to not want ds, 9, to attend the sex education lessons at school?

[fircone]

It's just that he is only a little boy. He is the youngest in the year and is completely un-streetwise. His friends' mothers are unhappy about these lessons too.

I'm not Victoria Gillick (remember her, anyone?) and I would be happy for information to be provided at the end of Year 6 before they move up to secondary school, but I strongly feel that at nine years old this is going to be all too much.

I know that there is the brigade who insist that children must be aware of everything from the earliest age, but I am happy for children to stay children for as long as possible.

And I think I've told this one before, but it bears repeating:

When I got pregnant with dd2, dd1 was 8. She was horrified when we told her, and said 'At school if your mum is having a baby, everyone teases you!'.

'???????' says I.

'Yes', she says, 'they go: "Aaah! Your mum and dad have sexed!"'

Sorry for hijack, but can anyone recommmmend appropriate books on this subject for DS1, just turned 4, who asked me the other day "how do the babies get into the Mummy's tummy" I dodged the question (we had just arrived at a playdate!) but would like some ideas on how to answer it if it pops up again. He is too factual and not easily fobbed off (He already knows how DS2 got out - I drew the line at showing him the hole thuogh, as he requested!)

Good for you Fircone! You sound like a fab mum who only wants the best for her DS.

Out of interest, twinkie (or anyone else) what books have you bought? Dd asked me where babies come from the other day ? I told her a seed came out of daddy?s willy and went into my tummy and a baby grew but she narrowed her eyes suspiciously and clearly that is not the end of the matter. I think a book might be a better way of dealing with this than me trying to work out what she?s going to understand and what is going to confuse her forever (she?s 3.5)

posts x-ed, melrose...that'll teach me not to type faster!

with the 'How do babies get into mummy's tummy' you can try the following.

'Daddy makes a special seed and mummy makes an egg, and they get together and make a baby'

and for many kids that may well be enough at that point. If they go on to ask how the two get together, you tell them.

just answer the question they ask you. It doesn't have to be the full 'Joy of Sex' exposition with the first question

try 'Mummy Laid An Egg' by Babette Cole.

Whether they know the detail of mechanics or not, I think they would feel at a disadvantage if they are left out, realise they are somehow missing out on info and get a potted school boy version instead. ds' Yr5 class is doing puberty atm in PSHCE and last week's included wet dreams and BO to much sniggering (mixed sex class). Not sure he has really made the full link yet or how much really sinks in.

DS1 got the talk when I was having DS2, and DS2 (almost 8) has had the talk.

What about them not being ready, left out or not?

Not ready to know basic biological facts, Itati? Don't really understand. We aren't talking about some heavy lecture about the emotional implications of sex etc. Or I don't think we are. Just a basic 'where babies come from'.

I just mean you will have some 7-9 year olds who have asked lots of questions so if they ask, they are ready for an age appropriate answer. There will also be some in the same age group who haven't asked a thing and aren't ready to start the conversation.

I honestly believe that the sex education provided in schools at this age by any reasonably competent teacher will be aimed at the age range of the class, taking into account the emotional maturity of individual children. Therefore, I don't think it will ever be a case of a child being "not ready" to be taught this stuff.

Do you mean because some kids already know more than others, the ones for whom it's all new will hear things that they shouldn't? (Wasn't clear what you mean). I just think that if kids are told the very basics, they accept it and move on. Most kids aren't very interested anyway! But I do think that by this age, they really ought to know where babies come from, and don't see why this knowledge is harmful.

That's great you've changed your mind fircone. I do hate it when people think that by telling children about the world, it will stop them 'being children'. There is nothing about knowledge of this type that is inappropriate, what is inappropriate is keeping them in ignorance because of adult prejudices.

i bet a million pounds that at 9 your ds knows way, way more than you realise anyway. Far better to allow him to be taught (and talk to him yourself on a long term on-going basis) about relationships, sex ed, etc.

I think too that it's being somewhat blinkered to think there are 9 yr olds out there who are not ready to know age appropriate basics of human nature. If they are going to school, they HAVE talked/heard stuff like this. It's great they get a chance to hear it in a planned, appropriate way from their teachers as well as in the playground!

That's an odd argument Itati. The idea that just because they haven't asked they're "not ready" to know? So if a girl doesn't ask, when do you tell them about periods etc.? When they've already started?

I think that the majority of children of 7-9 will have figured out that it feels good to touch themselves, though they might not be aware of the word masturbation. Talking to them and giving them information helps them to understand things they're already experiencing and prepare them for things to come e.g. body odour

exactly combustible.

I think actually it's a very 'adult' view that any child of 7 - 9 wouldn't be ready to be told facts about human reproduction/bodies. Children are open to all knowledge and do not judge in that way - that's what some adults do!

I don't believe I ever asked "How do I multiply figures greater than 10, ie 32 x 12?"

Doesn't mean I didn't need to be told!

Sigh.

Again I am in the wrong.

At that age, the school will probably only be informing them of the basic biology of sex. Speak to the school. KNowing about sex doesn't take away any of their childhood. Is it really preferable to opt out?

I wish very much that I had been able to ask my mother about the facts of life when I was ready to learn. But I was too embarrassed. Just like I never told her that I was afraid of the dark, bullied at school, really shortsighted on one eye. My brothers told her all sorts of things, but I only told her the nice uncomplicated things. And only asked uncomplicated questions. Thankfully, the school got sex education in before I started my periods in Year Six.

Dd was even earlier, but I am now less hung up and she was well prepared.

I had sex education in the first year of middle school (cant remember exact age).

It was done beautifully, working up from single cells and amoeba (sp) going through reproduction for different animals, we had chicks in an incubator in the classroom and tadpoles to frogs, we got to weigh them as they grew.

Once we got passed animals we moved on to humans, we did reproductive organs and looked at babies developing in the womb. I enjoyed and appreciated it so much and nothing about it was rude or cringey,I learned so much. I still have the workbook which I will always cherish, we even got to make stamps to print the covers.

When I got to secondary school we did it again focusing on the 'safe sex' issue, with a teacher who was clearly embarassed about teaching it and out of his depth. Referring to pubic hairs as public hairs I kid you not! I was already well past this thanks to what I learnt at middle school and the talks my mum had with me, following on from the work book.

So for me, I think done the right way, 9 years old when you want to learn, as opposed to 14 years old when you want to laugh is much better.

YABU he will still be a child but will have the basics on a v important part of life which will open the conversation for you to keep going.

At this age they are likely to learn playground versions of sex and the facts of life, mush better to be properly informed.