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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To think that if you have a Caesarean, you have still given birth?

127 replies

Cupofteaplease · 07/12/2008 11:54

I got talking to a pregnant lady yesterday and conversation turned to pregnancy, birth and beyond.

She said she hoped her baby would be small, so childbirth would be less painful. I said that my babies were both 8lb + and I loved having chunky babies! She said, in reference to me having 2 caesareans, that it didn't matter how big my babies were because I hadn't given birth to them.

Now obviously, I knew what she meant. But I still felt a bit . I would still say I have given birth to 2 children, even if they were extracted from me! Am I wrong in saying this?

OP posts:

treedelivery · 07/12/2008 22:03

Ive only had a vaginal birth but I'd say baby in uterus, then baby out = birthing. There's only 2 escape routes for them and they both result in the same thing, an independant new life that isn't supported by a 'host' as it were.

How we as the 'host' interpret our reactions and feelings may be complex and affected by so many issues - but this basic fact remains constnt.

Wonder what her point of view will be if she has a section?

dsrplus8 · 07/12/2008 22:06

can i just point out one huge plus to c-births :no fanjo like a bucket afterward! .i think anyone who puts down c-bitrhs are a bit of the baggy fanny types.(i never had a c-birth, but have been told all the gorys from sis who had several,shes imensely proud of her "taughtness" tmi)

TinselBaublesMistletoe · 07/12/2008 22:12

dsr, not everyone who delivers naturally ends up with a "bucket" and not everyone who delivers by section is still tight. I may have delivered my first prematurely but I delivered everything in one go (born in the caul) so it was a lot bigger than the baby on her own. I have been unaffected by the birth. I have had people comment on how good my pelvic floor muscles are during internals, I was going to add more about internals, but I think it's going into TMI.

countingto10 · 07/12/2008 22:12

Definitely felt like I gave birth to DS4 (4th cs) what with the MW pushing with her shoulder on my stomach and the surgeon tugging my poor DS out at the same time - was physically lifted off the operating table . The nurse at my head couldn't believe it either !!!!

RedFraggle · 07/12/2008 22:22

I had an emergency section with DD that saved both of our lives and a planned section with DS because I could not bear the thought of anything that traumatic happening again.
As far as I am concerned I gave birth to both children. I grew them, I carried them and ultimately they left my body alive (albeit by the sunroof). Surely that is the point. They were both born alive.
I know some people say that it isn't the same as having laboured for hours. But do you know what? I laboured for hours with DD and yet the only safe exit for her was through my stomach.
I am just glad that there is the option for surgery for these situations....
In my view birth = producing a healthy, live baby.

dsrplus8 · 07/12/2008 22:23

im a fanjo bucket! had 5 births so wasnt going to escape it lol. at tinsels well sprungness my dd4 was caul too!

BlueyDragon · 07/12/2008 22:24

I was equally miffed to be told the other day that DD's delivery wasn't natural because it was ventouse assisted. Fluffy rubbish - just like this "you didn't give birth to them" stuff about your C-section, Cupoftea. There's still damage involved, and trauma, so the basic results are still the same. What does it matter if they're at stomach level or lower? Semantics should be saved for when they're important.

And you're not a bad mummy for not bf.

secretgarden · 07/12/2008 22:25

i had my 1st c section after my ds got stuck due to disproportion. all 'natural' labour up to that point, but was gutted as i wasn't awake when he came out and beat myself up for ages about it. the second one was booked and as i prepared myself for it, it was a calm experience and i definitely felt like i gave birth once my dd was placed in my arms. there's always going to be the 'one up on you' mum hanging around. i always feel people like that need to justify themselves as they are quite insecure underneath and probably just jealous as she's got a pelvic floor at ground level

BlueyDragon · 07/12/2008 22:25

Oh yes, and there's a baby as a result too. Forgot that bit!

blueshoes · 07/12/2008 22:26

tinsel, people comment on your pelvic floor muscles during internals? As if they weren't intrusive enough. I do believe it when you say you are still tight down there but I find such comments a tad creepy.

dsrplus8 · 07/12/2008 22:27

actually think "fanjobucket" would be a good name!, sorry of on a tangent.

ChristmasFairySantAsSLut · 07/12/2008 22:43

YANBU....and it wasn't the best thing to say.....however, n the other hand, I had to natural Births and my yongest son was born by Emergency C-section....and despite going through all teh labour bit (dilated to 10cm and was my most painful labour out of the 3) I did not feel I had given Birth to him...not in the way I felt with the other 2....
however, that was just my personal feelings and more to do with the way I felt about it all, rather than it being a reasonable response...iykwim

TinselBaublesMistletoe · 07/12/2008 23:44

It was when they had to swap to a metal speculum because my muscles are too good for a disposable one and then she still had to get someone else to do it! I was obviously relaxed (they don't bother me at all) so they knew it wasn't me getting tense and asked if I did my pelvic floor exercises. It was a situation they couldn't really avoid commenting on.

LOL and I wasn't going to go into detail.

What goes on in there is more about doing regular exercises than giving birth. I'm not able to do them like I used to anymore because of the damage to my back. When I first went for physio I was told that would be where we started and I couldn't even hold them for 5 seconds. It's probably a good thing with the fibronectin test, if they had problems before it would be even harder without lubrication [ouch]

skrimbo · 07/12/2008 23:46

God people say the most ridiculous things don't they.

On hearing the weight of my DS nearly every woman would say "Did you have him yourself?"....
ARGH!!! " NO the woman in the next bed did it all for me!!"

Same as "are you feeding him yourself?"....
"No I have a wet nurse that does it for me!"

dsrplus8 · 07/12/2008 23:47

tinselbaubles i think id have rather had a csection than what you went through!ouch

dizzyjingles · 07/12/2008 23:48

I had DD1 via VB assisted with high forceps. DD2 was EMCS after long non progressive labour and DD3 was an elective CS

I gave birth to them all as far as I'm concerned and I think anyone that suggests otherwise hasn't truely thought it through

dsrplus8 · 07/12/2008 23:51

op you should have told that "friend" to stop talking out her ar*e, cause unborn babies can hear you know.[poor baby tramatised in utero by mother spouting shite]

TinselBaublesMistletoe · 07/12/2008 23:51

Ya have to love that fibronectin test! The gel they use can interfere with the result so they run it under a tap so it's not dry. I've had two done this pregnancy (it's a fairly new test so I never had it before, but then I was already dilating when I got there so would be a no-brainer really) and after the last one I had a lecture for coming in too soon (2 min contractions at 30 weeks). Makes you wonder if doctors think I enjoy it!

dsrplus8 · 07/12/2008 23:54

yup ,gynie docs are mostly pervs, according to my dh lucky pervs, spending all days looking at fanjos( retch,at dh)

dsrplus8 · 07/12/2008 23:56

oooh WARNING GYNIE JOKE "did you hear about the deaf gynacologist?" "he read lips" ( bad isnt it lol)

Pinkyminkee · 08/12/2008 00:00

I find these sorts of comments very difficult. I know they don't mean it, but it still hurts, but that is proly more to do with the way I feel about my 'birth experiences'.

I do notice that none of the congratulations cards I received for the birth of my 3 children actually congratulate me on the 'birth of my child'. They all have comments like 'safe arrival', or just 'arrival', or just the name of the child, as if they arrived by stork.

bellabelly · 08/12/2008 00:24

It's weird because I've always felt like my twins were "born" and there was definitely a "birth" but I suppose I don't really feel like I have "given birth" (I had an elective c-section).

TinselBaublesMistletoe · 08/12/2008 01:31

bella, I think you've summed up what a lot of people have said in a lot more words!

blueshoes · 08/12/2008 08:58

pinkyminkee, you might be reading too much into the 'safe arrival' v. 'birth of child' language. I mean this kindly. I have only had cs and would be the last person to tell another cs mum that she did not give birth. I also happen to use the words 'safe arrival' a lot in congratulatory baby cards. I find it less gory.

notevenamousie · 08/12/2008 10:06

RedFraggle - birth = delivery of healthy baby - that is outrageous! Unhealthy babies, Stillborns, do these mothers not give birth?? I think what you said is very offensive, tbh.

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