To be disappointed Dolly Parton supported biological men using women's toilets?

[Jane3212]

I really liked her music and she seemed like a nice person: her Imagination Library came to my borough recently. I was very sad to hear she'd died.
But was very disappointed to read this. The statements she made about trans people deserving respect, no issue with those.
But minimising the reasonable concerns women have about being forced to let men in their toilets was wrong.
I'm not saying she should have spoken out for GC issues. It might have been best just not to comment.
Parton had connections with drag queens and I wonder if that's the lens she saw transwomen through : not an excuse but might partially explain.

She had a transwoman friend. She once said if she had been born male, she would have been a drag queen. She saw the good in people she liked. I don't think she thought about bad men who would take advantage of things like self id. Her experience was old school transsexuals.

Nobody is perfect. I just wish everybody realised that and respectful debate was possible.

She’s been dead less than 2 weeks for crying out loud!!!

I take the point being made here, but she’s actually been dead nearly four weeks. I remember it because it was the day I came back from holiday.

I get she grew up poor but it was a long time ago

rich people dont see the public bathroom sharing as an issue because it never affects them if they had to share they might think twice Which is why I tend to ignore their opinions on this subject

The OP is interesting. It near enough literally says 'she should not have expressed a view that's different from the GC viewpoint'.

This is the hard right for you. it wants to shut down any expression of tolerance or decency. The 'GC' movement has strayed a long way from being anything to with protecting women's rights.

I’m embarrassed for you OP.

👏

Dolly mainly tried to stay politically neutral. She looked for the best in people and tried to spread some living kindness around. She had a faith in a loving God.

Yet we have the evangelical Christians quoting what she said and publicly saying it wasn’t biblical and now the gender critical purists quoting what she said and saying it doesn’t align exactly with their views.

I think it is sad that we live in a world so divided that a much loved, generous, kind and talented women can’t be allowed to rest in peace for a few weeks without these sort of public judgements being proclaimed.

Not everyone is going to agree exactly with any ideology. We are all doing our best to live as well as we can according to our own values. Let’s not spend our time being disappointed with everyone who doesn’t agree exactly with what we think.

It wouldn't be Mumsnet without a "trans" take on a subject,,, even so 3/10 for effort.

In the UK, Womens Rights have been the driving factor.
In the US, its lumped in with Anti-Women and Anti-Gay policies.

Its natural that any philantrophic celebrity in the US will be supportive of the victims of those policies.

(From what ive seen... most people seem to be supportive of the new sports and orison policies, just not the "bathroom" issue as its called there)

Miaow.

You can’t agree with people all the time. Just because you don’t agree with someone on one issue doesn’t mean you have to cut them out, this is the problem with politics today, everything is so bipartisan.

Dolly Parton is my absolute idol, I’m GC, I understand how in her world she’s wasn’t (I’m sure someone has already raised her driver, the reason she was so empathetic to trans people).

So she wasn’t GC, so what. It’s not as if she wasn’t lobbying lawmakers and sports bodies to push trans people into protected spaces.

Just waiting for someone to cancel her for not speaking out against Israel.

Her driver, she actually funded the surgery, worked together for decades.

She either didn’t want to be cancelled or didn’t understand why as a lot of rich and privileged people don’t see why single sex spaces need to exist. They have never been in a position to use them. Like refuges and prisons

Nobody is above criticism, obviously.

But this rather begs the question: why on earth are you expending this much energy picking apart celebrities who were, by all accounts, decent, generous people who gave considerably more to the world than they ever took from it - seemingly just to rummage around for something, anything, to criticise?

What exactly is the objective here? Why is this considered a worthwhile use of your time when there are plenty of genuinely vile, damaging people in the world who actually do need to be held accountable? Wouldn’t directing your outrage towards people who have caused real harm be, you know, somewhat more productive?

I genuinely don't understand the obsession with finding fault in people as though uncovering some minor imperfection is a great “AHA! GOTCHA!” moment. Congratulations, I suppose: you have discovered that human beings are not perfect.

None of us are -including you, OP. I’m quite sure that if someone decided to go digging through your private life with the same level of forensic enthusiasm, they could find things to criticise too and parade your shortcomings around like some kind of negative Mardi Gras.

The fact that someone was fundamentally a good person doesn't require us to pretend they were flawless. It simply means that, on the grand scale of things, perhaps their flaws aren't the most pressing moral emergency of our time.

Yes, you’re being unreasonable Jane.

I love Dolly all the more for finding out that she took this position. x
What an awesome woman.

I love Dolly too but I don’t agree with her on this one. It’s ok, I’m not about to become the ‘cancel culture’! It’s ok to have a difference of opinion.

Dolly supported trans people. You disagree with her. OK, but why is this relevant here and now? There is a whole Mumsnet board for slagging off trans people, head over there and you will find like minded folk to indulge your personal prejudice.

Ffs she’s dead! People can have different opinions to you op. It’s ok.

I’m very very GC - in fact I’d go as far as to say yes, I’m anti-trans - and I don’t agree with her but it’s hardly unusual for a rich woman who is never going to be affected by men in women’s spaces to be keen to be seen as “inclusive”.

Or maybe she was not anti-trans and it was nothing to do with her being rich. One of Dolly's closest friends was trans, she knew trans people and was happy to have them in her life. You can't dismiss every view you disagree with as ignorance - it makes you sound blinkered and ignorant.

Hmm… using the death of a beloved person to further stigmatise and victimise a tiny minority is disgusting.

You phrased the subject of your thread in a way that includes all biological males, yet the issue you are alluding to is transwomen, less than 0.1% of society.

Hating minorities is not a good way to conduct yourself.

You don't need to be rich to not be obsessed with public toilets.

many people just don’t think enough about or know enough about gender ideology to fully understand how it impacts children and women. You can tell just by listening to conversations online from women who think they’re just being kind by pretending to think men are women.
Once you see it, you can’t unsee it and you only reach that point from going beneath the surface and digging into the cult of gender and how it’s been used as a vehicle for fetishisation and male rights movements.
The worst part obviously is the impact on children and the irreversible harms caused, often aided and abetted by parents who believe they’re just “being kind.”
I love Dolly and I’m sure she knew the difference between a woman and a trans woman.

yep