to feel that 'young mums' shouldn't all be tarred with the same brush?

[ElieRM]

Am about to turn 19and DD is 7 wksold.At baby clinic, which I attend fortnightly to get DD weighed and discuss the odd issue with HV, have made a great deal of effort to be friendly to other mums, all of whom are 30+. Can never get more than a curt 'hello', often attract sneaky, unpleasant looks and feel although I'm being judged because of my age. Other mums are happy to sit and chat together, I tend to leave as soon as all necessary business is completed.
Also often attract unpleasant looks when out and about; general concencus of opinion about younger mums seems to be very Daily Mail, all on benefits, single, no prospects, councilhouses etc etc
I KNOW not everyone thinks this, but AIBU to feel a little hard done by? After all, DP and I are in a comitted relationship, we dote on DD and are both students' DP is working flat out to support us over summer, and we're both fully intending on completing our degrees and paying our way!
Often see other young mums swearing at kids, shouting etc and can completly understand why people form opinions. However, should we not be judged on our indivual merits, both as parents and people, rather then simply by the age we gave birth?

I had my first DD at 17,then my second DD at 19. I was never really that aware of looks etc at that age although i'm sure that was me being pig headed.

I did join a young mums group which i loved and am still in contact with a few of them. We have all done really well (i think) amongst the ones i keep in contact with,we have become lawyer, teacher and a couple of nurses.

I had another baby at 29 and have noticed the distinct lack of niceties from random mums who gave birth around the same time as me.

Just to add as well that for me who (until recently) always looked really young for my age,i still click on when people do the mathmatics when they ask about my children,so the "young mum" thing for me has never gone away. Not that i care,i am proud of them.

I found the rude stares started during pregnancy - I was 22, lived in seaside OAP stuffed town and they clearly thought I was scum of the earth - its coz the baby is proff that you have....wait for it.... audible gasp......had sex.

But ElieRM - its early days - ignore the silly beggers and go to as many Mum & Baby groups as you can stomach - you'll soon find a group or two you settle into, then you can forget the rest and enjoy your new mummy friends. There;s just too many people concerning themselves with judging other people's lives instead of enjoying their own.

i had dd at 20 and definitely ain't the stereotypical mother so i know how hurtful and upsetting it can be when older mothers don't want to know based purely on your age.

sadly i found nothing affected their judgements other than me getting older, i'm 25 now and definitely get less of 'those' looks than i used to but i still find older mothers don't seem to make the same effort with me as they do with each other.... no matter how many times i try and be friendly they only seem to want to play with mommies their own age so stuff em! have stopped caring now tbh.

stereotypical young mother (got so bogged down typing 'stereotypical' one handed while feeding ds2 i forgot what i was saying!)

I found the same thing when I had a tiny baby. I had my DS at 19 and DD at 20 and people were much cooler with me when the kids were smaller.

Now that they are 4 and 3 and are (if I say so myself) polite, helpful and well presented I find that no one even really seems to care what I'm like. It's not until I say something along the lines of "I'm going back to college as I didn't get to finish after I left school as I had DS..." that they even consider how old I was at that time.

I'm sure you are a wonderful parent, do your best and your children will speak louder than the age at which you had them.

haven't read all of thread have friday night brain freeze.
i was 18 when i had DS1 and faced same thing as OP.
i did however force myself to attend NCT and after a couple of months cracked it. eventually ending up on the committee.
i am still in contact with some of the mums i met there 8 years on.

don't give up becoming a mother is the ultimate leveling experience. Everyone suffers sleep deprivation, worries about what to wean them on when, if they should be writing their own name by 10 months etc etc.

try different mother and baby groups see if the NCT have coffee and chat groups round about.

good luck.

YANBU. People love to judge and young mums are such an easy target.

But if you decide to have another in about 25 years you will see that people can be just as about older mums.

Feck em. Thats what I say!

As Lynette says, you can get this response whatever your age. I found mother and baby cliques almost impossible to penetrate, and I am the same kind of age as most of the other mothers round here. Curt hellos, funny looks... yep, sounds familiar. Try other groups.

Thanks guys! Btw, think the story of 15 yr old commenting on women waiting for scanis disgraceful. I think the upshot of it all is opinions shouldn't be ventured, verbally or otherwise, unless the venturer is sure the forum is appropriate.
Enormously tempted to attend next clinic wearing velour tracksuit with an unlit Lambert and Butler dangling from mouth and blue WKD in hand but think DP would have a seizure and/or leave me!
Also, sad to know older mothers face suchprejudice, especially as I'm sure many go through a great deal to conceive. Very sad.

I had my dd at 19 too and like you was in a long term steady relationship. My dd is now 20 and after reading this I was remembering when we went to look around secondary schools for her. We were in groups of 8 sets of parents and I felt so young compared to the rest, I felt like they were old enough to be my parents!

I found that I made more friends once she was a few years old and people could see what a lovely little girl she was and not a little brat with a chavvy Mum!

YANBU

I get this too, I was 19 when ds was born and am 21 now, number two due in Sept. Its hard trying to break the stereotype I know. The thing is mums like us don't 'fit in' anywhere. Not with those stereotypical mums our age or those who are older, so no one bothers with us. It is demoralising sometimes.

My theory is that some older parents don't like to think that as young parents in a loving relationship you can support yourselves, launch successful careers and bring up your children well because then you make them look bad for taking so much longer to get to the same point

Your baby is only very young still and you have loads of time to meet people and forge friendships. I reckon most new mums are to shy to make friends anyway, give it time and everyone will relax and bond a bit more I'm sure. Keep trying, go to baby groups/NCT coffee mornings, be friendly and they will come around. If they don't they are not worth knowing anyway. Good Luck.

I was 23 when I had my DS last yr, and despite being married, with a Russell Group university degree, privately educated, nice house etc etc NOONE at the antenatal classes wanted anything to do with me or my husband!

Once my baby was born I made a real effort to go to the baby group at the Sure Start centre and now have 3/4 really good friends with babies the same age as mine. We still meet up once/twice a week.

I still however get the following comments from ppl:
"Was your DS an accident?"
"Were you pregnant on your wedding day?" (I fell pg on honeymoon).
"Did you just get married because you were pg"?
"Why did you bother going to university when you were just going to have a baby and stay at home"
"Oh your poooor parents spending all that money on your education - what a waste etc"

PEOPLE CAN BE SO UNKIND!

I would ask the HV if there are any mother & baby groups as I'm sure once the other mamas get to know you they will be dying to make friends. It really is nice to have friends with babies the same age as yours as they will always know what you are going through and can prove a valuable source of information!

Congrats on your new arrival

I have to say the only young mum that ever came to our toddler group used to give us blow my blow accounts of the fights she'd been in at the weekend so that kind of put me off, not her age, but your right people do judge on absolutely everything so don't take it too personally, if you were 45 you'd be old and selfish, you can't win.

Some people make great mothers at 17, some don't. Some people make great mothers at 40, some don't.
I think if I'd had children in my early twenties, as opposed to late, then I would have had a lot more energy!

OK, I'm going to play devil's advocate here to add a bit of balance. You sound lovely, and bright, and you are in a stable committed relationship,and both you and your partner seem to be honourable and ambitious, and well-intentioned but...

You say all young mums are assumed to be single, in a council house and on benefits.

Um, sorry but you are, in fact, single (i.e. unmarried)are you not? And at only 18 with a baby, statistically your relationship has a slim chance of going all the way. Sorry. You are both students, so unless you have private trust funds or very generous parents we must assume that you are not, for the next couple of years at least, financially self sufficient and are therefore claiming benefits of some sort. If you intend to resume your degree any time soon your child will need full-time childcare - who will pay for that?

Unless you live with your parents you are, presumably, renting a house/flat with the help of housing benefits of some kind. It doesn't matter whether it's a council house or a private let - it's who funds it that's the issue here. Unless of course the baby (and all the paraphenalia that comes with having a baby) and the rent and household bills, and anticipated childcare costs are being completely funded by you both on the back of your student loans and your partner's holiday job, without claiming anything other than your family allowance. In which case I apologise, and take my hat off to you.

You say (with a hint of smug indignation)that your partner is working 'flat out' through the summer - well, so he should be. There are no pats on the back for working to support your own child I'm afraid. Choosing to have a family means being a real grown-up, and working 'flat out' in one form or another, for the next twenty years, and that's without bringing the unfinished degrees into the equation. And every teenage mother trots out the old chestnut about 'fully intending' to go back into full-time education to have the career she always intended to have, to support her child, as soon as she is able. Blah Blah. Very few do. Babies are a full-time job in themselves, as you will learn. To get you both through the next two or three years (minimum) both graduated, relationship intact,and without some form of reliance on the state purse will be some kind of miracle. You probably think I'm being a cow. I'm not a cow - just a realist. But I'd love to see you prove me wrong. Good luck. and congratulations.

At 19 you are at a different stage of life than a mother at 30. If these women didn't have their babies and you were without your they would either talk to you about school/education or not speak at all. Just because you are a mother it doesn't mean you have anything in common with these older mothers.

God, I'm sorry. I've just read my post back and realised that, whilst I do mean what I say, it was a totally inappropriate time to say it (even though OP asked the question!)
Forget how old you are, having a seven week old baby is a very emotionally fraught time, and your hormones will be everywhere, and you will be needing support and positivity, and I just gave you a very negative bunch of thoughts to deal with - I'm so sorry. I'd delete the whole thing but I can't work out how to do it! Serves me right for being up at 4am - can't sleep -not thinking straight. And it's so long ago that my three were babies that I just stupidly forgot what it's like - where YOU will be, mentally and emotionally right now - full of optimism and hope, as a brand new mum, but knocked sideways with it all, and scared shitless as well! That bit, at least, is the same for us all, regardless of age or status!

If any older women appear to be giving you unfriendly sideways glances maybe they've just become weary and cynical like me! Anyway, as I said, I'm sorry, and the very best of luck with your new family unit.

Which means it's not necessarily your single young Mum status that they are assuming but just feel like talking to people they have more in common with.

I had my DD at 19 - I am now 22, she will soon be 3... and I think YANBU - I got alot of negative, unkind comments from strangers when my DD was smaller.

I too am doing a degree, determined to finish it - have a fantabolous DP - and glad that we have DD whilst we are younger. (My Mum was 42 when she had me)

I had been married 13 months when we had our first. I was 22 and I remember the midwife after the birth at my house asking if we owned it. Yes we did. I don't remember a lot of criticism however even though many of my friends waited until they were 35 to have chidlren and my siblings have both had theirs nearer 40. I now have three children at univesrity stage and 2 at school and my siblings are just starting on 20+ years of bringing up children. I am glad I did it the way round that I did.

It also means I will see my grandchildren. My parents were married at 23/24 and did not have children for 10 years so they were never very young grandparents and now they are both dead so my siblings'children have not really had grand parents on their side. I would certainly encourage my daughters to have their children in their 20s as well as pursuing careers. The other notable issue for me was that at 22 with a baby and indeed by the time I had three babies I always worked full time in a professional career and 25 years on that has really paid off too.

Xenia, I think in your day there weren't as many unmarried Mothers (the scum of the earth), and having a child in your early twenties wasn't a bad thing. Now people assume that these mothers will be dependent on benefits and will amount, like their offspring, to nothing. It's a shame that people assume to know a person's story without so much as a hello.

I had a baby at 19.

I do remember someone refusing to give her routine jabs, because I didn't have a letter of permission from the mother. I couldn't work this out, and then I suddenly realised they thought I was the nanny. It took some effort to persuade them I was in fact the mother, and then in a moment of lucidity I worked out I could bf in front of them and that would do the job. Of course I bf a lot longer than the other mums from my NCT group who were all in their late thirties and early forties ...

I also remember her getting nasty croup and taking her to A and E in the days when they were far too keen to see accidental injuries when there were none (think Roy Meadows), where they didn't really do a lot in terms of treating her, and I was treated like a criminal and told both she and I had psychological problems and would be referred. This also baffled me, until my mum recommended I get DP to ring them up and ask in his educated, manly voice to speak to the top man and demand a private referral, throwing in phrases like 'This is so unexpected, we want to see the top man, money is no object, who is head of your department?' DP did this, and suddenly the problem went away. Interesting.

In terms of education, I ended up an Oxbridge Boffin and DD is now also at Oxbridge. I did not receive any public money at any point, apart from a mandatory grant for university fees just like everyone else, and 3 months' housing benefit when I left DH when DD was seven. I also managed to get a housing association shared ownership property as a key worker, but the help with housing was to do with being a relatively poorly paid public sector worker rather than a young mum - there were only three families in the 14 flats, as the rest were young marrieds without children, or single people. So my parenthood status had little or nothing to do with all this.

In short, I reckon if we spent as much effort being nice and encouraging young parents to continue with their education as we do huffing and puffing about their age, we'd all be a lot better off.

BoffinMum - what is 'bf' sorry if I'm being dim!

Breastfeeding
The thing young mums are supposed to avoid doing like the plague. Up there with studying and your children doing well for things to avoid.

posieparker, your comment is exactly the problem I have encountered. People presuming my age means we have nothing in common. An NCT friend is 13 years older than me yet we are very similar, partners working in similar fields, same ethos to life/bringing up children, same taste in music/comedians/clothes etc etc. We are not close friends really but we get on well and even though she has more 'life experience', the short amount that I have is very different to hers and we have loads to chat about. If she was so narrow minded to presume we wouldn't have anything to say to each other then we would both miss out on a nice friendship.

Tiggyr, I get what you are trying to say but it IS possible to be pregnant at 18 and fully support yourself. Dp and I have lived in our (privately rented, not council) flat since before I got pregnant, he graduated (from Cambridge, he is a clever clogs) 3 weeks before ds was born, went straight into his job. We have never claimed any benefits, except a small amount of ctc just like many other working families. We are not married but we are not religious and it means little to us really. All the legal documents I have encountered class us as co-habiting, or living together as if married and certainly not as 'single'. I expect we will get married at some point, but like many other happy couples of all ages its not high on our list of priorities. When I go back to uni we get no financial support except my student loan because of the amount dp earns. We had ds (a happy surprise) because we knew we could support ourselves and that we would make good parents. Which we do tbh

I have been taken for ds's nanny too, and been asked very rude personal questions about our situation by people we hardly know and its a kick in the teeth tbh. Swimming against a current of people who want you to fail and prove that young parents will cock up at some point, because you just can't have it all. I know some people would say I have missed out on the experience of a carefree twenty something, and I do mourn this loss sometimes, its very hard work trying to do everything (study, earn, raise children) all at once but I love my family and my life enough to not be that fussed really! We are all dealt different cards and the op is right, we need to be judged as individuals not as labeled groups.

I think the point op was trying to make (correct me if I am wrong) about her dp working hard is that they are not lazy layabouts sponging off the state, rather than well done him for getting a job, isn't he great.

Oh and boffinmum, I breastfed ds till he was 20 months, my mw for this pg was delighted to hear this. She nearly exploded with excitement when she saw his cloth nappies too