to tell ds to hit this little boy back??

[Nemoandthefishes]

little boy in ds class has been badly bullying one of ds friends for the last couple of months. However today he decided to punch ds in the stomach and then told him not to tell, so ds didnt until he punched him in the stomach again at which point he told the teacher whose answer was 'oh just ignore him'. So I have told ds if the little boy punches him again to hit him back usually I wouldnt have said this but ds has already been through a bullying incident since sept and only just got it sorted about 2 weeks ago.

Great Kerry. And how would you feel if your kid's beating the crap out of someone else landed them in hospital? Do you think that child's parents or you would care who threw the first punch?

Honestly I just don't get this childish attitude.

Would you honstly go to the school and say, 'Well, the other kid started it'?

Because if you did it would make you sound about 7.

To suggest that telling a child not to hit a little boy back in school is hardly the same as 'just taking' a serious and violent attack!

And I have never, ever said you should do nothing. There are better and more productive courses of action than stooping to the same level as the bully!

agree with kerry, kids need to fight back if some little shit hits them first

if they don't they'll keep on getting hit

our school doesn't want to know about bullying
they have all the right-on policies/advise from the education dept/correct leaflets and things to say at parents night
but when it comes to it, nothing practical to offer
can imagine a lot of schools are the same

'Would you honstly go to the school and say, 'Well, the other kid started it'?

Because if you did it would make you sound about 7. ' No,not if you say 'I understand I might not have the fullpicture, but from what X says I believe thisnincident was caused by'- i do it allll the time and even when its wrong (usually,ds1 has no social understanding) it is useful in trying to unpick events.

I would never tell them to hit someone unless they were at risk;I have taught them the difference between that and self defence though (something you do when you beleive your safety is at risk and someone is actually attacking you at the time)- if so,meone was endangering my boys I'd be proud if they fought back then.

There's a massive difference between bullying minor and full on physical assaults but when it is a full on physical assualt you defend yourself. DS1 came home with shoes imprinted on him from being attacked by a gang of twelve: to my mind fighting your way out of that (as he did) is fine. At that point, you can get a teacher (there are no teachers on our yard, only supervisors who seem to vanish).

I didn't return ds1 tos chool though until it was sorted- had to do it that way, I felt, for any response but ever since have had Head on alert for it.

I'm not disputing your issues with your schools and I absolutely agree that these need to be taken seriously. Personally, I wouldn't want my kids in any school that didn't take bullying or parents' concerns seriously. I'd whip them out.

What I am saying is that this is no excuse to stoop to the level of using physical violence to sort out disputes. It's a blanket policy in my college, dp's school and for our kids. No hitting. No violence. Full stop. Ever. Don't care who says what to whom or who gives who a funny look or who starts it. We don't hit.

Once again, that is not the same as saying you shouldn't defend yourself. At all.

I teach my kids to defend themselves using words. And they're incredibly good at it. If that didn't work they know to go to a teacher or lunchtime supervisor or me. And one of us would intervene whatever that might mean in the circumstance.

of course you are being unreasonable
what you should be doing is to get the kid on his own, push him up against the wall and tell him if he ever does it again you will beat his head to a pulp

"I teach my kids to defend themselves using words. And they're incredibly good at it"

yep very useful when theres a fist flying at your face
sonmeone hits you, you knock 3 colours of crap out of them
problem solved

Peachy, nothing to disagree with there. Nobody would blame someone for self preservation which is not the issue that's in debate. My instinct has always been to run or frightened rabbit in headlights and frankly this isn't really much fun for anyone looking for trouble so it's quite useful.

Can I mention again the OP is talking about a 'LITTLE boy'. I think that matters.

It is not the same as being set on by a bunch of teenagers. It is a little boy who needs to be dealt with very effectively and sensitively to nip any problems in the bud. At this age it is really, really important not to validate hitting as a response to conflict.

On the other side of the coin, I have a little boy who atm, hits out radomly at other children...The school and I are working very hard together to help him....but, to some degree, I do wish the other children would stand upto ds, so he could begin to understand immediate consequences of his actions.

Not that I want him to be hurt btw, just to understand that it isn't nice to be hurt..does that make sense?

tired my ds1 is like that and I know what you mean- I would cheerfully beg if they would only teach him taht hisa ctions at consequences now at 9, rather than let it be a horrid shock at 11 when he goes to Comp. Because he 8will* take on 16 year olds,my son.

Now,ds1 has asd but even then- its the realworld he ahs to inhabit!

VCan I recommend the book 'a volcano in my tummy', on Amazon,for him?

Thanks peachy...it's hard on the other side too.

There needs to be moreunderstandig all round.

The World According To Mumsnet

is the reason we are going to hell in a handcart.

It's all ejected harmlessly into cyberspace Homer!

ah, but only if it were harmless. It seems that some people actually believe their own hyperbole

Parents are usually good at helping their kids deal with the individual problems they face. That's somehting we seem not to grasp on here - a kid in a rough council estate will be brought up to survive there, whereas a child from a upper middle class area where peoples first resort isn't violence will be brought up with different strategies. But these two kids may meet, ,so it's best they both have some idea of other strategies, but for them to decide which one in best in any give moment.

It doesn;t make these kids any better or worse than each other. It's only abuse or neglect that will serioulsy disadvantage a child with regards to social skills. That's a very different issue to whether you tell your chuld to hit back persistent bullies. The sky won;t fall in.

I often think my kids have a lucky baance realy- very WC birth town (well first three) and family (I am indeedy LOL)....... now in a very MC school.

DS2 certainly, as the NT one, cn get o with anyone (making them laugh is his usual strategy)

MiTo, with respect thats a loud of balls. Being able to use your fists over your voice has very limited advantages outside a boxing ring and is likely to cause loads of trouble. I get self defense but I don't get how any responsible parent would teach their kids to use violence as a way of solving their problems. As I say, dp spends a huge amount of his time dealing with kids who can't cope in mainstream school for precisely this reason. Lots of them instinctively behave to any sort of perceived threat with violence and destruction. He has to unpick a load of the messages they've received in their short lives to give them any chance of social integration in their future lives. A lot of them already have ASBOS. Obviously he deals with the extremes but I've worked in lots of mainstream secondary schools where lots of kids have the same attitude. Violence and aggression is seen as cool especially for boys while talking isn't. It's wrong.

oh FC you are taking it to extremes, telling your child to hit a bully back will not turn them into a yob, beacause you also teach them to care about nice people.