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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

If you have not reserved seats on a train can you reasonably expect other passengers to stand to accomodate you and your DC?

155 replies

Upwind · 03/09/2008 10:39

I went on a long train journey on Friday afternoon & had reserved a seat. When I had lugged my bags up the length of the very long train to get to it, I found a sleeping toddler in my seat. Her mother asked me to sit elsewhere and she made the same request of the men who had booked the seat she and her DS were in. The men she had ousted stood in the corridor.

There were no seats available at rush hour that were not booked for most of my journey, and I moved twice in an effort to accomodate the family. When my ticket was inspected I was told I would have to move to my allocated seat if another passenger claimed theirs and I heard the guard clearly explaining to the mother that she would have to move if the people who booked her seat requested them. At Newcastle, the seat I was in was again claimed and now there seemed to be no other seats left. Being pregnant and tired, I did not feel able to stand and so asked the woman to move. She was aggressive and confrontational about it and I wound up loudly stating that were I not pregnant, I would stand but had booked a seat because I needed it. She vacated the seat angrily, scattering shitty wipes on the seat as she left.

So - was I being unreasonable to ask her to move? It would certainly have been easier for an obviously pregnant woman, travelling alone, to find a seat somewhere on the crowded train. But I could not face carrying my bags down the train again and was feeling paranoid about bashing my bump!

Was she being unreasonable in expecting other people to accomodate her on a Friday evening given that she had not reserved seats for her DC? The train guard said as much when she asked that he sort seats out for her. I think that had she been polite she would have been perfectly reasonable to try it on. Had she seemed in any way grateful I suspect I would have tried a bit harder to find a seat (e.g. by actually looking in the next carriage).

Or were the other passengers surrounding this being unreasonable in not offering their seats to resolve the situation?

OP posts:
Anna8888 · 03/09/2008 12:42

We have portable DVD players, games consoles etc and children get unlimited use on journeys (the only time we don't ration them). Plus books, colouring etc.

expatinscotland · 03/09/2008 12:44

Agree with wannabe.

I don't see what's wrong with teaching children from the get go that they are not the only people in the world and to behave accordingly in public.

TinkerBellesMum · 03/09/2008 12:45

I know it left you feeling awful, I think I would have felt the same, however she was sitting in a booked seat and had to know it and that she would be moved on if someone came. It isn't your problem that no one else would stand for her, you weren't in a position to. I would be furious to be honest if I had been so accommodating and she turned round and treated me like that.

TinkerBellesMum · 03/09/2008 12:50

Oh and when I take Tink on a train, which does happen quite a bit, I get an escort to the train so I am seated. I put her next to me if there isn't a seat and on my lap if there is. If it's a long journey I'll take food, drink and something for her to do.

mistlethrush · 03/09/2008 13:28

Ds is 3.5 - and, yes, I can quite happily occupy him with colouring, painting, reading etc - but travelling from 'Up't north' to Switzerland by train with no opportunity for him to have a really good romp for some time is asking for trouble imo. And I wouldn't want him to be running up and down the carriage - it isn't safe and it does disturb other people. So, if mil wants to take him over there, she can do it on a different train from one I'm travelling on! (not flying with him due to ear issues)

leosdad · 03/09/2008 13:35

I wonder if the seated family in the OP had bought the very expensive flexible seats (so had no reservation) and felt at that price they were entitled to a seat.

All the advanced superduper off peak no change or refund tickets I have bought have included seatreservation. Last time DC's (with tickets) moved up to let two other DC's share their pair of seats. They had got standard tickets (at least four times the cost of ours) hence no reservation

I always thought that you could be fined if you sat in a somebody else's reserved (or has that stopped now)

Janos · 03/09/2008 13:51

Just read the OP.

YANBU and she was very rude.

I've travelled on the train with my toddler DS quite a few times and that woman was out of order.

They were your seats and you had paid for them.

If you don't book seats on a train this is the risk you run..which is why I ALWAYS book!

noonki · 03/09/2008 14:10

YANBU at all

I think when you are pregnant you should ask for a seat anyway...

I learnt after a tram I was on did a practice emergency stop, the driver forewarned us that he would stop the tram 3 times, I was preggers and standing, and too embarrassed to ask for a seat...

even with warning half the carriage fell over.. I got knocked about, no problems but gave me a shock... if it wasn't a practice it could have been nasty

but after that I always asked for a seat when pregnant, not worth the risk

noonki · 03/09/2008 14:11

and I always give up my seat to someone pregnant, even with my toddlers with me (make them share one)

NickiSue · 03/09/2008 14:21

When I was (very obviously) 8 months pregnant - with varicose vein may I add - I had a three hour journey to do on the train and couldn't get my reserved seat. There was a very roudy bunch of (drunk) men around the table, shouting and carrying on and in truth i darent as them to move - the train was so oversubscribed, I also couldn't get out of the carriage to look elsewhere or ask someone to help. I was in agony at the end of it and no-one offered me a sat, even for a short time.
I wouldn't hesitate (and don't) to move me and DS into the aisle to let someone pg or otherwise needing a seat sit down - but then there are many people who wouldn't.
I did recently offer my seat to a pregnant lady who snapped "I'm PG not f*cking disabled", so she stood for the journey - no-one else dare ask offer!

Upwind · 03/09/2008 14:39

Nickisue, that is awful. If ever anyone had a case for being bumped up to first class you did!

OP posts:
LazyLinePainterJane · 03/09/2008 14:46

Oh I don't think that they should be allowed to run up and down carriages and screech! I just don't think that they should be expected to be silent the entire journey, and lets face it, sometimes it seems that is what some people seem to expect!

zippitippitoes · 03/09/2008 14:48

silent would be the ideal

MadameOvary · 03/09/2008 14:51

Agree with Janos,
Horrible woman. Know how it feels to be too tired to argue but like to think I'd have told her to vacate my booked seat. Esp if I was pregnant fgs. Cant believe you moved twice

poppy34 · 03/09/2008 17:08

agree wtih madame ovary how patient you were - I was so angry with hormones I'd have probably decked her when pregnant

elkiedee · 03/09/2008 17:58

I don't think you're being unreasonable. Especially if she was taking 3 seats reserved by others on a crowded train (my understanding is that the toddler was on 2 seats and she was on another).

I'm always irritated on long distance journeys by people who try to nab seats in the carriage which is totally packed with reservations. There's often areas which aren't all booked up. It does make it harder that someone has a child travelling with them, but my advice to anyone travelling with kids is that acutally you can probaly get even your baby a seat resrvation and still save money on buying a full adult fare yourself, now.

On long distance journeys I use a family railcard, it's actually cheaper to buy DS at nearly 16 months, and was even at 3 months, a ticket and get the discount myself, even more so if dp's with us. Especially now on National Express who've taken over from GNER, as they give discounts even on Apex fares with a card.

Upwind · 03/09/2008 18:11

It is great to have learned about the family railcard, especially since we sometimes travel with DN.

The woman in my OP had taken three seats booked by other passengers, one for her DD, one for her DS and one for herself. So, even with me insisting on sitting down, she could still have had two seats for her and dcs. I admit to being pleased when she flounced instead, as after her rudeness and aggression I did not fancy sitting with them! The remaining passenger at the set of four seats was a young man, whom I chatted with after she had moved. Maybe he should have offered his seat, but he had booked it and who knows how much he needed it?

OP posts:
mother2two · 03/09/2008 18:22

The other mother was unreasonable.

Presumably she knew she would be travelling on a busy train. I travel during off peak time so there sufficient chances of having a reserved seat when I book.

spicemonster · 03/09/2008 18:23

What a vile woman. Did she really leave a pile of shitty wipes for a pregnant woman to sit on? That's grim

Upwind · 03/09/2008 18:25

yep, she really left a few shitty wipes on my seat

she was clearly vile- flustered

OP posts:
3andnomore · 03/09/2008 18:27

Stupid cow...she should have booked a seat then...it wasn't your fault she didn't....why should you suffer for it?

Thing is, even if she couldn't reserve a seat for her child for whatever reasons...the kid should have sat on her lap, not your seat....

spicemonster · 03/09/2008 18:32

Jesus. Well I think you're a remarkably tolerant woman. When I was pregnant I was a raging madusa and if someone had been sitting in my seat at all I would have turfed them out. Or at least said 'you're sitting in my seat but I'll sit there for now'.

I would never ever leave shitty wipes. Even if you were an able-bodied bloke, that was your seat. Suck it up, love.

Turniphead1 · 03/09/2008 18:43

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request.

Turniphead1 · 03/09/2008 18:45

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Peachy · 03/09/2008 18:48

only read op

i'd move to accomodate a toddler, always. unless pg- plenty of others- but not mum- mum could stand nearby.

there could be any number of reasons for lack f booking, eg emergency so may be beyond control