected us to go to good universities and we did, as did all my cousins and DH's family.

Not all of us were academic but going to university is considered in our family as the natural step after school.

cory · 19/01/2010 21:37

And WWC what will you do if the problem impeding progress is that she isn't academically gifted? You may be able to tutor her into university- but she's still got to be able to do the course without having her hand held; she has to write those essays, the thinking has got to come from her.

Original poster
WashwithCare · 19/01/2010 21:37

How rude can you be about Luton uni - if you really were a university tutor you should know better.

How rude can I be? Err.. is that a challenge... I guess not

I hate to burst your bubble, but I think you'll find that as awful lot of Univeristy Professors, Lecturers, Readers and Whatnots would be rather disparaging about post 92 institutions...

OP posts:
Jux · 19/01/2010 21:38

I hoped dd would want to go to Uni when she was small. ATM, I am assuming she will, because she wants to become an egyptologist and so she'll have to. However, I am quite prepared for her to become a hairdresser/singer/artist/layabout instead.

GypsyMoth · 19/01/2010 21:39

i agree,university is about alot more than the degreee you get at the end of it.

cory · 19/01/2010 21:39

I am a Fellow, as it so happens, but I wouldn't personally be rude about anything until I had actually checked out the details.

cory · 19/01/2010 21:42

So WWC, what do you think my parents should have done when their eldest made it clear that he neither the inclination to go to university nor any particular academic ability? ((They tutored him at home for many years- and made him quite unhappy in the process). How many years should they have kept kicking his butt? Can they give up now that he is 50?

And what about my youngest who left to pursue his big passion in life, resulting in a lucrative business which is helping to keep them in their own age? Should they refuse his offers of help on principle and tell him to join the circus?

Original poster
WashwithCare · 19/01/2010 21:43

Cory
I hate to say it but I see a fair few students from priviledged backgrounds who come to grief after the first semester because they simply haven't got the ability. Being an old softie, I sweat my guts out trying to provide extra (unpaid) tuition to explain again and again concepts that they simply are not getting. It is horribly hard when they sit sobbing in your office and you have to find an acceptable way of phrasing that 'I have seen no evidence that you actually have what we are looking for'. Kicking their butts seems rather unfair.

Yes - good point... they used to sit at the back of my classes brushing their hair...

the only solution is to send them to do physiotheraphy or marketing...

No ne'er mind, even the ya's are going to get a 2:2 (or a 2:1 if you have smile sweetly)... and it's probably more painful for you than them.... they are having a great time playing houses in Daddy's flat and getting high on recreational drugs...

OP posts:
MollieO · 19/01/2010 21:45

WWC think you have missed the point. No amount of good schooling can make a child bright enough to go to university if they just aren't intelligent. Good schooling can increase the marks but if your dd is destined for Ds rather than As no amount of extra tuition will make enough of a difference.

When I went to uni only 3% of school leavers did. Now it is about 50% and that includes the less 'good' universities. What if your dd is in the percentage that just can't get the grades to get into university?

LouIsOnAHighwayToHell · 19/01/2010 21:49

WashWithCare - I have a Bachelors in History and Politics and a Masters in Law. Ok so it's not vet science but what I meant that having a degree will get you fame and fortune. I know that my brother will always have work his entire life. Me on the other hand cannot work in my chosen field due to certain issues. Uni for the sake of uni is a waste of time and money. Having a skill is what saved me. I trained as a nanny before uni and it has got me a job whenever I needed one.

Original poster
WashwithCare · 19/01/2010 21:49

Well if he's 50, it was really a different deal - I assume we are talking uni 30 years ago?

When I went to Uni over 20 yrs ago, only 5% of leavers made it, and of them only about 3% got firsts... Now, it's nearer 50% and about 15% are getting firsts...

Tim Nice But Dim will not be alone...

Would you use the same argument (child is not bright) to give up on School before aged 16. My parents did that to my brother, who they decided would be happier working...

Where do you draw the line?

OP posts:
cory · 19/01/2010 21:49

Really, do you imagine none of my students ever fail the exam despite working hard, WWC? Where is the point of a Russell Group University, if we were that soft? Of course students fail for all sorts of reasons. And not infrequently because try as they might, they haven't got the ability. And that includes some who did quite well at A-level. University is actually more demanding than A-level. It is meant to be.

Smiling sweetly doesn't come into it: I mark blind and my second-marker has never set eyes on them.

86Pinkle · 19/01/2010 21:52

It's definatley a personal choice, I went to a state school and college. Alot of my friends went to a grammar school and sixth form and came from well off backgrounds. They were expected to go to university and my parents we just happy if i went to work after college - however I'm the one with the accounting degree and my friends from grammar schools are still working in shops. I don't think any less of them for this uni just wasn't for them and you can't expect it will be for your children either.

eatsshootsleaves · 19/01/2010 21:53

You are not unreasonable to hope that she will go to university but the choice is hers when the time comes. It is not a bad thing as someone has said for wanting her to go but planning her career for her is taking a bit far.

You are being presumptious however because university is not for everyone and I do not believe that it is a right. Nothing to do with what background you are from before anyone accuses me of being elitist but there are far too many people going into university for the wrong reasons and are graduating with debts and struggling to get "proper graduate" jobs. .

Original poster
WashwithCare · 19/01/2010 21:54

When I went to uni only 3% of school leavers did. Now it is about 50% and that includes the less 'good' universities. What if your dd is in the percentage that just can't get the grades to get into university?

What a silly suggestion! Exams aren't an innate measure of intelligence. You can be coached to pass them. If you go to an independent school, your chances of getting good grades is far highter.

The probability of a baby going to university can basically be quite accurately predicted if you know the parental educaiton and income. Sorry - sad, but true!

OP posts:
NotAnOtter · 19/01/2010 21:55

it is a class/cultural thing

i do not know of anyone whose kids are not at least looking to go .... seriously ... most kids go

MollieO · 19/01/2010 21:56

WWC by the time your dd reaches school age it will be compulsory to stay at school until she is 18. School is not selective - you don't have to pass an exam or have qualifications to gain admission. You do for university. Your argument about leaving school at 16 makes no sense in the context of going to university.

Olifin · 19/01/2010 21:57

Hee hee WWC.

You are either very bored or annoyed that I [biscuited] ed the last 2 pages of your breast feeding/breast cancer thread.

You want a bit of a rumpus, n'est-ce-pas?

MogTheForgetfulCat · 19/01/2010 21:58

It's privileged, not priviledged, you numpty. Sheesh, I guess the Russell Group isn't all it's cracked up to be

I am a former tutor at a Russell Group uni (yes, in a proper subject!) as well and don't feel the need to disparage post-92 institutions at all.

2010aQuintessentialOdyssey · 19/01/2010 21:59

Yanbu. I think you have a lot in common with my dad, judging by your threads here. He is 82, though.

He expected my older sister to do a sivil engineering degree and take over his business. He was very disappointed when she did a 7 year long engineering degree, but in a totally different field that he wanted to. She even did work experience at a space agency in Germany!

He was not disappointed in me when I studied classical greek philosophy to master level. How could he be? He never expected anything much from me. (I was the pretty one )

My point is, expecting anything in particular from your children, means you are likely to set yourself up for disappointment.

cory · 19/01/2010 21:59

Yes, WWC but getting in is not the end, is it? Where is the point of getting in if you then find you can't do it?

As for the accurate prediction- only 50% accuracy in the case of my parents, wasn't there? You still haven't explained if they should be kicking their sons' butts for having happy and successful careers without degrees.

My colleague's dd (professor, wife teacher, dd educated privately at best school in town) still chose to work in a stationer's instead of going to uni. Not a lot her parents could do about that. You can lead a horse to water...

saintlydamemrsturnip · 19/01/2010 22:01

You need very high a level grades to get into physio so I doubt your no hoper students would get in op. ( no axe to grind - I did a traditional subject at a top university).

I have no idea whether my children will go to university. I know barring a miracle ds1 won't ( he's 10 years old and has one word). Ds2 and ds3 will hopefully do whatever makes them happiest.

God I'm pleased we have him to give us perspective.

Olifin · 19/01/2010 22:03

WWC:

As a former tutor at a Russell Group University, would you say that your daughter's likelihood of going to University might be impeded my her mother's inability to spell privileged?

Are you sure you are a former University tutor?