I know I am but I'm going to do it anyway!

[mytetherisending]

DD2 is now 6mths, has been bf on demand mostly and is fully weaned on 3 meals with desserts, juice from a cup and the occasional snack. She is still demanding night feeds which I feel she shouldn't need if she took good feeds at 10 and 230. Instead she faffs with these and wants milk during the night. I have now decided to quit breast feeding as she will not take bottles- so it is all bottles or none iyswim. I hope that being able to see how much she takes during the day and a gentle prod to take more will reduce night feeding. I have dusted off the GF book which I used with dd1 (and who has only had a handful of disturbed nights since 3mths!) in the hope that the routine will get me some modicum of sleep. I am knackered.

I know it is unreasonable to give up bf for the sake of my sleep, however, dd1 is constantly tired (2.9mths) and is behaving awfully because of it. The baby disturbs her sleep every night

I just needed to vent sorry! Grrr to all those people who say babies get their own pattern and start sleeping eventually- I can't wait til 'eventually' happens!

Where do you feed in the day?
DS seems to think that everything is much more interesting than my armpit so a darkened room is sometimes the only place I can feed him.

Also, without judging when you started feeding, it is a definite possibility that she just isn't hungry because of the large meals. Would you be willing to try cutting down her meals?

If all you want to do by introducing bottles is see how much milk she is getting, why not hire a pump and give EBM?

Yes thats the plan for the wkend! By cc I don't leave to cry for ages. I go in the first time and settle then put down. If she cries again I leave it 5mins then go back in. If she cries when she hits the cot I keep going and pull the door to but not fully closed. The last 2-3 nights doing that she stopped crying once I left the room. I stood by the door to see if she settled before going back to bed. LOL I sound like a stalker because I do heavy breathing so she can hear me iyswim which seems to help.

Sidge.. my childrens needs have and always do come before my own.. i consider that teaching my children over the course of a week to feel safe, settled and content in their beds throughout the night is a remarkable gift to give them.

barnsleybelle you know what I totally agree with you. But I teach my children when they have the cognitive ability to be taught. And at 6 months old they don't have that ability. If they sleep through naturally, fine, but they do not have the cognitive development to be able to be taught to sleep. I believe that comes nearer the age of one.

not to teach you to suck eggs - but I found with DS he was always quicker first thing - quicker let down form me & also he was more efficient, but as the day wore on & he got more tired etc he was slower. (time wise, i've learnt you can't judge really from the boob how much they're taking as ther's loads of variables - ie your let down their efficiency etc etc)

tbh, LO prob ins't as keen on having FF from you as she can smell your milk - possibly anyhow??

oh and agree with VS - also around this time deal or no deal used to be on the telly - DS would move his head over so quickly & stop feeding dragging my boobs as well (ouch!) so dark places helped here as well - less distractions.

(ok really off now!)

(oh if you don't want to do the heavy breathing thing - how about door on the jar & you humming upstairs?? any good there?)

She does feed better without distractions sometimes but not always. In the mornings its difficult because I take dd1 out most days. In the afternoon dd1 is having a nap so I feed in the living room which is quiet.
I have tried cutting meals down but then she screams when its all gone and wants more. She is taking more from a bottle in the afternoons now.

I tried expressing but it takes me soooo long to get even 5oz that I couldn't fit it in if I tried. About an hour for 5oz with an electric pump!

It is quite funny that getting a child to sleep through is often put as giving a wonderful gift to the child like parents are a good fairy in Sleeping Beauty. 'I bestow this gift on your fair head..'.

At least admit its more for you than them.

I'm sorry but the weight of your baby really isn't relevant to when you should start solids. DS2 was 16 pounds 4 ounces at EIGHT WEEKS - you wouldn't seriously suggest that I should have started solids then?

sidge.... Well we agree on something, if not the age..

At the end of the day, we all have different feelings on this...

The thing that upset me most about this thread is when people have been described as "cruel" and viewing their children as an "inconvenience" or that as mothers we are putting our "own needs first". ( i know not from you, but other posters) just because we have chose a different nighttime routine from others.

Actually it is a gift because lots of children who don't learn to self settle become poorer sleepers in adulthood and later childhood. This can affect their education due to lack of concentration. Tiredness and lack of concentration is well documented.

No CT I wouldn't unless you were feeding for 30 mins or more every hour, then I would have done the same as I did.

Thank you MTS . Think we are out there on our own on this though!

I had to feed dd2 every 1-11/2hrs for 30mins at 13wks.

But it doesn't always work like that does it? You said your dd is a light sleeper and is disturbed by the baby crying despite her sleeping through from a young age.

Other people have babies that wake a lot as babies but sleep like logs as children.

Yes but dd1 is a good sleeper in that even if she is disturbed I don't know until the morning until she says 'dd2 woke me up' and she has big bags under her eyes. She doesn't get up out of bed.

Guadalupe... maybe i've read it wrong, but i think the children sleep in the same room??

Ds1 woke up a lot till he was two, now he's nearly eleven you have to drop a bomb to wake him in the night. DD also woke a lot though she is a lighter sleeper. I guess it depends a lot on the individual child too.

"i consider that teaching my children over the course of a week to feel safe, settled and content in their beds throughout the night is a remarkable gift to give them. "

But this is not what you are doing, what you are actually doing is teaching them that once you have put them in thier cot/bed for the night that there is no point crying, no matter how isolated or abandoned or insecure they feel, because no-one will come. That's not a remarkable gift, that's a sad, sad lesson.

My babies have not been lifted, rocked and fussed with in the night. They [shock horror] sleep with me and are quietly nursed back off to sleep with no noise or disturbance. Humans are a close contact species, our young are designed to stay close to thier mothers and feed regularly, well into thier first year. This modern obsession with seperate sleeping and long gaps between feeds is utterly unnatural.

and its not noise per say, I can hoover downstairs, potter upstairs and have the tv on loud which won't disturb her, nor the telephone. The baby crying is an alien noise iyswim so it wakes her.

Not actually in the same room but very thin walls- married quarter.

Well yes, if the crying baby is in the same room as the toddler then I can see that would disturb her. In that case it makes more sense to have the baby in with the parent surely, especially if she has bags and won't get up in the morning?

sorry x posts

I would have put dd2 back in with us but the cot won't fit in our room, which is why we moved her out in the first place. She is to big atm for the travel cot because of throwing her arms out sometimes, which also wakes her up when her hands hit the sides

once she outgrows the armflinging in the night she could go back in it, or I hadn't thought- I can swaddle her now because she seems to have started liking it.