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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that if you have a Caesarean, you have still given birth?

127 replies

Cupofteaplease · 07/12/2008 11:54

I got talking to a pregnant lady yesterday and conversation turned to pregnancy, birth and beyond.

She said she hoped her baby would be small, so childbirth would be less painful. I said that my babies were both 8lb + and I loved having chunky babies! She said, in reference to me having 2 caesareans, that it didn't matter how big my babies were because I hadn't given birth to them.

Now obviously, I knew what she meant. But I still felt a bit . I would still say I have given birth to 2 children, even if they were extracted from me! Am I wrong in saying this?

OP posts:
Dragonbutter · 07/12/2008 12:08

i've had two c-sections and can't help but feel that i haven't actually given birth to them. I know this is wrong (i think) but i do feel sad about it. so i'm not surprised if other people would think this but i'd be at any woman telling me this and what they were trying to achieve.
i presume this is her first?
she's yet to find out just how it feels to be criticised for things that are out of your control.
so she's probably just stupid or ignorant or both.
but weren't we all?

Original poster
Cupofteaplease · 07/12/2008 12:12

Hmm, that's interesting dragonbutter- I've never considered that I haven't actually given birth to my children. Perhaps I'm the odd one, and this is a general feeling about, and amongst, those who have had a CS? Yes, this is her first baby BTW.

OP posts:
Penthesileia · 07/12/2008 12:13

YANBU.

Normally I hate online definitions, but it's useful in this situation, as I can't be bothered to rummage around for our OED.

" 1birth Listen to the pronunciation of 1birth
Pronunciation:
ˈbÉ™rth\
Function:
noun
Usage:
often attributive
Etymology:
Middle English, from Old Norse byrth; akin to Old English beran
Date:
13th century

1 a: the emergence of a new individual from the body of its parent b: the act or process of bringing forth young from the womb2: a state resulting from being born especially at a particular time or place 3 a: lineage , extraction b: high or noble birth4 aarchaic : one that is born b: beginning , start "

You have given birth. You have - out of your womb - begun a new individual.

So ner ner ner to that daft lady.

southeastastra · 07/12/2008 12:13

course you have given birth to them. some people are just weird

bubblagirl · 07/12/2008 12:14

id pay no attention at all pregnancy and mother hood can turn alot of people into nasty people such as i couldnt brreast feed due to lots of meds and no milk and i was made to feel i had given my baby the worst start in life

and still people feel the need to comment whether its breast c sections etc you need to turn blind eye to ignorance every one has a view but should keep to themselves

you have given birth and probbaly suffered more doing so with the healing time etc you did not fail like i did not fail my child giving birth is an act that produces child at end of it and we all did that

Penthesileia · 07/12/2008 12:14

Oh, and I gave birth 'naturally', at home, so I'm not 'biased' in any way.

Dragonbutter · 07/12/2008 12:19

as an afterthought..
i don't know how many people feel like this, and i can't remember if i felt like this before i had my kids either. but i know that this little niggle in the back of my mind that i hadn't 'achieved' giving birth as i had wanted to may have been one of many triggers for pnd.
so if it doesn't quite work out as your friend has planned she may need your support further down the line.
don't take it personally.
maybe one day you might be able to laugh about it together.
but for now, keep shtoom as you know better, and be there for her when she gets a bit wiser.

BibiJesus · 07/12/2008 12:20

I struggled with this concept for a long time after dd was born by emergency c-section after a long labour (37.5 hours on my notes). I felt like I'd failed dd, that I wasn't a proper mother because I'd not actually pushed her out myself, and I lay a large amount of blame for this on the health prfessionals I'd seen while pg and in labour.
I'd been terrified all along I'd not be able to do it and would end up with a section (mother had two long labours ending in emeregency sections) yet every time I'd tried to talk to a midwife/Dr about it, they pooh-poohed it and told me it wouldn't happen. Birth was natural, what we were meant to do and there was no need to think I wouldn't get along just fine. Therefore I went into birth feeling it was natural and right and just what would happen.

Afterwards I felt like a complete and utter failure not being able to do the most natural of things.

glamourbadger · 07/12/2008 12:21

I had a c-section for my twins and personally don't feel as though I gave birth. They were whisked away to the NICU and I didn't get to see them for 24hrs - it felt like I had just had just been in surgery to have something "removed". That said, I don't have any negative feelings about it, or that I missed out.

I guess technically I did give birth to them, it's never really occurred to me. Just ignore this woman if she upset you, childbirth is such an emotive topic!

norksinmywaistband · 07/12/2008 12:26

Dragonbutter I have felt the same as you in that I have had a traumatic forceps delivery and one CS. I too attributed my feelings of failure in not naturally giving birth as a factor in my PND.

I to this day(am not having any more DC) feel a failure for not being able to birth my children as nature intended. which is daft as I carried them for 9 months, cared for them BF them for 6 months and despite the method of entry to the world, they Are my babies that I gave birth to.

That nagging feeling never left me though

2AdventSevenfoldShoes · 07/12/2008 12:31

yanbu
not a vaginal birth but you still gave birth to them.

jellybeans · 07/12/2008 12:32

I got this comment after my first CS. Upset me abit as already was shocked etc as it was unplanned CS. I have since had 3 CS and 2 full term normal births. My 1st VBAC I was elated and did feel I had 'done it' but in all honesty after loosing 2 babies late in pregnancy and having a crash CS that saved my son's life, I realise that it doesn't matter a jot how they are delivered, it only matters that they are here safe. It is still giving birth IMO baby just comes out another hole! Many 'normal births' are assisted anyway.

Original poster
Cupofteaplease · 07/12/2008 12:35

I find this really intersting, and I thank you for your responses. I'm not upset by her (she's not a friend either, she just happened to be at an event that I went to- I'll never see her again).

I'm beginning to think that maybe I am just a bit weird! DD was an em CS, and I just felt so lucky to have her, I never even considered how she was born. DD2 was a planned CS and she ended up in SCBU for a week. I failed at breastfeeding them both too- bad mummy! I've had comments before re being lazy or 'too posh to push' in regards to my planned CS, but I've never before been accused of not giving birth and I felt like it was an odd thing to say!

Perhaps I'm in the minority if many people feel disappointed about their CSs. I've just never felt that 'need' to give birth vaginally, that would lead me to feel that I've missed out on anything. But I know that other people can try and make you feel like you have. I'm not going to put a guilt trip on myself when I'm blessed with such wonderful children.

OP posts:
walkthedinosaur · 07/12/2008 12:37

I had two ceasarians also (not through choice obviously) and I always feel I've missed out on a huge thing and not given birth to my children, and it still to this day weighs on my mind, I always feel I've missed out on something important in their lives.

It doesn't help actually that one day when I was having a joke with my younger sister who did give birth naturally, but had to cross her legs every time she sneezed, we were have a laugh with each other, when my mother turned round and said to me, well at least she gave birth properly! That still hurts my feelings to this day, particularly as she knew how upset I'd been about DS1's birth in particular.

milge · 07/12/2008 12:37

I had a CS and feel that I did not give birth, in the active sense as I did nothing but lie on a table whilst the child was cut out from inside me.
I am however extremely grateful that my pelvic floor is intact.
Childbirth is so emotive, people get easily upset and beat them selves up for events that they had no control over. Its not worth sweating it, really.

MrsMattie · 07/12/2008 12:42

I've had 2 sections and definitely feel that I have given birth. Couldn't care less what anyone else thinks, tbh, but I have dealt with my birth experierences and feel fine about my sections (now).

Maybe that's the difference - if you still hanker after a vaginal birth experience and feel you 'missed out', you are more likely to feel that you haven't 'given birth'?

Original poster
Cupofteaplease · 07/12/2008 12:44

walkthedinosaur- that is really sad. I'm sorry your mum hurt your feelings like that. If you had made it clear that you were unhappy about it, she shouldn't have used it against you

OP posts:
Original poster
Cupofteaplease · 07/12/2008 12:45

MrsMattie that is exactly how I feel.

OP posts:
BouncingTinsel · 07/12/2008 12:50

Cupofteaplease - Silly woman!! Clearly talking out of her arse!

27 · 07/12/2008 12:52

I think that technically speaking having a csection would be called giving birth.
I've had 2 sections though, and personally I wouldnt call it giving birth. Not that I did anything wrong, I did what was needed to live, and have a live baby, but to me it doesnt remotely compare to getting the baby out the way nature intended, so I wouldnt use the same words for it.
I dont think there is anything negative meant when people say that a section isnt giving birth, its just what the words imply to some people.

bronze · 07/12/2008 13:00

Though I think you have given birth I dont think she was saying that but was saying if they come out a section cut then the size doesnt have the same impact as if it comes out naturally. Shes not even dissing c sections just stating a fact though obviously she didnt word it well enough.

ChubbyDickAndSnowBalls · 07/12/2008 13:03

I've had 3 c-sections and I do feel like I'm lying if I say I gave birth to them. I feel like I have to add on that I had them all by c-section.

I don't know why I feel like this (perhaps it's partly because I had a GA with all of them so went to sleep pg and woke up a few hours later with a baby at my side). Though if anyone else said it I'd be very annoyed and offended. I'm allowed to think it about me but no-one else is!

But I'm the same with breastfeeding. Didn't get the hang of it with DS3 so I exclusively pumped every single feed for 6.5 months. So all he had was breast milk but I felt like a liar if I said he was breastfed.

Rangirl · 07/12/2008 13:12

For some reason some women,(ok some people but ime it is women!)try and turn pregnancy/birth/motherhood into a competitive sport.I had one vaginal birt of my stillbornson and 2 CS for my dd and ds2.I know which 'Birth experience'I prefer.Someone once said to me they would feel chetaed to do have the birt without the labour felt like (but did not say) its better than the other way around

VeronicaMars · 07/12/2008 13:19

Concieve a baby and carry it for 40 weeks, no matter how it comes out you have given birth. Just because it didn't come out your foofoo doesn't mean anything.

devoutsceptic · 07/12/2008 13:25

Well it does mean something if you are discussing the size of babies in relationship to childbirth, doesn't it? Obviously it makes no difference if your baby is massive if you are having a caesarean. Maybe the woman should have said, 'well the size isn't so important if you don't have to push them down the birth canal and out of your fully-stretched vagina' but that might be a bit full on for a casual acquaintance, eh?
I had caesareans by the way.