What am I doing wrong regarding school mums?

[Schooolm]

I really struggle with this group of mums, I don’t know where I’m going wrong, can I talk about today for example and get some insight on where to improve my interactions?

I recognised a mum in my son’s year group (year 2) it’s a 3 form entry, and said hello to her, we sat on a bench together waiting. Conversation was polite and nice. Another mum I recognised walked near us and I said hello to her too and she was standing so I moved to the edge and said there’s a seat here. We talked for about 20 seconds and then I introduced the other lady to her and they chatted which was fine but then they just talked to each other and didn’t even look in my direction. I tried to interject where I could but they didn’t even make eye contact again. They carried on chatting after 5 minutes I got up and said “have a nice weekend, take care” really friendly not in a horrible way, they looked up said bye and carried on talking! I felt a bit uncomfortable just sitting there on the edge whilst they were chatting away there so that’s why I said bye and moved closer to where kids will line up.

I said hi to the people I was standing next to. I smiled and was friendly to all the new parents. The kids parents from my sons class who is in year 2 now came to the line one by one but not one said hello to me! I am always the person that first says hello so today I thought let’s see what happens. The one I thought was good friends with me as she’s been to my house numerous times and we have met up for coffee without the kids and play dates with the kids she blanked me too! She said hello to the other parents in my class and there were about 8 of them in a circle talking,

Y am I going wrong? Please don’t dismiss my feeling by saying usual moment stuff of “who cares “, “why don’t you make friends outside of the mum groups”. I don’t want to be best buddies with becomes but I do want to not walk away every Friday feeling they hate me and I’ve done something wrong, I only see them Fridays as it’s my job working day, but I don’t think this is the reason we’re not close as there’s a doctor in the group too and she only goes pink up and drop offs like 2 times a month whereas I am there once a week sometimes 2 or 3 if I don’t have meetings.

From what you've written, I'd say you come across as quite intense so that may be where you're going wrong.

I also think there was no problem with the first two mums having a 5 minute conversation after they'd both spoken to you.

Maybe step back a bit from the intensity and you might find more people approach you to say hello.

try not to worry . I’ve managed to totally mess up interactions because I’m autistic and sometimes can’t speak. When a mum tried to talk to me I ended up coming across really rudely, then one day I was stressed and rushing and deliberately sat away from everyone. In a week and a half I’ve managed to ruin it all to the point where the mum I was off with spoke to someone else about me who asked me directly did I have a problem with her as she had felt I was very cold and unpleasant towards her

@TinyTempest thank you. How can I be less intense? I think a part of me is upset as I would never exclude anyone. If I was talking to a mum and another one joined us I would have eye contact with both and talk to them both not have my back to one and just talk to the other. I think it’s basic manners to not exclude people in conversations and not to have your back to one person in the group.

You are reading way too much into this. You are over thinking. People are busy or
mighy have something specific to talk to
another parent about. You also don’t know what day someone has had they might just smile and not be up for talking. I use to have such a busy day at work and when it was pick up time I would dread having to talk to any mums as I had no social battery left at that time. Even the ones I am really friends with outside of school hours.

I think I’m not asking the question properly, I feel excluded and I am wondering how not to feel like this as it makes me really upset and I don’t want these interactions to stay with me well past. I know I should let it go and not feel bad but seriously where is the switch not to feel like you’re back in school being excluded and left out! I don’t enjoy feeling like this and maybe there is something wrong with me but can I please have some advice on how

You just have to not care. Pretend not to care. Be friendly in a very casual way. Pretend not to care or need anyone to talk to you or be friendly back. If they are friendly, great! If not, you don't care. You have plenty of friends and a life outside the school gate. You don't need these new ones. Eventually you will believe it and once you do, people will be more friendly. It's just the natural way of things.

@Poppingby thank you so much! What goes through my head is “why don’t they like me”, “am I strange and weird?” And “why can’t I easily get along with people like they all are, they seem bonded but I’m on the outskirts of the group”

Don't enter the school mum gate drama. Just smile and carry on. Not worth more. Be nice and polite towards the other mums - it's fine and enough.

I guess you can be less intense by understanding that not everyone is the same as you.

And that sometimes parents just want to grab their child and go, other times they may feel more sociable.

It's not right to force your way onto others and much better to be led by them.

Thank you. But why can’t they include me in their group? I’m friendly, polite and my son gets along with everyone. I just feel they hate me and I don’t know why,

Oh and not to sound unkind, but the vast majority of parents won't particularly have an opinion on you one way or the other.

This sounds a bit paranoid.

Hi OP

Are you, or your child, different to the typical demographic of the school in any way? Or neurodivergent?

"Why don't they like me?"

"Am I strange and weird?"

"I just feel like they hate me"

You really do need to think about yourself a lot less OP.

Because you can guarantee most parents will just be thinking about picking their kids up and getting the dinner on.

No one here can answer why these people are the way they are towards you.

You sound friendly and approachable.

You may be expecting too much from them. They may just not put as much thought or importance on these interactions.

Feeling like they hate you and youve done something wrong makes it sound like you are desperate for some sort of approval.
People can sometimes pick up on this and might make them back off.

Reality is everyone is just hanging around making smalltalk until the kids arrive.

@Schooolm when you were friendly with the woman you talk about were you messaging a lot and suggesting a lot of meet ups?

Yes I know those feelings well, but they always cropped up when I was feeling crap about myself for a reason that had nothing to do with the school gate. I think these sorts of social interactions can throw up a load of stuff for a certain sort of person (of which I am one). Not fun, but you have to work on yourself outside this environment so you are happier and more robust, and when you are there, practise not caring. It genuinely helps. Pretend to be one of those mums who just nips in to get their kids as a practical task to be done. (Those mums will say 'what else is it?' because they don't do the neurotic thing. Sorry but it's true isn't it). It is just a practical task, you need to get your kids, you'll be friendly and maybe even distant, it means nothing other than that. Practise practise practise.

I think people tend to just have friends that they will naturally gravitate to speak to (which MN will often brand cliques but in reality it’s mostly just groups of women who are friendly). I have some mum friends who I will stand with and chat to if they are in the school playground, because we are friends outside of school too and it’s natural to do so. Otherwise I just go to school, collect my child and leave and don’t really think about it.

Some people seem to have really intense playground and school run expectations and experiences but I think most people just want to go there and leave and aren’t really overthinking social interactions.

You don't know you've ever excluded someone though do you?

Do you seek feedback on every single interaction you have?

No.

Your example does sound unlucky though if these two women didn’t know each other and then spent all that time talking exclusively to each other. Perhaps they were kindred spirits or soul mates! If they already knew each other then I’d just class it as one of those natural interactions where you are having small talk with someone you don’t know that well then a friend turns up and you naturally just kind of gravitate towards them.

They don't hate you. Let it go.

Not everyone is mindful of including everyone in a conversation. You might also have appeared uninterested in the subject (it happens to all of us).

Be open minded and approachable at school gates. Smile. Say hallo to other mums. Be kind. It's more than enough.

The other mums aren't your friends. Just parents happening to pick up children at the same time as you.

Don't expect everyone to be interested in you or speak to you at pick up. School gates aren't for more than "Oh hallo Jacob's mummy here we go again". That is more or less how it works for all of us at school gates. Trust me.

I know the feeling you’re describing, and I really feel for you. But I think more people on the school gate than you realise probably feel just as awkward and paranoid as you do, they might just be better at masking it.

It really doesn’t sound like youve done anything wrong. So, I think all you can to do is try not to care too much - and if you can’t do that, pretend not too care to much, until eventually the pretend feeling becomes real.

Keep being friendly and generous, make eye contact and smile, then be ready to walk away and say, okay bye see you next week.

Although you are probably lovely, I think you are expecting too much. It's just pick up/drop off time. They don't hate you but they do have their own things going on. They are thinking about whether they have enough pasta for tea, whether the car will pas MOT, how to pay the leccy bill.

Most of them will not be looking to make friends at the school gates with other parents. (there's another, v long thread on MN today about why being friends is so difficult) So being friendly/polite is good but don't expect anything at all! Like in every other part of your life, some of the people you meet may become friends but most won't.

Also, it's all well and good being friendly with them but post-primary, many of these 'friendships' will prove to be situation-ships, similar to good relations with colleagues which end the day one of you leaves that workplace.

Hi, I have a different accent from them (they are all born and raised in London), I would say based on my interactions with them I may be ND but then why is it when I go back home I feel normal? I can chat to people and leave it there not dwell for hours on end,

plus when I take my son to swimming I chat with the mums there and don’t feel anything like I do with the class mums.

Also karate on Saturdays I chat with both the mums and dads and sometimes don’t and read my book in silence but I do NOT come away feeling the same way I do now. It’s Friday and I’m thinking of them! I’m sat here going over conversations I just had 3 hours ago but with people in other scenarios I don’t and I feel part of the group and normal

School gates are so often discussed on MN as hard work.
You are doing fine.

I understand how you feel op, I used to feel like that in some situations and you have to stop yourself from digging yourself into a bigger hole. If your mind goes to school, purposely think of something else. You know that you get on with people, as you gave examples of other situations where you chat happily, so you are not the problem. These mums at school won't hate you, it's more likely that, due to how friendly you are, they see you as a confident friend of everyone and so they don't need to make a special effort to make sure you're included, if you see what I mean.
The good news is that by my age (65!) you'll not give a hoot if people like you or not and chances are you'll have felt like that for many years!
If you find yourself getting down, give yourself a pep talk to concentrate on your other friends and leave the school mums to their own devices.