What am I doing wrong regarding school mums?

[Schooolm]

I really struggle with this group of mums, I don’t know where I’m going wrong, can I talk about today for example and get some insight on where to improve my interactions?

I recognised a mum in my son’s year group (year 2) it’s a 3 form entry, and said hello to her, we sat on a bench together waiting. Conversation was polite and nice. Another mum I recognised walked near us and I said hello to her too and she was standing so I moved to the edge and said there’s a seat here. We talked for about 20 seconds and then I introduced the other lady to her and they chatted which was fine but then they just talked to each other and didn’t even look in my direction. I tried to interject where I could but they didn’t even make eye contact again. They carried on chatting after 5 minutes I got up and said “have a nice weekend, take care” really friendly not in a horrible way, they looked up said bye and carried on talking! I felt a bit uncomfortable just sitting there on the edge whilst they were chatting away there so that’s why I said bye and moved closer to where kids will line up.

I said hi to the people I was standing next to. I smiled and was friendly to all the new parents. The kids parents from my sons class who is in year 2 now came to the line one by one but not one said hello to me! I am always the person that first says hello so today I thought let’s see what happens. The one I thought was good friends with me as she’s been to my house numerous times and we have met up for coffee without the kids and play dates with the kids she blanked me too! She said hello to the other parents in my class and there were about 8 of them in a circle talking,

Y am I going wrong? Please don’t dismiss my feeling by saying usual moment stuff of “who cares “, “why don’t you make friends outside of the mum groups”. I don’t want to be best buddies with becomes but I do want to not walk away every Friday feeling they hate me and I’ve done something wrong, I only see them Fridays as it’s my job working day, but I don’t think this is the reason we’re not close as there’s a doctor in the group too and she only goes pink up and drop offs like 2 times a month whereas I am there once a week sometimes 2 or 3 if I don’t have meetings.

You're not being excluded.
You're just not being included.

If you have the time, have you ever volunteered with the school? I did this and this helped me meet lots of mums in my child’s class.

Even so, I only really speak to a few people. These are people I’ve known before the school run and people that go to my local gym.

other than those people, I tend to keep my head down. I will say hi, but really I just want to get my kids and get out!

@Schooolm OP, you sound very much like me - a sensitive soul, who soaks up everything in their environment and notices every single interaction. It is often a strength; like you say, you make eye contact and involve everybody in a conversation to try to ensure nobody may feel excluded. But often it causes us to over-analyse and assume there must be something wrong with us when we notice that others won’t (or more accurately can’t) do this for us.

I have spent just over a year doing the school run and have had many interactions just as you have described. It did get me down at first, but I worked on what others have already mentioned - bright and breezy pretending not to care while still being friendly and polite to all. I am now getting a lot more warmth and friendliness back from those who appeared quite indifferent before and have also met a couple of new, lovely parents I just hadn’t really crossed paths with. We’re not best friends or anything, and I’m sure we won’t be in touch come secondary school, but we are friendly with one another, and it now does not feel as much of an ordeal every weekday 😂

I did find hosting my child’s birthday party, then being invited to others in turn, to be a bit of a turnaround point in getting to know some parents better. Being helpful via the WhatsApp group and sharing frustrations at the absurdities of school admin (expected of parents, that is) has also helped to break down some barriers. (Not sure if you’ve got something like that set up?)

Continue to smile, wave hello, ask “how are you?”, start conversation where you can about absolutely anything - school, child, work, weather, the highs and lows of parenthood - to break the ice. Just continue being the lovely person you come across to me on this thread as being! Sometimes it just takes a bit of time to build connections 🙂

I do agree with others who have pointed out that often parents are knackered, particularly at pick up, and have no social battery left (this was actually me today 😂). There are also those that really are drop off/pick up, nothing more, and that is fine - people have busy, stressful lives and may just not enjoy small talk at the school gates.

But I get why you are upset, because your experience was two mums happily talking to one another - who obviously don’t mind the chit chat - and not including you. Some adults naturally gravitate to one another and are not quite as attuned as you are as to when another person is on the sidelines feeling a bit left out of things. I promise it is nothing you are doing wrong and they don’t hate you - they’re just not noticing these things as you do!

Christ not this again. You weren't EXCLUDED they just wanted to talk to eachother instead of you.

There was a thread only yesterday about the total over dramatic I'M BEING EXCLUDED threads when people feel like they have to be"included" in everything. You don't! Stop being so needy!

I have realised over the years - just because i am inclusive, and i do things a certain way it doesnt mean others are or do. Word to the wise focus on you and your child, say hi when you are face to face with others - other than that let it go.

I think if I were sitting in a three I would never not speak to one of the three. It’s rude tbh. It just takes a look or a few words to include that person in the conversation, it’s just being courteous.

OP you can’t control other people but you can choose where you put your energy.

This!
Its also really off putting when someone is really keen and gushy, it smacks of neediness but also poor boundaries

You only pick on Fridays, they aren’t invested in you because they see you so little. It’s not about you. It’s about their need to be included and tou don’t belong to that as you only pick up Friday.

Maybe start some grouo Friday play dates. You might make friends that way.

Were you left out and excluded when you were a child at school?

You are not being excluded, get a life away from school why is thia so hard for people to understand

@PollyBell not a helpful comment. OP has come here for support and empathy. Writing ‘Get a life away from school’ and ‘why is this so hard for people to understand’ smacks of someone with absolutely zero emotional intelligence.

Honestly, I think you're reading way more into this than is there. Two mums who just met and clicked will talk to each other, that's not a snub. And people at the school gate are busy, tired, distracted, wrangling kids. They're not sitting there thinking about you at all

I've always had this OP. I don't know what it is about me that people don't like, but I remember being a bit conscious with mum friends when mine were little that I had a tendency to relate whatever was being discussed to my own experience. Writing that down now, it seems quite a natural way to converse but I could have come across as a bit self-absorbed.

Unfortunately some of us don't have much smalltalk or find everyday stuff that interesting to discuss. Looking back I think that was what made me a bit unrelatable.

My best advice is to make your peace with it, keep old friendships up, have a career and try to get on with colleagues. Nothing wrong with not quite fitting in.

They look like a bonded group but they won't be in reality. There will be 2-3 who are actual real life friends. Everyone else is just passing time diplomatically at pickup. There will be a mix of dynamics - people who are good at chatting to everyone but not proper friends with them, people who dislike each other, people whose children dislike each other. People who met once at baby group and gravitate to each other because they have a familiar face. Don't think of them as a homogeneous mass from which you are excluded. Be casual and friendly. Don't assume they are ignoring you/blanking you because of something wrong with you - assume they are busy, distracted, exhausted, trying to catch up with a friend etc. Trust me, the ones who are actually friends see each other in the real world, not the school gate.

I posted the same thing a few years ago OP and I'll tell you how my journey has gone, son now in yr4.

• I now realise how many parents knew each other before kids started school, after school clubs, knew someone they knew etc. instant bonds that without knowing this background made me feel like why wasn't anyone talking to me. Well, we all talk to those we know! This was nothing to do with me.

• I fucking hate small talk and basically this come across. I found most of the mum's uninteresting and probably projected this

• I have low self esteem, through therapy (for un related issue) I've learnt I was not given the emotional connectedness that I needed as a child, which has given me the lovely gift of needing to be 'chosen' in adulthood as validation of my existence. This is a me problem and not their problem. You sound like you have some similar thoughts.

• mostly, people are fucking knackered and just want to get in and out with their kids, other than the small minority of people who hang out at the gates for their social fix, which they don't get elsewhere. I have my own friends and life away from school

• they are my sons friends and not mine.

• majority I actually have nothing in common with and find uninteresting so why am j bothered about their friendship? Go back to prevent point re low self esteem

• kids move on from friendships very quickly in primary school. It's much easier to navigate this if you are acquainted with the other parents but not necessarily proper friends.

• hosting and going to parties is a good way to break the ice. People have far more time.

• I my self have completely blanked people on the way in and out of school either because a. I can't be fucked with conversation after the stress of getting them too school or post work, I have nothing to say small talk wise, but mainly I just cba so ither parents must and do feel the same, don't take it personally you don't know what type of day people have had.

@SlB09 thank you. It’s one mum in particular when I see her she makes me feel bad about myself. One to one we have met up the most - just this summer for example - we took the boys to cinema in summer holiday, 3 park play dates, met her only for coffee plus she has been to my house numerous times. One on one I believe we are quite good friends BUT every time we are in a group setting she acts like she doesn’t know who I am! She doesn’t say hi unless I say hello first. Yesterday she didn’t even look at me but went to stand next to other mums. It’s confusing.

You sound like you are just reading way too much into everything and seeing a snub where there isnt one!

They were just chatting, they weren't excluding you. If you'd waited you might have found the conversation would have eventually slowed down and you could get back in.

Tbh they might have thought you were introducing them to each other because you didnt feel much like chatting. Or they just might not have thought anything at all!

I think you are really overthinking school run interactions. Often in the playground im away with the fairies, thinking about some work meeting ive got to dash back for or what to have for dinner that night or remembering to speak to the teacher about something.

Chill out about it all, you're reading too much into it

Sometimes they're just not your people and that's that.

Sometimes they're just not your people and that's that.

Sometimes they're just not your people and that's that.

Id call her out,
Id wander over and say ah it was so lovely .... and .... meeting up over the summer, would you like to come round again Saturday? A little loudly infront of the group shes walked to. Don't let people treat you like rubbish, you dont need to be unkind but at least that way Then if she means the blanking intentionally you'll be able to see by her reaction.

When the lady blanked you after meeting up, why do you assume there’s something wrong with you? Op she’s an asshole, that’s on her not you. The more common response to this would be anger at her for being so rude. Frame this as you judging them, not the other way round! You’ll soon realise you don’t want to be included. You don’t need friends in every setting you’re involved in, you actually just need one. Nice to have more but not needed. Build your self esteem up.

This is great advice. You are putting way too much store on and getting too stressed about this. None of it will matter in a few short years and your kids will make friends regardless. Is this intensity at the school gates a realitivly new thing? It seems to come up a lot on here. I am quite old now but is was much more casual in the 90's when I picked kids up from school. Just a quick 'Hi' ans a remark about the weather. The only other mums you would communicate with were the ones whose kids were friends with yours re sleep overs etc.

Not sure they’re so busy if they’re turning up to school early enough to gas for ages before pick up! Honestly, the politics of the school gates is too much. I find SAHM’s the most intense because they don’t have much else going on I guess.

I think the only odd things about the school pick up you described are the woman you've met up with quite a lot blanking you, which is pretty damn rude, and you talking about not gelling with the rest of the mums as being "excluded". It's a school pick up, not a social group. If you don't get on with people you aren't being excluded, you just don't get on with them.

Most likely it's because most of them already know each other and have connections one way or another so aren't particularly open to other relationships, even superficial ones. It may be that there is a local sub-culture that's pretty insular and, well, rude (hence the woman you've met up with blanking you).

Since you get on with people in lots of other situations there is no reason at all to think you're doing anything wrong, you just need to accept that they aren't going to be people you make friends with.