Kemi B - the best form of welfare is a well paying job...

[Oofftheflooff]

She is absolutely right isn't she? Discussing the triple lock pension challenge and instead focusing on getting people into work. Do you agree with her ? Working 3 or 6 or 9 hours to then top up with benefits isn't the way forward (not including disabilities in here )

I think the main problem with Badenoch's statement is that it is based on the assumption that there is a simple solution, i.e. 'get a better job' to a very complex problem, which is the way the economy, the labour market and corporate interests have distorted what is possible for the majority of ordinary working people. There isn't a simple fix because there are so many issues that need to be addressed

• The education system, which doesn't cater for all aptitudes and abilities and specifically fails on the vocational side;
• The lack of housing that is affordable for people on low wages - the step from renting to buying a first home has become too large for too many;
• The pay multiple has become too large. I'm all for people who are hardworking and talented doing well and earning a lot of money, but in a country like the UK it shouldn't be possible for someone to work full time hours and still be unable to afford the essentials without state support. This is the one that is going to be most complicated to untangle, but people do need to start accepting that nobody needs a wage of £1m plus every year. There's too much greed.
• The balance of power between employer and employee has tilted too far in the employers' favour with zero hours contracts and fire and rehire - both of these need to be harshly curtailed.
• The imbalance between available jobs and the number of people seeking work - this prices disabled people who want to work out of the market. This is where state support will be needed to provide incentives for employers to emply and retain people with disabilities and to ensure disabled staff have the accommodations they need to stay in work.

None of it is easy. Kemi Badenoch pretending that it is does the Conservative Party a huge disservice.

Ah well if you could see what I see then you’d maybe think differently. Two people both known to me. Both have the same diagnoses. Both only in their 40s. One takes painkillers and holds down a full time job. The other is using a disability scooter and has a car via the motobility scheme and doesn’t work.

But that’s what she does all the time, ditto the Tories. Issues meaningless sound bites and does nothing.

@IzzyLeng ”I suppose the problem is that if wages go up, the price of “stuff” goes up”

does that happen?

and posters on here complaining about every party okay Labour and conservatives - what would you like to see happen?

She is out of touch with the reality of there being over twice as many job seekers compared to vacancies... many of which will be NMW an zero hour roles that wont get anyone of benefits anyway.
Years ago, I was in a NMW job and could afford to live alone in a flat and have a decent social life and hobbies.
Nowadays, that is not possible due to the costs of living, housing costs in particular.
Yet the people in the often vital low paid roles are blamed for their own poverty.

So you've painted all benefit claimants with your same bigoted brush based on what??? One person? Do you know both these people well enough to claim that one is someone cheating the system, that they've lied about their capacity to work? Have you reported them for benefit fraud?

Because in the long run it would be pointless and increase inflation.

We should bring back shame. Loads of things would be improved (including public finances).

There are loads of jobs. People just don’t search properly or don’t want to do them. We have 2 care homes in our village and a pub. All offering flexible shifts in entry level things ‘no experience necessary, we will teach you everything’. All the jobs have been advertised on repeat for months. Meanwhile there are a lot of unemployed locals complaining online about how UC will make them look for a job but ‘there’s nothing out there’.

It’s awful but I agree. There’s a lot of entitlement which is excused away ‘because billionaires’. And a lot of people taking home far more in benefits than a full time working person.

Care work should never be the last resort for someone not suited to it. Vulnerable people deserve better.

And i wonder what long term effects are caused by taking those painkillers.

But it’s suited to people just doing it for a visa?

I know two people with the same diagnosis too. One can hold down her job with support. The other can not work at all, and is constantly in and out of hospital.
It is almost as if two people with the same diagnosis can be different... 🙄

Why does the care sector have such a high turnover of staff?

I imagine once they get the indefinite leave to remain they look for something else.

Of course I agree with her. You don't have to be a Tory to understand that well paid employment is an excellent thing, both for the worker and society. The ideal is for everyone who can to be contributing in accordance with their abilities, and be well rewarded for their labour.
Unfortunately, it's not the what, it's the how, and the devils in the detail.
I suspect once we got beyond agreement with Badenoch stating the obvious, we may diverge when it came to matters such as:
Who is capable of work
What constitutes 'well paid work'.
How we move people into jobs.
How we force employers to pay people well.

But they are minimum wage jobs reliant on high levels of benefits. I thought Kemi said this wasn’t ok. Would you like your baby or elderly parent to be cared by somebody forced to do a job nobody wants to do with zero experience and pay that is peanuts?

If actively looking for work is part of their UC claim then they will have good reason for not taking these roles, otherwise they will be sanctioned.

And how do you know the roles that are advertised are not one that keep getting filled (with people entirely unsuited for care work but having to take it so they can keep the roof over their head) and then become vacant again? Many care homes have huge turn over of staff.

Is it people’s fault if their wages are 💩. So how about demanding that employers pay workers a good days pay for a hard days work. I know she can’t at the moment as she’s not in power I’m only saying that to defend my point. Please don’t get me wrong I’m glad UC exists but it should only be there for the Unemployed and the sick and Part time workers. If you’re working 6 days a week 8 hours a day your wages alone should be more than enough to cover you. I bet there are people out there who get more or not much less in UC than they do on their wages

Swap care homes for childrens homes and now we are talking
Because if its ok for the elderly to be cared for by ppl who dont want to be there its ok for kids too right?

She will never do that. UC is a tax payer subsidy of businesses and landlords, funnelled through the low paid worker and the exploited renter. Its a neat system. Because instead of people questioning why we are subsidising landlords and businesses, we can be encouraged to complain about and resent the hapless claimant through whom the money is laundered. Who, as you rightly point out, is not to blame for low wages and high rents.

Wrt single parents - the state didn’t choose to procreate- so why do the children become the state’s problem because the parents can’t sort out parenting them?
yes no one has crystal ball etc but why does it become someone else’s problem?

How do you know everyone who works with kids actually wants to be there? What a weird thing to assume.

They haven’t applied for them. How this farce continues I have no idea.