Actually, is my mother being unreasonable?

[kittywise]

OK here's the senario:

My mother has offered to take various of my children to the local cinema, both today and on Monday. On the whole I am pleased that she is doing this as I am not a great cinema fan, I have tinnitus and cannot be in very noisy situations.

She has taken them before too.

The catch is that I have to pay for everybody to go, including her. She is certainly well off enough to afford it herself though, she is, for instance, planning to buy an antique clock worth £9,000 because she likes old things and it's a good investment etc etc.

I wasn't too bothered by this initially as it enabled the kids to see films and got me out of going.

Dp, however, thinks she is outrageous in asking me to pay. He reckons no other grandparent would do this if they could afford to pay with their own money.

He says that the kids will think she so wonderful and generous, taking them off to the cinema, when infact she hasn't paid anything for it.

Now I feel very agitated by the whole situation. Yesterday I bought tickets for her and 3 of the kids and it cost £21. She has offered to take them again on monday and it will be even more money then, as 4 kids are going. Money IS an issue for us though, we are, like many people, struggling big time.

She has gone on holiday with me and the kids ( dp stays at home and works), but she does not pay ANYTHING she hands dp a bill at the end of the holiday for all her 'expenses' which last year, for a week, amounted to over £300!!!

So basically I don't know whether she is being normal or rubbish.
Please tell me what you think. Is this normal behaviour? Would you be quite happy for this to be the 'arrangement' in your house; that your mother offered to take your kids out, but you had to pay for it?

Thanks( a very confused kitty)

YANBU.

When my parents take DD out for the day I don't get asked to pay, and I wouldn't exoect to have to pay. They want to entertain her, they can choose whatever they do be it free or expensive.

If asked them to take her out to somewhere specific, that would be different I would expect to pay, it is up to my parents to accept (or not).

When I have suggested a day out (Sealife last week for example) I provided the 241 vouchers and offered to pay. I got lunch instead.

More often than not they pay for us to go out, have lunch etc.

Another tact is to go through the children "Sorry, Mummy can't afford to send you and Grandma to the cinema again". May make your Mum feel guilty!!

I think she is being totally unreasonable.

Does she actually enjoy being with the children? Would she come round and take them to the park if you provided a picnic for example? Not too expensive and they get to spend time together, you get a bit of time to yourself.

My Mum will babysit for me and is happy to without being paid but I make sure DD is asleep before she arrives and that we have DVDs for her to watch if she wants them etc etc and we are very grateful and she knows it.

If she presented me with a bill for things she had bought for DD I would be offended on my daughter's behalf as surely gps buy treats for their gcs out of love and to spoil them rotten?

Did you know she would present you with a bill following the holiday? If not it must have come as a nasty shock.

I would just say in future - 'We can't afford to pay for you all to go to the cinema, so thanks but no thanks'. Equally if a holiday comes up again - 'We can't afford the extra money it costs us for you to come so we can't go at all.'

If she has any decency she will stop being so selfish or find a compromise that enables her to see the children and help you out without costing you a fortune.

buda, that's a good idea. I will tell her this morning that it's too much money for me and can she take them to the park or something.

flamingo, yes that's what bothers me. She offers to take them yet expects me to pre book and hand over my card so that she can simply collect the tickets. Of course I then also have to pay the booking fee.

My dad and his wife are taking 4 of them for three days to centre parcs next week. He has not asked for a penny. I am very grateful that he wants to take them and shall of course be offering spending money for them. In my mind that's how it should be. I don't expect anything from my parents re the children. I'm grateful for any offers of help. But i am unhappy about being charged for things.

well, the holiday is one thing-if the mother is for example-driving her car,using a lot of diesel,shelling out for meals out then i think it's fair enough that the op weigh her in for what she's spent.
I don't agree that she should buy icecreams and be reimbursed for that,and if the only way the op's kids can go to the cinema is with granny then why shouldn't the op pay? if she was taking them herself then she'd be paying for a ticket for herself and the kids.
I suppose it depends how the conversation goes-ie if i asked someone to take my daughter ice skating for example as something to do when they were looking after her then i would obviously pay for the minder and the mindee-if the minder said 'is it ok if i took her skating' then i'd say 'here's some cash for her skating and a few quid for lunch/treats/hot chocolate'

Sorry for reposting 3 times!!

Obviously I want my point noted

It sounds like one thing that's bothering you and your DP is the mismatch between how your children view it (that granny is so generous) and the reality (that she's billing you for it later). I can see that this must grate, and also would make it hard for you to tell them that they can't have treats from her, as it would seem like you were being irrationally mean.
But - if they're old enough to understand about money, and you choose a time when you're not angry so that you put it in the right way - couldn't you tell your DC the truth about this? If handled right, couldn't that defuse the situation?
Genuine questions here - I don't know if this is a good idea or not.

what earthly benefit would there be to dragging a load of kids into a conversation about how actually it's mummy and daddy who pay not granny?
why not also tell them father christmas and the tooth fairy are a load of crap as well! I don't think kids really give a shit about money and who pays for what in the scheme of it all-do you?

I wouldn't expect my mother or mother in law to pay for cinema or for things they had spent on the children on holiday. I am certain however that they would not request the money or present a bill!

4 children to cinema is rather more expensive than just my dd or ds - I think my mother would be rather more likely to find something else to do to avoid at cinema prices.

Oh and I do offer my mother and MIL the money for theatre tickets/entrance to attractions. Or rather I did, and then had my head chewed off and haven't since.

He says that the kids will think she so wonderful and generous, taking them off to the cinema, when infact she hasn't paid anything for it

Children also need to know about budgeting and the like so will be good to learn that people have to save for treats and that treats don't/ can't happen every week.

I have a similar situation with my mother - she is fairly tight with money. However, as far as the cinema goes, I think it is reasonable for you to give her the money to take the children. when my mum takes my children anywhere I give her the money to do so.

the holiday expenses thing is very unreasonable I think! My mum has come on holiday with us a couple of times (not to help), and has not offered one penny, which grates rather, especially when we end up doing the whole supermarket shop for her and her partner too (we wouldn't accept any money from her if she did offer, but it would be nice!). But when she buys the kids icecreams or cakes or chips, she doesn't ask for her money back. I would be shocked if she did, and would probably somehow have to say something to her, although it would be difficult.

This is is pollyanna, what would you say, how would you word it?

How could you word something that is somehow so unspeakably mean and tight?

I don't think the holiday thing is unreasonable either. As you said, you couldn't go if she didn't come along. The alternative would be for you to pay for a nanny to come on holiday with you. You'd be selling out for absolutely everything anyway, and paying the nanny.

If you don't want to pay for her to take the children to the cinema, just say "thanks for the offer mum, but we can't really afford it at the moment". I don't see really see what is so hard.

If you want your children to grow up to be obsessed by money and value people by how much they do or don't spend of course, by all means point out to them that it's not nan but mum who pays for these little trips.

Not sure how old the kids are, but you could say, in their hearing, OK, I am going to book the cinema tickets today, and that's £21. I can't afford to do this more than once a month though. I'll have to let granny know. Here is some money for ice-cream/popcorn.
On holiday, say to your mum, 'How much money do you need for the children today? Ok children, that's £X each I've given granny, don't spent it all at once!'
I don't think you can compare a grandmother to a childminder at all. It's the childminder's business/work, it is, presumably, a grandmother's pleasure to have the children.

Everyone assumes it should be a grandmother's pleasure to have their grandchildren (and it mostly is) but from what I read on MN an awful lot of women use that emotional tug to thoroughly take the piss.

I can't believe anyone thinks YABU, you are definitely not.

You have not asked her to take your children she has offered she should have made it clear she wasn't willing to pay before she took them.
If my parents or pil offer to take my children out I practically have to assault them to get them to take money and even if they do it ends up coming back as pocket money for my dc.
I don't understand the holiday thing, why couldn't you not go without her?
Did she pay for herself to go?
I think you will just have to say before she does anything how much if anything you are willing to pay for and if she doesn't like it she will have to do something cheaper or not at all.

YANBU, your mum has offered to take them so its unfair to expect you to pay for everything. I would however offer money for snacks for them all.
My mum is having ds when i go away next year and Ive told her i will be giving her some money for ds as i know they are taking him on daytrips. Her very quick responce was i've offered ill pay, managed to get her to agree to the money i would get for ds that week lol

I don't assume it's Grandma's pleasure to have the children.
I don't agree with Grandparents as childminders day in day out, but I do think if they offer to do something with the children especially something expensive they should expect to pay for at least some of it.

The reason I can't go away on my own is that I have too many kids who are at the mo too young for me to manage safely for a week on my own.

She came to take the kids this morning. I explained that the cinema was expensive, told her the price and she winced! And asked if she was prepared to take them out on monday to somewhere free.
She was quite happy to do that but didn't offer to help pay for the cinema, so it's clearly not something she is prepared to do and I don't think that she should, I don't think it's her duty btw, I find it a bit sad that she doesn't offer though.

If you havent raised it as an issue before then maybe she just assumed you were happy to pay. Hopefully now it has been discussed things will be easier, and she wont assume that you have unlimited money.

bigstripeytiger, yes, there are many many issues that you just don't raise with my mother

Kittywise, could you not suggest that your mum takes the kids to the park next time she wants to take them out? If they take a packed lunch and ice-cream for a treat afterwards this would be a much cheaper day out. BUT I am of course assuming that you have good local parks where you live...I am lucky there are a few round here [now my 'kids' are too old to use them!] although I can see your point and think YANBU I think you'll have 50/50 devide on this one!

Think you handled it well today. And use Msleds advice about discussing costs out loud. Great way to stop her getting away with posing as generous Gran - and to make the point to your kids that they can't have the moon on a stick, it's not an endless supply of free treats.

Holiday thing is outrageous. But don't quite understand why would you be going on away on your 'own' with the kids when you have a dp. Can't you ditch your mother for future holidays and just go as a family, parents and kids?

YA so NBU!

I can't believe this. If your mum was hard up, living on a state pension. then yes, you should pay but she clearly has money, why would she not want to spend some of it on her own grandchildren??? As for sending your DH a bill after the holiday as if she's a paid childminder or something....

FWIW, if I go out for the day with my DC and my parents (we went to the seaside last week for example), my Dad will often pay for all of us including me and my DC. There will be other situations where I will pay so I'm not taking the piss but in the end, we are all family so what does it matter? My mum in particular has to be stopped from spending money on my DC - she hates the fact that I buy them second hand clothing and would buy them both new things all the time if I let her.

I don't understand this school of thought expressed by some on here that gps have "finished" with their families and should go off and spend the rest of their lives/cash on cruises. Families should stick together - when you have children, they are your children for life, not until you kick them out at the age of 18 and your grandchildren are a continuation of your children if you see what I mean.

Isn't your DH Asian, Kittywise or am I thinking of someone else on mn? Given that most Asian families are very close knit, I can understand your DH's