shy people get on my tits

[brimfull]

and I know I am being unreasonable

but I want to shout-' grow up and make a fucking effort!!'

and don't moan about your kids not having mates to play with when you never ask people back,never say hello in the street

thanks

needed to get that off my chest

I think, thoughI'm not sure, that I hide my shyness moderately well when I'm talking to people, so it might be that I belong in GPAC's category of 'appaerently confident people who are dying inside'. There are loads of people like this and it certainly undermines the idea of shy people as 'people who aren't making the effort'

But what I wanted to say was how immensely valuable that makes Mumsnet (and other talk forums; I believe there are others). Talking to other people has always for me been ENTIRELY about making constant anxious calculations about what is the right thing to say next, to the extent that ALL real interaction between me and other people disappeared: it isn't me that relates to other people, it is a persona, utterly. And you can peel that off on the internet and just (gulp) say what you think (though still polished up a bit for politeness, etc.). For that reason it seems odd and arbitrary to identify the non-virtual with the real. (In rl I am a sort of well-intentioned troll I think.)

It's interesting to see people who appear forthright and confident on here saying they are shy in rl. Lol at 'well intentioned rl troll'.

I'm the opposite. I often spend hours composing a message on here and then decide not to post. I name change as soon as I think I might be in danger of developing an online persona. I get quite Leeds United when people talk to me.

In rl I make friends quite easily and am reasonably socially confident.

Weird.

That is very interesting Besom. I post quite readily, and I got stuck in almost as soon as I stumbled on the site. I suppose I am the opposite of shy on the internet. It is weird.

Perhaps it is parly that shy people live in their heads a bit, always turning things over, finding the right words, rehearsing conversations. The internet is just like doing exactly that -- except that there are other people inside your head with you.

I think the comment about loudness and self esteem can sometimes be true. I would never be described as shy, yet I do get quite anxious in group situations, stemming from years of bullying, am always convinced people don't like me, but my anxiety comes out as talking, a lot, and often loudly. I don't know why, trying to make people like me I suppose, maybe also liking to be in control. It's weird, I'm definitely not shy, but people are always surprised when I admit to my lack of confidence.

Godzilla - fascinated by your comment about small talk being boring, and you not being bothered if you come over as stuck up.

How do ever make a friend if that is what you think?

Loads of research shows that virtual all human interaction leading to freindship starts with fairly meaningless small talk - this is the easy conversational subjects we sound each other with. If we like people's responses then we deepen the interaction and talk about more meaningful things as trust develops bewteen us.

Surely if you don't at least attempt small talk you stifle any chance of starting friendships?

And also, boring it may be, but for some people it may be the only social interaction they get, so having a 'boring' chat whilst waiting for a bus with an old lady shouldn't kill you.

notyummy...i was very, VERY tired last night!

I'm not that bad at small talk...i talk the cashier's head off, i will happily chat to someone in a queue (as someone else has already said, they aren't required to like me so the pressure is off).

As for making friends...hah.
In my 32 years, 15 of them have been spent in school/college trying to make friends who have ended up back-stabbing me. The people who i didn't want to make friends with, it was because they never had a kind word to say...IME making friends is a pointless waste of time.

The one exception to that is a person i met through MN, and if i remember rightly, up to now there has been no small talk!

Does anyone think that the confident people you meet in life may actually be bullshitters?

I used to be ridiculously shy to a point where I was too frightened to answer the phone, felt anxious about ringing the bell on a bus, couldn't instigate conversation with anyone. I was just paranoid that everyone would be laughing at me/pointing at me/talking behind my back.

I did read somewhere in my early twenties (it was an interview with Maeve Binchy, bizarrely) where she said she was very shy, and she realised eventually that nobody is looking/pointing/laughing at you, generally people don't take that much notice of you. She said that she 'acted' confident and that got her through life quite adequately, even though she would still be cringing inside. This seems to describe me very well.

Anyone who met me would assume that I am very confident, I have a very senior job, I am confident at public speaking, sing in public and seem like a quiety confident and competent person. People who actually know me well know that it just a carefully honed facade and I am actually (still) waiting for people to point at me and go 'ha ha HAA!, we're on to you!!'. I am (still) astounded that my thoughts and views at work are seen as valid and respected. The whole thing is an oscar winning act. Then I go home to DP, or to a (very close) friend, and end up crying my eyes out, thinking I am crap and useless.

thanks vulpus

getorf, are you my twin ?

You are and are not being unreasonable imo!

I appear to be very extrovert but it does conceal some low level shyness, the confidence is part of a front I put up, I think.

BUT I agree with your irritation. There's a massive group who I'm sure are so cripplingly shy/self conscious that they can barely speak to anyone.

BUT a lot of us over the years have WORKED really hard on our fears and made a bloody effort. You have to meet the world half way or at least attempt to! These people who leave the whole of social discourse to everybody else. Everyone else can carry the conversation, everyone else can do introductions etc. It's really hard and some kids don't learn young enough. But still, I think some people could do a LOT better than they do.

I have a gf who I invited to spend the millenium at a party with some of our friends. It was hard of course but just TRY to speak to a couple of people! I now don't invite her to many things because it's like taking a blardy statue! I feel like saying, do a course! Get some social skills! She manages at work. But I think she partly feels superior to everyone so doesn't make the effort..... I'm such a kind friend ain't I?

BUt massive sympathy for the pathologically shy, I don't blame them.

Godzilla - fair enough. I can empathise with the tiredness. Sorry to hear about your experiences with former 'friends' - that sucks.

Interesting that you met someone through mumsnet - perhaps no small talk because by virtue of being on the site you have already established common interests and perhaps a bit of a shared world view?

I should really do an OU psychology course!

AnyFucker - I think there are loads of people like us out there!

One of the wonderful things in my life is having a daughter who was born in a good mood, and who is naturally happy in her own skin, and quietly self assured. Thank christ she doesn't have any demons, bless her.

lol, by the way, at the bizarre anal vibrator tangent this thread went down last night.

I know

someguy made me nearly piss myself

he is currently in trouble on another thread though

Getorfmoiland, I'm also relieved that my two DSs don't seem to have been born with my affliction. I do all I can to make sure they feel confident in themselves and so far they have no shyness issues (they're 5 and 7).

I think SomeGuy had a few sherberts last night when he posted that!

Lyra - perhaps because we are shy/anxious by nature we maye have tried bloody hard to instill confidence in our kids so they don't end up shy.

notyummy - that is exactly what i am planning to do (OU Psychology)

Thing is, i can understand people behaving like 'statues' at a party where they don't know anyone, or the people they do know are so involved in talking to all their mates that you barely even get introduced.

I have been known to be a living statue on those sort of occaisions (wedding receptions - haven't been to any other parties as an adult). I imagine it gets easier to be socially involved when you have opportunities to do so regularly. Last time i went to a social occaision was a few years ago.

Well I 100% agree with the OP. I am by nature pretty shy and every day I make a supreme effort to overcome it. I do this mostly for my kids as I am a SAHM and to me part of my "job" now is to take them to groups, build up a little social life for them and do everything I can to assist them in being sociable little people.
TBH I'd love to hide at home all day in front of the PC but I FORCE myself not to.
I have a "friend" who doesn't take her son anywhere and makes excuses for why...it's too cold/raining/he's asleep/he's got a cold/she has to tidy her knicker draw...anything but admmit she's too fucking shy to make the effort.
I have introduced her to loads of mums with kids her sons age but she just sits there saying nothing. Shyness is hard but people are too willing to make it an excuse for not trying.
I also hate driving (am nervous, anxious and need rescue remedy to get behind the wheel, especially if I'm driving the kids) but I make myself do it because I am not prepared to let my kids miss out on a day out because I'm too inadeqauate and pathetic to drive the car.

I like an unreasonable generalisation I do! And I have to say that as much as I dislike professional extroverts who won't ever shut the fuck up, I'm equally unimpressed with people who manage to get away with being bloody rude on the grounds of "shyness".

Define rude.

I think you may find it's not just shy people. Also, being quiet doesn't equal being rude, in any context...unless you literally ignore someone who talks to you, which you'll find most shy people won't do.

Some of you lot should come over to my house. I love making friends with shy people. I seek them out.

And do you know why? Because, deep down, we're all shy. And life is too short.

squeaver...you're not a 'people collector' are you?

I had a friend whose sole purpose in life seemed to be to take people under her wing and 'help' them. It was quite irritating to feel like a commodity.

She didn't just befriend shy peeps though - it was across the board if there was someone she thought needed her 'help'.

Yes I'm deeply weird.

Actually, I've been in situations where no one has made the effort to be friendly to me, so I just try to do it when I can.

Then I lock them in the basement.

pmsl @ squeaver sounding like a mad stalker of shy people

LOL

You are joking incha?