To refuse to let the kids go their own christening?

[ProudMamaBear92]

So long story short I’m not religious but from a Christian background. DH is not from UK but is Christian orthodox family. Though rarely ever goes to church nor lives a devout life 😑.

he wants to christen the kids, I’d rather not but said if it’s important to him he can, I’ll go along with it. He can organise it as it’s something he wants, but my ONLY stipulation is no undressing and submersion of the kids.

We went to a nephews christening and the poor boy was publicly stripped naked and dunked in a barrel. I found it horrifying to watch and the child was inconsolable for a long while after. I disagree with it massively, it feels humiliating and a bit abusive to me.

Next year a cousin of DH is getting married abroad and the whole huge family is going. BIL and DH want to christen all the kids together, we have two they have two. Sure, makes sense. Bride is fine with us piggybacking her wedding week I did check with her.

They are insisting on orthodox ceremony, fine, but I’m insisting the priest mustn’t strip and dunk my kids.

They said maybe he will?! I’m repeating myself with this and just kind of getting shrugged off. There’s a language barrier also to work around and I feel I’m left out of the conversations ALOT. DH will never disagree with his brother, or his dad. History has proven it.

If they don’t take my wishes seriously, AIBUto just refuse to let the kids go full stop? Take the passports and refuse to let them leave the UK? Or just cause a massive scene at the christening?? What do I do??

That's not what Lexible is saying. She's saying that it's up to the individual to determine if they're compatible with the cultural difference, in advance, since it's not a surprise the cultural differences will come up. This was entirely predictable.

It is not a crime!

I understood what she was saying. It's a separate issue to whether the practice is acceptable or not, though.

Acceptable to whom? It's obviously "acceptable" to whole swathes of humanity. What you mean is - to you, or the values you consider normal here.

You're pretending it's possible to objectively say this is right or wrong, but like lots of cultural differences, it isn't. Which was Lexible's point.

The 4 year old is too old to be submerged. I’m sure if you ask they can wear white and ‘step’ in a pool/bath thing. They christen teens and adults and they don’t get dunked.

Well obviously I'm talking about what is acceptable to me, as that's how opinions work. But no, I don't consider that my opinion needs to change simply because lots of people don't share it - I've thought it out and I'm happy with it for a whole host of reasonable, logical reasons that don't include "well other people keep doing it, so it must be fine."

Of course morality is subjective, and I haven't argued otherwise, but I don't see why we should give things a free pass from scrutiny or criticism just because they arose from a particular culture or religion. Being culturally significant doesn't make something okay; nor does being widely practised; nor does having been practised for a long time.

I find it interesting that nobody has answered the question on whether it would be okay to strip a reception child naked in front of the class as a rite of passage into school.

You can objectively state whether this is right or wrong, if only because the church in question seems to be above UK law in this matter.

Is it legal to take off a child's clothing in front of a group of adults and then submerge this child in water? Assault, child exploitation etc.

Because swathes of humanity do this does not make it acceptable just because religion invokes some sort of special pleading in these matters which bizarrely the law turns a blind eye to.

Take out the religious element and ask yourself if these activities are lawful. Or chopping bits off a child's genitals by an unqualified person for no medical reason.

We have to tackle religious practices that are otherwise outside the law - they cannot go on getting away with all this. It horrifies me.

I find it interesting that nobody has answered the question on whether it would be okay to strip a reception child naked in front of the class as a rite of passage into school. - I am happy to answer that. Clearly not OK and safeguarding authorities would rightly be all over it.

No one would say it's ok to strip a reception child naked as a rite of passage, but you may have noticed that most people familiar with the subject said that no one would be stripping a four-year-old naked for baptism either. Not in a traditional Orthodox church!

OP's must be an untraditional one then, because that's the specific issue here!

No mine were in long gowns. The god parent held baby, removed shawl and priest undid buttons on gown and pulled it down a bit. I've never been to a Catholic Baptism where baby wasn't anointed with oil on head and chest.

If the child baptised was a baby, he would have been naked, that is true, but that would not or should not apply to a toddler. If anything, Orthodox religions are quite conservative when it comes to nudity.

That's why OP needs to have a conversation with the people actually organising the baptism to confirm what is actually happening and not rely on her husband.

It could actually be a very joyful family occasion and not a scary medieval ceremony.

Unlike you I read the OP, especially to avoid being obliquely accused of xenophobia by the less sharp posters.

Apology accepted.

Have the children consented to being baptised???

❓Much too deep for me, I’m afraid. 😳

Exactly!!!

i think the public stripping and dunking counts

Cult then?

It is not something your children would understand. If they lived amongst your DH’s family abroad then it would be ‘the norm’ there. And your children would be far more able to accept it.
But your children don’t. So it will seem wrong in so many ways.

You have to assert yourself and your opinion. And explain it.

I have no problem with faiths... I get that they mean a lot to some people.
I have no problem with rituals that bring families and communities together.

I do have a problem with organised religions acting outside the law that applies to everyone else. Or acting in ways that make others feel uncomfortable.

I also have a problem with a parent being manipulated into something that she is not happy with for her children ... all in the name of the special pleading reserved for religion.