Kemi B - the best form of welfare is a well paying job...

[Oofftheflooff]

She is absolutely right isn't she? Discussing the triple lock pension challenge and instead focusing on getting people into work. Do you agree with her ? Working 3 or 6 or 9 hours to then top up with benefits isn't the way forward (not including disabilities in here )

Exactly. I bet that person will crash and burn eventually. They'll probably end up costing just as much as the person who doesn't work.

If you knew the individuals involved you’d be aware that some people want to work and others don’t.

She's not wrong, but British employers have coasted along for a long time, sure in the knowledge that low wages will be topped up by the taxpayers while company owners and shareholders laugh all the way to the bank.

Welfare has boosted the bottom line of British business and industry for decades. I can't see them cheerfully agreeing to better pay for employees in order to reduce the dependence on welfare.

This. It's a great idea that everyone who can and wants to work (as in, not everyone maybe needs to) can find a job that pays sufficiently to keep them above the poverty line, enough to keep them healthy and cared for so they didn't need to rely on the state. However...it'd obviously be great if Kemi could get on with clicking her fingers and making that magically happen...

Someone who gets about using a mobility scooter is going to find the pool of jobs they could apply for a lot smaller than someone who is not.

Yes I agree with her. Too bad the Tories killed off all our industry.

I honesty think somebody needs to conduct a proper study as to the ‘reasons’ people have come up with as to why so many people absolutely cannot work, and what’s more, anyone who suggests they should is unreasonable, despite it very much not being unreasonable to expect other people to work to fund them.

The mental gymnastics are incredible, Simone Biles would be jealous.

When you are disabled, the biggest barrier to employment is not the person in the mirror. It is employers.

We have great disability equality laws compared to the majority of other countries. It hasn’t really made a difference. A lot of people who could work are not working and I stand by that statement.

But your individuals are just that - individuals. This is what is known as 'anecdata'. Whereas my point about medical diagnosis presenting in a range of different ways is... data.

Those laws are good if you are already in employment and become disabled.
Not so much if you are disabled and job hunting. Employers can't be forced to employ a disabled person.

They are also no good if you are the carer of a disabled person.

Yep.

I'm not disabled but care for my disabled son.

No one is going to hire me when I need flexibility, regular time off for appointments/meetings and many more unexpected time off as my son gets poorly more than typical children when there's 100's more people out there they can hire who don't have caring needs as intense as me. So not working and UC it is.

The Trust where I work has a service which is aimed at getting people with serious and enduring mental health conditions back into work. This service is highly effective. They collaborate with employers, they know people are on their books for the longer term - at least 12 to 18 months - and they get results.

But. This service costs money. In the long term yes, it pays for itself and more. However, it's very clear that without services of this kind, and without employers engaging with such services, a considerable subset of people will not get into work. Which is bad, because the benefits of being in work are manifold. What people are taking issue with in terms of Badenoch's statements is that she does not acknowledge the complexity and is still simplistically yammering on about how cutting benefits will magically make people get jobs and stay in them. It won't.

She does, our situations could change, plus we can't afford to give her money to top up her rent, which, working full time, she still struggles with. She's applied for shared ownership and been rejected. There's no way that we'd encourage her to not claim what she is entitled to. The housing policies, local housing allowance has caused housing issues in areas that didn't need them. I thought that life was tough in Thatcher's Liverpool in the 80's, but at least there was housing, dentists, free adult education and other services. Life for my grandchildren is going to be difficult. Luckily they will have inheritance. The majority of children who they go to school with won't and people fear for their future.

And public transport.

I’m a lone parent with zero support and nursery aged child. I earn just enough to get zero support (including child benefit) but seemingly enough for other people to decide to work part time.

it’s doable. It’s just bloody tough.

Too bad it was even worse in the Blair/ Brown era and rapidly declining right now.

The biggest issue is people don’t want to employ certain people but also don’t want them on benefits so it’s a case of I want them to work but i don’t want to employ/work with them personally.
So the real question should be would you rather someone be on benefits or would you rather employ/work with them?

NIMW

Not In My Workplace

Burnham’s trying to put that right.

This is an excellent point. All these people convinced there is a cohort of idle scrounging wasters fleecing the system would surely not want to be served their coffee, have their parent cared for or share a workload with this band of lazy ne'er do wells.