to think the pregnant woman on the train tutting at not being offered a seat was Being unreasonable?

[pinkyporker]

I will probably get jumped on here but having been a commuting pregnant lady on 3 occasions I am well aware of the discomfort standing on tube journeys can do.

However it really riled me the other day when a pregnant lady huffed and puffed and made loud comments on the train because she had not been offered a seat. Now I was standing but had I been sitting i wouldn't of offered a seat to her after her comments.

If she was 38 weeks pregnant as she so loudly claimed, then surely to is her career choice to work so late into pregnancy and she should consider the journey when making this decision.

Personally if I was that desperate and I have been I would just politely ask someone if they minded giving up their seat but I dont just expect it. There are many people who have problems standing where it is not obvious.

There was also a woman on my local paper complaining of the same.

Just wondered what other people thought. Should pregnant women expect a seat on public transport?

it hink people are being deliberatley obtuse to mayorquimby.

if anyone - regardless of their age or state of health starting tutting becusae people were so rude as to not offer them a seat - i would say to miself " oh for fucks sake - just ask you moaning git"

which i think is mayor quimbys stance.

i doubt very much whether he would actually say in his head "fuck you - cos your a moaning twat - i am staying put"

arolf that pretty much tallies with my experience.

And it's also true that when people did offer me their seat the vast majority of the time they weren't english. Especailly non english non office workers - people covered in building muck and conversing in eastern european sounding languages would leap up as if someone had stuck a pin in their arse.

English men in suits - never.

MQ on the many occasions I stood on the tube when heavily pg i did tend to huff and puff - it is very difficult to breathe on a hot tube when you're that pg and so I would fan myself, breathe quite quickly and shallowly etc. I'm sure it sounded like huffing and puffing.

Is that why all the people sitting down would just glare at me then?

I completely agree - it was always the men in suits who ignored me when I was pregnant on the tube too.

Once a man and his girlfriend were sitting opposite each other in the two priority seats at the end of a tube carriage.

I was standing, heavily pregnant in front of the girl. Neither of them moved.

Eventually the bloke looked up at me and said: "Can you get your bag out of my girlfriend's face please."

nor do i require some stage like performance of a victorian damsel in distress as others insinuated above.where by any woman who requires a seat must turn into a helpless simpering creature who is the very picture femininity in all it's historical trappings.
my only point is if i notice someone who needs the seat i'll offer, if i haven't noticed (which i'm shocked at how impossible some people find this,what if my back is to the train entrance and i'm half way down the carraige?) and someone asks politely (or if my attention was gotten in some manner,lets say asking someone else who is unable to give up their seat) then i'm more than happy to give it up to them.
if i haven't noticed and someones first course of action is to start tutting,huffing and moaning then i just think it's rude.

Dollius - I hope you moved your bag sharply into his face? what a total git!

Merry I do see where you're coming from, but your argument kind of means that the vulnerable in society should have to shout and make themselves heard to get things that they need. That's not right though - the rest of society should make sure that vulnerable people get what they need.

However the microcosm that is the tube at commuting time tends to show the absolute worst that our society has to offer - an utterly inward-looking selfish attitude which is unfortunately shared by the vast majority of people in that situation.

Anyway I took my stand when pg, and sat on the floor. I didn't see there was anything else I could do. In that state there was no way I could've asked anyone for help, and they sure as fuck weren't going to help me. So that was that. The whole experience over the months utterly ruined my faith in human nature and 2 years later I have not regained it. I used to think that on the whole most people were OK. Now I know that is not the case, most people would rather see you suffer than put themselves out one iota.

Well MQ, if I'm sitting on a seat in public transport I very much keep an eye out for anybody who may need that seat more than I do and of course insist my children do the same. Surely most people would agree that continuing to remain seated while a clearly visible and heavily pregnant woman is standing is far ruder than any tut tutting she may do?

MQ you are looking at it from the other side.

When you get onto a carriage with about 60 people seated and amazingly it happens that every single one of them has their attention momentarily diverted, and in fact continues to have their attention diverted for the rest of the journey, again, then huffing and puffing will ensue. Or sitting on the floor. Or asking for a seat and being told to get stuffed or simply glared at for the rest of the journey.

It's the cumulative effect of every single person every single day "not noticing".

"MQ on the many occasions I stood on the tube when heavily pg i did tend to huff and puff - it is very difficult to breathe on a hot tube when you're that pg and so I would fan myself, breathe quite quickly and shallowly etc. I'm sure it sounded like huffing and puffing."

ah come on now though. we all know the difference between actual natural shallow breathing and someone doing their best to put on a show and let everyone know how disgusted they are with it all.
i've oftened noticed people who are like that on a packed dart and it's the kind of thing that would grab my attention and make me offer my seat.
and i do think it's disgraceful when people don't offer up their seats to those more in need. my only point was that the only thing that would stop me from offering my seat up to someone else is if they were being deliberately rude.
as it is this isn't a big issue for me as i am very rarely on public transport.

YABU, I would have thought anyone who has ever been heavily pregnant in public transport would realise so!

"Surely most people would agree that continuing to remain seated while a clearly visible and heavily pregnant woman is standing is far ruder than any tut tutting she may do?"

well your getting into semantics about what is more or less rude IMO. my only point was that if someone is rude to me i'm less inclined to then do them a favour. wether or not refusing that favour is more or less rude wouldn't be an issue in any other walk of life, if someone is rude to you it doesn't exactly inspire you towards altruism.

and i do take the point about collective "not noticing" for hours on end, and that is shocking.
but as i can only speak for myself i am only posting on what i would do. i can only think of 1 or 2 times where i haven't offered my seat up because i thought the people where being rude.i can think of many more where i have received negative reponses for offering my seat up, but i shall continue to do so because luckily the vast majority of the time i am on public transport i have offered my seat to either a woman or else someone who is need of it more and have received genuine appreciation which makes it worth while.

tutting will rile eople obviously but it's mroe than coutrtesy- every time I stand on a train, bus, wahtever I always end up nearly falling on my arse: for me that's a PITA but if PG that's really a danger, esp. when your centre of gravity and poss. blood sugar level disappeared back in january

She could have handled it better but I don't think she should have had to

But mayorquimby, she probably tutted because nobody offered her a place, not the other way round?

OMG Get real people. You are twisting MQ's words here.

So basically you are all saying that if your pregnant, you are entitled to act and treat people in any manner you please?

What about the poor sod sitting in front of you who's mums just died and feel like shit and shaking so badly that they would fall over if they stood but have to go to work to support the family as they only get 3 days paid grievance. Do THEY deserve some person standing in front of them gobbing off when they are lost in their own little world and probably didn't notice??

The point is you dont know and being pregnant is no excuse to act an a*se

Agree with you MQ, That's why if I was 8 months pregnant and standing on a train and nobody offered me a seat, I would feel entitled to do some tut tutting (i.e. they're being rude to me so I therefore feel inclined to be rude back).

No doubt this woman has been putting up with this sort of behaviour for months.

iggle, if everyone made a point of ofering rheir seat when they were able, then there would be no problem with people not (or being perceived as unwilling) when they can't

It's rather unlikely that everyone else in a ccarriage ahs a reason they can't offer after all.

Admittedly it's rather Utopian and it seems that asking for basic respect is often too much these days, but by making the effort when we can do so we protect ourselves when we need the consideration also.

The main reason I wouldn't ask is because I worry I will ask the wrong person - someone else who also needs their seat. The idea behind people giving up their seat without being asked is that the person who offers knows that they are better able to stand than you - and thus this avoids an awkward or embarrasing situation.

The OP even made this point that some poeple have problems standing which aren't obvious -so shouldn't need to question why pregnant women don't ask for a seat!

It is also hard to ask people who are deliberately avoiding making eye contact with you!

The pregnant lady in question does sound pretty huffy, but I probably would be in her shoes too.

Pinky, love, since there have been no tubes yesterday and today, you must be mightily relieved that you have been able to escape the kind of person who is in need, and having a bad day, not taking the approach everyone would like her to, and happens to express it to you.

I can completely iunderstand why it has been eating away at you for a few days, and hope this has helped you get it off your chest.

If not, maybe post-traumatic stress counselling would help?

But iggle the woman was tutting at the whole carriage.

I find it hard to believe that every single person on the entire carriage was disabled, had just suffered some kind of trauma, was also pg etc etc..

iggle, anyone who has travelled by public transport when 8 months pregnant will know how truly awful it is to have to stand.

I am prepared to accept that in an average carriage, there will be one or two people with good reason to remain seated. The chances however of an entire carriage suffering from some sort of affliction which although in no way visible, renders them somehow unable to stand, seems rather low.

You are being soooooooo unreasonable! Of course she should expect a seat on a hot stuffy train. 38 weeks pregnant? In the summer? I'm not surprised she was tutting. When I was pregnant I was always shouting at cars and cyclists when I tried to cross the road, and huffing and puffing at perfectly able people taking up seats on busses and trains, especially the allocated seats. Anyone who got in my way really! I don't blame her at all, and it's everyone else who's at fault here.

Case study here - 7 mths pg on the tube coming back from a meeting with business partner. She is size 8, teeny tiny blonde, who was wearing a pencil skirt, high heels. She had 3 guys offer to help her on the stairs with her bag and offered a seat. Moi? Left huffing and puffing down the stairs with a suitcase and no offer of a seat. So in answer to the OP - if I was that woman, I would have sat on the nearest lazy b*stards lap!!! At 8mths pg I know I would have done them some serious damage

if the pregnant lady wasn't immediately offered (and she should have been), then she should have politely asked someone for their seat. If she was able to tut and make noises, then she was able to ask. I hate people that play victim.

ljhooray - why didn't your friend offer to take your suitcase?

And if they are too shy to ask or not confident enough or have been refused in the past and that has knocked their confidence then presunably they should stand or stay at home.

I don't see why the onus has to be on the person in need to go down the tube politely asking people in turn if they may please have their seat.

People should offer. The reason that they don't offer is that they truly don;t give a flying fuck. So asking won't do much good really, will it.

I was not in a fit state emotionally to have arguments over seats when I was heavily pregnant. So thus I should stand. Nice.