To want parents to stop blaming their child's teacher for everything?

[starlightexpress]

I'm just so sick of reading parents on here moaning about how crap their child's teacher is for one reason or another (not aimed at any particular thread this evening, btw).

In any given class of thirty-three, seventy percent of my time is spent dealing with about three kids who couldn't give a fuck. They don't want to learn, they don't want anyone else to learn. I'm not talking SEN, here, I'm talking just plain naughty.

As far as I'm concerned, the majority of the time when a parent is on here moaning about how shitty their child's teacher is, it falls into one of four categories.

Either your child is:

a)Badly brought up and you're making excuses for them.

b)So-called "SEN" which means they can behave when they want to, but misbehave most of the time using said SEN as an excuse. You allow them to do this because you prefer not to take any responsibility for their behaviour.

c)Genuinely suffering from an SEN, which I probably know very little about and am given little support (either in terms of training or TAs or resources)for.

d)Suffering from the fall out of "inclusion" which means that so much of my time is spent firefighting (see a, b and c) that I don't have the time to spend on your child that they deserve.

Of course there are crap teachers. There are also medicore teachers and there are good teachers who have crap days and make crap judgements sometimes. But mostly it is not your child's teacher's fault.

If you are a C or a D parent, then get thee to the Head, the governers, the local MP and kick up an almighty fuss. You're right to be upset, I don't blame you, I'm not happy about it either but what can I do? I'm doing my very very best but I can't fight the system on my own.

If you're an A or a B parent, do what the fuck you want - that's what you do anyway, and I'm not interested in your whining.

Before you ask, I teach in an inner city secondary school. Not the worst school in the whole world but not great either.

I'm a relatively experienced teacher with a decent results record. I don't have classroom management issues - last Ofsted (they actally watched some of my lesson) they said that this was a strength, fwiw. It's worth nothing actually, as Ofsted couldn't identify one end of a decent lesson from another, but I know their opinion matters to a lot of you.

Go on, flame me, I will have heard worse at parents evening, I can take it.

AIBU?

Not saying that thinking that is ok, or something to be aiming for....

Just being honest.

Gosh Oops that sounds hard. No cuddles?

starlight I have. We all do, but your OP seemed so strong I was worried that the job had entirely ground you down (as it does to many good jobs, not because the children are shits, but because we deal with so many individuals in one day). I taught 150 children today and every single one of those needed me to meet their different emotional/physical/learning needs. It is a privilege to be able to try but it is exhausting isn't it?

Imagine Starlight's talking about the kind of parents Chegirl accurately describes, who don't support the school but resist any consequences due their child's misbehaviour. As a teacher you can end up spending a disproportionate amount of time dealing with and worrying over them (especially a newly qualified and unsupported teacher), when really it's the vast majority and probably 5 or 6 others who really do have needs that you want to spend your time planning and prepping for rather than dealing with aggro.

What I would say to Starlight, is pass it up. You don't have to be superwoman and there are people PAID in your organisation to deal with the extra aggro. If they have given you 33 kids, then they need to deal with inevitable problems that causes.

oops, your child has clear SEN.

That's different to naughty.

I would not insult any child or their parent for this. I may not always deal with it well, but I'll do my best with the limited resources available to me.

I'm totally with you starlight. I'm not teaching at the mo - taking time off with twins.I loved teaching, and will go back to it, but the shitty kids got me down. And the shitty parents did too - the ones who can't maket their minds up - the "you can't tell me/my child what to do....It's not my fault he didn't do his homework, it's YOUR job to make him do it... why hasn't he done his coursework - that's YOUR job... Oh, but you can't tell my kid what to do" sort. Infuriating.

Oops, that should have said "make their minds up". Should prob go to bed...

nope, he doesn't do cuddles.
he stiffens when you try, sometimes he will come to you to cuddle him and will stand stiffly whislt you cudldle hima nd then ask if you've finished.

It's a foible and he does have other issues.
But i'd hate to be called a fussy paent etc for "letting him get away" with the voilence that ensues if he is touched when not expecting it.

I would hope that teachers get support for kids with SN and i do think that inclusion is important.

But i do resent the rant by the OP as i suspect my ds1 will fall into her category B as he does behave quite voilenlty when stressed sometimes.
Ond bloody hell, i try to manage it.
I wouldn't blame a teacher if the brought it to my notice that he had been voilent to then- eg a swift kick in a flight or fight type manner.... but if i had told that teacher all about ds1 and how this problem goes with him- then i'd not have 100% sympathy if they crossed into his personal space and touched him TBH.

He's not "naughty" he's so well behaved it's untrue at school--- unless you touch him..

Heated you speak much sense.

Everyone has to deal with difficult people at work. I'm not convinced that teachers are having a worse time than people in many other jobs. I'm also not convinced that children or parents are any worse than they were when I was at school.

I do think that there should be more schools for children who are not benefitting from mainstream education.

My children being taught alongside children with behavioural problems has been a positive experience in general; it has taught them about tolerance and how they should behave responsibly and kindly towards people who have difficulties.

Also, this is Mumsnet, not teachernet, so I think YABU for people not to come on and be critical of their child's teacher from time to time. It is not a criticism of the entire teaching profession, anymore than someone complaining about a mum is a criticism of all mums.

Nothing to add to this thread but I got this email today and thought I would add it!

This is unreal - no wonder some people were offended! This is the message that the MaroochydoreHigh School Queensland, staff voted unanimously to record on their school telephone answering machine. This is the actual answering machine message for the school. This came about because they implemented a policy requiring students and parents to be responsible for their children's absences and missing homework. The school and teachers are being sued by parents who want their children's failing grades changed to passing grades - even though those children were absent 15-30 times during the semester and did not complete enough school work to pass their classes.

The outgoing message:

Hello! You have reached the automated answering service of your school. In order to assist you in connecting to the right staff member, please listen to all the options before making a selection:

To lie about why your child is absent - Press 1

To make excuses for why your child did not do his work - Press 2

To complain about what we do - Press 3

To swear at staff members - Press 4

To ask why you didn't get information that was already enclosed in your newsletter and several flyers mailed to you - Press 5

If you want us to raise your child - Press 6

If you want to reach out and touch, slap or hit someone - Press 7

To request another teacher, for the third time this year - Press 8

To complain about bus transportation - Press 9

To complain about school lunches - Press 0

If you realize this is the real world and your child must be Accountable and responsible for his/her own behaviour, class work, homework and that it's not the teachers' fault for your child's lack of effort: Hang up and have a nice day!

If you want this in another language, move to a country that speaks it.

Oops - no, you're a C.

I'm not an SEN denier, you know. I'm saying that as a classroom teacher I'm not an expert on all the SEN of all the kids I teach. But I will do my best and I will not blame the pupil or the parent.

However, I stand by my assertion that category B does exist.

he has no diagnosis, has been assessed.
And 99% of the time he is mr perfect.

And you might not know what happened.
Last time he was asked to tidy up and he was doing something else and he was being slow to tidy up.
So, fair enough the teacher asked him to tidy and then she tried to move him over to tidy area but holding his arm...
I'd told her about him, but although she is fab, and supported me self referring him, she only then realised what i was talking about.

And again this yr the TA tried to help him down off a climbing frame... and he freaked and got very aggressive...

there will be no specific help or support for this because there's no statement of need, no diagnosis.
But he's not at all difficult most of the time anyway...

I'm glad you see it htat way, starlightexpress, but i'm not convinced that if i was one of your parents you'd see it this way- just reading your OP makes me TBH

I missed a word out! That should have read:
Also, this is Mumsnet, not teachernet, so I think YABU for expecting people not to come on and be critical of their child's teacher from time to time.

LOL actually kid that email has been doing the rounds for a few years. Should be on all schools answering machines.

I must abed now....

So not ignoring subsequent messages, just asleep.

Starlight, your post has made me lol, I realise you must have ahd a bad day but you are funny!

Yup, sorry kid but snopes have the answer

www.snopes.com/humor/iftrue/palisades.asp
It's an urban legend.

ok, glad to be in category C....

I do think there aren't so many posts on here wth spurious reasons to be pissed off with the teacher.
The ones that i see are often ones where people are trying to get to the bottom of a potetniol bullying situation and find the teachers not helping or denying the problem.

And there are things like shouting at kids and humiliating them too..

but maybe as a prent i have a different take on it.

I think Starlight was just annoyed at the attitude parents seem to take that their children are always right. To those who responded to me earlier, I wasn't having a go at anybody with SEN, but just saying that the disproportionate amount of time that the teacher has to spend on 'included' pupils isn't fair to the rest; especially without extra staff or resources.

oops, it sounds like it's clear that something is a bit "wrong". If he's perfect most of the time then it's obviously not something he's doing deliberately and can manage and control.

It's persistant poor behaviour (not obvious episodes that have clear triggers) and then "SEN" is wheeled out as an excuse but somehow they can behave when they are in an exclusion meeting or want a reward... That is what I mean by B.

I didn't believe that the message really was recorded, I just thought it was funny. Imagine if schools (or offices) could put on their answer phones what they really were thinking!