To be glad triple lock going and hope they means test it too

[Randomamsi]

I have a multi millionaire senior relative who receives £1,400 from the state pension each month, in addition to 6k private pension.

He's not means tested and he's received that for 30 years. Yes, he paid into the system but he does not need it!!! He also had free uni, dirt cheap first house back in the 60s and retired aged 59.

Meanwhile the younger generation:

• thousands in student loan debt
• asset poor as can't get on the housing ladder
• means tested for child benefit, tax free childcare etc
• working until late 60s/ 70s

Why do pensioners have it easy while younger ones pay the price?

For vulnerable pensioners at risk of poverty, there should obviously be provision to help them, I'm not suggesting we let people starve. But multimillionaire pensioners or very asset rich pensioners do NOT need the state pension. It's about time things changed.

Or them!

Not all pensioners are rich. The state pension is low.

Re pip they’d be then means testing the working. Frankly if I was disabled and work was hugely difficult and pip helped me to access it I’d ditch the job.

What I find ironic is the very people decrying state pensioners and pensioners will be the ones advocating for them in 10 /20 years time as they edge closer to it themselves and they realise how small the state and most private pensions are. It comes quicker than you think.

I am happy for them to remove the triple lock but it is worth remembering that state pensions are taxable income so your relative will be paying back 40% in tax (as they should)

Yes, it looks far off but it’s their pension, not everyone will have a private one.

The preliminary findings of the Timms report don’t advocate for means testing PIP. The full result will be published next month but they’re looking at things like support being offered instead of cash for certain mental health conditions, and musculoskeletal issues, as these make up a disproportionate number of claims. The proposals would mean PIP is a completely different benefit to the one we’re used to, with different eligibility criteria and assessment systems.

Yes, except it is highly unlikely we’re going to be as absolutely minted as a huge chunk of your generation, who are the only people OP is complaining about. Not ordinarily well off people.

Financially illiterate post. Full old state pension will reach 184.90 per week from next April, a long way shy of the OP's suggested figure for the claimed "rich relative". .

You need a pension pot of around £1 million not to be poor in retirement, because you want it to have annual increases. So if you have an average house and a pension post that wont have you living in poverty you are likely to be near OP's 2 million that apparently makes you rich. In London you would be "rich" . No, it would still leave you struggling to pay care costs should you need them.

The idea behind the triple lock was that pensioners should share in the general prosperity of the country. The average single pensioner lives on £14,664 and a couple on £30,940 - a long way from the picture OP wishes to paint.

Which is where the state safety net comes in and makes the contributions for you if you’re eligible. There are also a lot of people who simply won’t qualify for a full state pension because they haven’t made the necessary contributions and either didn’t qualify or didn’t know that they may have got help.

Why are people on £34k getting UC of £500 a month if pensioners( most of whom never had UC) are deemed as rich on £30k.

So, it’s ’whatever he gets’ but you said you’ve seen the bank statements…so does get £1,400 a month or not?

Also lots of multi millionaire pensioners haven’t ’earned their money’ like many of this thread are saying. It’s often not hard-earned, but the product of family wealth and generational luck.

(Sorry OP you’ve got me on my absolute red face issue here— my teen asked about it the other day and got more than she bargained for over while I washed up!!)

Yep not sure op has done her maths! And totally agree…I have paid in I should get it back.

This.

Thanks for summarising and articulating this so well.

There’s so much greed and entitlement to others people’s earned income coupled with nastiness towards “the rich” that I think most in this country forget the basic facts that’s it’s as small number of people keeping the country afloat.

On a small local scale (eg a family), I don’t think there’d be such vitreol and hatred towards the main breadwinner (= individual paying the most tax in this analogy) yet at societal level, not only are they not thanked for their contribution, they’re vilified and pressed for more! Makes zero sense

They are; they're more than half the benefits bill.

People with money have been leaving. Labour thinks pensioners wont leave but that's a mistake. I'd be planning my exit but dh doesnt want to as he has more ties here. www.imidaily.com/europe/britains-millionaire-count-drops-59-in-4-years/

It’s a really unpleasant facet of the UK, not helped by Labour’s rhetoric and class divisive politics.

Yes that’s what I was trying to say. It’s not your money that you’re getting back so the system doesn’t owe it back to you.

@SeriaMau - I've asked ChatGPT to do the calculation, investing both employers and employee contribution into the ftse 100 each month for the last 45 years, re-investing dividends, for someone on the boundary of top 10% income.

Ie what you would have got if you'd invested the money yourself instead of giving it to the government to manage for you... or rather, to redistribute to lower earners.

It calculated that you would have paid in £326k, and with dividends reinvested and capital growth, that would now be £1.38m.

The exact money you've handed over (£326k) would give you an index linked annuity income of £19,364 for the rest of your life.

If you actually consider the value of when you handed that money over, the £1.38m you would have now (if you had invested it in something like the Australian super, instead of giving it to the government each month to manage) would give you an index linked annuity income of £81,972 for the rest of your life.

Thought provoking.

YABVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVU

I have paid my stamps for 40 years, and I am STILL paying, and will do for another 10 years at least.

Anyone telling me I won't get a Pension at the end of it can FUCK OFF

It doesn't matter whether I have assets (I do). I was sold that dream at 16, and I have paid in, in good faith, for all these years.

If I don't need the money, it's my choice what I do with it - maybe I'd choose to support a grandchild to get on the housing ladder, maybe I'd splurge it on a cruise, who knows, but that's my choice to make.

I did what the Government asked of me - they told me that if I pay NI, that I will get a State Pension. They don't get to just decide when I'm 67, that despite me paying what they have asked me to, for 51 YEARS, that they aren't holding up their end of the bargain. They already moved the goal post by 7 years, which is bad enough.

And btw, you are moaning about the things you get now as a younger person, but let me tell you, you get lots of perks that we never had, like free childcare.

And also, the State Pension is a lousy £1000 a month - could YOU live on that?

OMG, I have the absolute RAGE now.

They should make UC contributory, in the way it is in others stars such that you need to have contributed before you can benefit from it.

France for example: any unemployment support is conditional on you having contributed and the amount you get is linked to your previous salary (sensible in my view, as your financial commitments that will need covered during any temporary gap in employment will be linked to your income. It also pays out more to those who pay in more).

How does he get £1400 a month state pension? It's £184.90 per week.

It's not really a pension scheme. Ni is basically another word for tax...the state pension is a benefit. You're not really paying in for anything...it's a bit of an illusion. You can't opt out...it's taken automatically from your paycheck.

I find it ridiculous when people say I've worked all my life and paid taxes...you did that because like all of us you needed money, stop pretending you were just doing it as a massive favour to the country...and paying tax is the law and usually just taken out of your paycheck so no, paying taxes isn't particularly worthy

It is.