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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think that a child with SEN should not be exempt from some attempt at behaviour control.

185 replies

NaccetyMac · 12/12/2009 20:14

Today at a fete, a small child took a toy from my DS1 and was playing with it. I told him (pleasantly) that it was DS1's toy and asked for it back. His mother turned around from her (clearly very important) convo to at me and say "he's disabled, he don't understand." And make no attempt to take the toy from the child.
So I explained to him again that it was not his toy, found him another toy to replace it with, gave it to him and took DS1's toy away out of sight. Mother turns around and says (again) "HE'S DISABLED, HE DON'T UNDERSTAND."

OK. SO get off your bum, stop ignorning him and HELP him to understand.

Really angers me, that some people appear to think that an additional need gives them carte blanche to ignore behaviour and totally fail to apply boundaries!

OP posts:
WrigglingAndJiggling · 12/12/2009 20:22

I aggree with you, but this thread is going to turn into a fight ...

BoysAreLikeDogs · 12/12/2009 20:24

oh dear

yabu

I expect the child didn't 'look disabled' yes?

Alambil · 12/12/2009 20:25

I agree

I was in sainsburys the other day with my nan at the till and infront of us were 2 kids in their trolley seats. The brother was a gorgeous boy that kept pulling his sister's hair and the mum told him off

She looked at us and said "just because he's disabled doesn't mean he can get away with it!" to which we replied in the affirmative... I think she was trying to justify her reaction which is just as sad as not helping the children understand at a level they can, if they can at all, IMO

Glitterknickaz · 12/12/2009 20:26

Sometimes, depending on the form of SN, the child genuinely will not understand. You could explain until you are blue in the face but they still won't understand.

FWIW what you did sounds pretty good.

Most parents of SN kids however DON'T ignore behaviour. Applying boundaries can be pretty much nigh on impossible but with close supervision then hopefully most major anti social behaviour can be prevented or steered away from where it could cause harm.

jobhuntersrus · 12/12/2009 20:26

Well she had no need to be rude to you. Surely all she needed to do was give the toy back and apologise on his behalf.
SEN covers such a wide range of needs and it is totally possible that he genuinely won't understand so you must make allowances for that. Still no need for his mum to not intervene though.

MrsMattie · 12/12/2009 20:27

Depends. If a child genuinely doesn't understand why something is wrong because of his/her disability, maybe the onus is on all the adults around, not just his/her mother, to make allowances for that once they are aware of the situation.

MollieO · 12/12/2009 20:29

I think whether or not the child understands is completely irrelevant. He took something that belonged to another child and the mother should have given it back to you rather than doing nothing. I wonder what she would have done if your ds had started crying?

stillenacht · 12/12/2009 20:29

My son has severe autism. He doesn't look disabled but he certanily can't be helped or made to understand - I have been trying for 6 years now and its got me practically no where . I think you need to have a little more understanding in that regard. If the mum has said he is disabled leave it at that. I do understand a little however where you are coming from though as in my others sons class there is a boy with ADHD and the school are just so scared of his parents that they let him get away with blue murder to the detriment of my other sons education.

MollieO · 12/12/2009 20:30

I should add that I wouldn't have an issue with the mother explaining why her ds took the toy in the first place but to do nothing when this was pointed out is pretty poor behaviour on her part.

stillenacht · 12/12/2009 20:31

I would swap the brain of my autistic child for a naughty one ANY day of the week - there is a difference between being naughty and having a disability.

Original poster
NaccetyMac · 12/12/2009 20:31

Just so I'm not accused of an AIBU by stealth, I should point out that I am a teacher of kids with additional needs. I had clocked that the kid had some kind of issue before I spoke to him (I'm guessing ASD.) FWIW, DS1 has additional needs of his very own too. I am most certainly not ignorant about the subject! What I am objecting to is not the child - not in any way. It is the mother's assumption that because her child is "disabled" that she didn't have to do anything about his behaviour.

OP posts:
MollieO · 12/12/2009 20:32

But isn't the issue here that the SEN/disabled child took someone else's toy and didn't give it back and the mother also didn't give it back when asked (the OP had to take it back)?

lilyjen · 12/12/2009 20:32

I agree with you, not being able to understand these things puts the responsibily on the mother to ensure your child gets his toy back and she apologises for him. I was in a church once with DD who was 3. A child with SEN came running up to us and leant all over my DD pushing her backwards, who freaked out a bit (because she didn't understand) and the mother came up and apologised and said she had special needs. I understood completely and said that was ok and explained to my DD but I think that mother had the right approach. Of course I can understand that doesn't mean we don't deserve an apology! I made lots of apologies on behalf of my daughter when she was a baby or too small to understand when she bothered someone that's the right thing to do!

cupofteaplease · 12/12/2009 20:34

I agree with the OP. The mother should have given the boy's toy back, SN or not. I think it is the fact that the mother did absolutely nothing that has riled the OP, and it would have annoyed me too. So YANBU.

notanumber · 12/12/2009 20:34

Ummmm.

It doesn't seem as though your son was terribly upset about the incident, and it also seems that the whole thing was resolved quickly by you giving the child another toy so they were both happy.

Sounds like your problem is with the way the mother communicated the situation to you.

Would you have been happier if the mother had said, "I'm really sorry, he's got X condition and it means that he finds it difficult to understand about things belonging to other people. I hope your son isn't upset."?

I expect you'd have said, "Oh gosh, of course, I quite understand. It's not a problem at all, he was absolutely fine when I swapped it for that truck he's playing with now anyway. In any case, DS1 needs to learn that sometimes other people can share his things, so no harm done at all"

Perhaps that would have been better. But perhaps she's knackered and sick of explaining things to every Tom Dick and Harry over some non-issue when she's just trying to have a conversation?

stillenacht · 12/12/2009 20:34

I am a teacher and a mum of a disabled child - there is a MASSIVE difference to teaching them and living the emotional emptiness that having a disabled child brings. Being a teacher of AEN children makes no difference - if anything you should have a little more compassion to the difficulties faced by the mother.

MollieO · 12/12/2009 20:35

I can understand why the child did nothing but I do not understand why the mother didn't. In the same way when ds was younger, if he took another child's toy I would automatically take it off him and give it back. I didn't say he was too young to understand what he had done (he was tall for his age so sometimes got mistaken for an older child who would/should understand).

Glitterknickaz · 12/12/2009 20:35

Oh too right. Sussed who you are now... I did wonder.

It's absolutely no excuse. Really unfortunate that the mother didn't deal with it more appropriately.

I've got to the point now where I have had so much bloody negative stuff happening when out in public with the boys that I think I over compensate, am over apologetic etc. Unfortunately still doesn't stop the insults.

stillenacht · 12/12/2009 20:35

agree with notanumber - I get sick to DEATH of people asking me (albeit with genuine concern) how my DS is coming along - I feel like answering - Well he's not really coming along at all cos thats the truth!

MollieO · 12/12/2009 20:37

I also wouldn't expect an explanation from the disabled child's parent. All I would expect is to have my ds's toy returned when it was pointed out that disabled child had taken it. Surely that is enough? I can completely understand why you wouldn't want to tell complete strangers what was wrong with your child (have been there and it does get wearing and you can never gauge reactions).

Glitterknickaz · 12/12/2009 20:38

also I don't know how true this is for other parents of asd kids but mine do tend to prefer firm, clear boundaries.... mine are quite high functioning though and DS2 is much more receptive now he has his ADHD dx and meds.

5inthesleighbed · 12/12/2009 20:39

I don't think you're being unreasonable to have expected the mother to have at least taken the toy off her son and returned it to yours. Thats just lazy parenting in any respect.

DS2 has autism, and he doesn't understand boundries, and I have been in similar situations. However I would have returned the toy, apologised and (tried) to avert his attention elsewhere, but once he is fixated on something, no matter how much I try he will return to it.

stillenacht · 12/12/2009 20:40

My LFA child is purely 'auto' driven - no boundaries - everything for himself. The only boundaries he understands are 'first'....'then'...

Glitterknickaz · 12/12/2009 20:42

it's a big ol' spectrum isn't it stillenacht?

stillenacht · 12/12/2009 20:43

Why don't you pull your head out from your backside love!

Sorry a message from Mr Stillenacht who has just read the OP

Charming man eh??