What am I doing wrong regarding school mums?

[Schooolm]

I really struggle with this group of mums, I don’t know where I’m going wrong, can I talk about today for example and get some insight on where to improve my interactions?

I recognised a mum in my son’s year group (year 2) it’s a 3 form entry, and said hello to her, we sat on a bench together waiting. Conversation was polite and nice. Another mum I recognised walked near us and I said hello to her too and she was standing so I moved to the edge and said there’s a seat here. We talked for about 20 seconds and then I introduced the other lady to her and they chatted which was fine but then they just talked to each other and didn’t even look in my direction. I tried to interject where I could but they didn’t even make eye contact again. They carried on chatting after 5 minutes I got up and said “have a nice weekend, take care” really friendly not in a horrible way, they looked up said bye and carried on talking! I felt a bit uncomfortable just sitting there on the edge whilst they were chatting away there so that’s why I said bye and moved closer to where kids will line up.

I said hi to the people I was standing next to. I smiled and was friendly to all the new parents. The kids parents from my sons class who is in year 2 now came to the line one by one but not one said hello to me! I am always the person that first says hello so today I thought let’s see what happens. The one I thought was good friends with me as she’s been to my house numerous times and we have met up for coffee without the kids and play dates with the kids she blanked me too! She said hello to the other parents in my class and there were about 8 of them in a circle talking,

Y am I going wrong? Please don’t dismiss my feeling by saying usual moment stuff of “who cares “, “why don’t you make friends outside of the mum groups”. I don’t want to be best buddies with becomes but I do want to not walk away every Friday feeling they hate me and I’ve done something wrong, I only see them Fridays as it’s my job working day, but I don’t think this is the reason we’re not close as there’s a doctor in the group too and she only goes pink up and drop offs like 2 times a month whereas I am there once a week sometimes 2 or 3 if I don’t have meetings.

I don't think it sounds like you're doing anything wrong at all. I certainly don't think it sounds like you're being intense as someone suggested. I notice a similar thing at our school tbh. My eldest is now in year 6 and I don't feel I've got to know anyone there beyond the level of just exchanging brief pleasantries in all these years. I'm perfectly friendly to people so, like you, I really can't explain it. One thing I would say is that I'm not a massive 'joiner-in' at the school. I do my bit and help out with school trips etc, but I
don't throw myself into school life and volunteer at every event like some do - and perhaps that's where others get to know each other. Could this be the case at your school? If you can face volunteering at things you might get to know people better perhaps. Also inviting your kids' friends over for playdates now and then and inviting their parent to stay for a cup of tea is another way to get chatting? Am stating the obvious a bit I know. The few parents I've got to know better are the mums of my DC's besties - but still, they're quite situational friendships, we haven't necessarily got loads in common!

At our school I know a lot of the parents knew each other beforehand when my kids started because there was a local nursery where a lot of the reception children went (mine didn't) so parents got to know each other there beforehand. Don't know if something similar applies in your case?

I'm sorry this is bothering you and I know how you feel. I don't really have any answers but rest assured I'm sure it's nothing you're doing wrong. If you're pleasant and friendly and they don't make an equal effort then really, sod them. I have puzzled over this too but in my case, I genuinely don't care if the school folk want to talk to me or not.😅 Sure it would be nice to feel I'd made good friends there, but I'm not too worried. I am a full time parent and would be lying if I said I haven't felt lonely and isolated over the years at times. But as it just didn't seem to happen at the school, I make a lot of effort with friends outside of school and have befriended a few neighbours as well, who all seem perfectly happy to meet up for lunch and chat etc. I think part of it is that exchanges at the school gates are quite brief usually; people are tired and rushed etc. I really wouldn't take it personally. Channel your efforts instead into other friendships. You're not doing anything wrong. As I said, sod them!

Edit: Also, having read some of your subsequent comments, I do agree you're overthinking - they do not hate you! One of the best pieces of advice I ever read was this; you don't have to worry what people think of you because usually - they're not thinking about you at all! Everyone is too wrapped up in themselves and their own lives to think much about anyone else and that's the truth of it.

Regarding the bench thing, you were sitting beside a parent chatting to her, then moved up and invited another parent to sit between you both. It’s hard to chat sitting in a row in a bench, unless it’s to the person you’re sitting beside. Maybe you should have moved up towards the person you were sitting beside initially and let the third parent sit on the edge ?

Maybe the friend who joined the line-up inside thought you looked as if you didn’t want to be spoken to her, given that you saw her and didn’t say hello. Maybe this friend thought you were ignoring her.

You are definitely overanalysing. School gates are tricky because you don't have time to "do a round" and talk to every single mum you know. So most mums either chat to the same person or rotate between a few whilst acknowledging others. It's very tricky without coming off as distant to at least a few people.

Thank you. But why can’t they include me in their group? I’m friendly, polite and my son gets along with everyone. I just feel they hate me and I don’t know why

An important thing to remember is that most adult friendships are transactional. The mums that others want in their groups are often ones who are wealthy, well-connected, influential, talented, famous or married to someone with the same qualities. In smaller communities, it can be someone who's simply known locally for something, owns a restaurant, salon, shop or whatever. It could also be as banal as someone who loves hosting and has the home where all kids like to meet up.

They don't actively hate you but you're probably not offering anything which they're interested in. It sounds harsh but most adults are so busy with their lives that they can't "slot in" another friend on the sole basis of niceness. Most adults seek others who can make their lives easier or elevate their status in some way. It's also not that hard to find ways of giving back in ways that other people may appreciate. Eg I know one mum who's a good hobby photographer so she photographs parties or school events and then sends some nice shots to the parents. Another one has a party planning business and voluntarily makes special backdrops for school events. Becoming accepted into a community often requires some level of time and material investment.

This was me when my first child started school. You just have to keep trying. You will find a tribe.

And if not you don't need a school gate mum tribe.

You could try saying to yourself whenever you see another of the Mums: 'I'm expressing my sociable nature by saying hello to people, and that's enough because I'm being true to myself'. Things need to be peaceful inside your own head rather than anxious and needy, then people will feel more relaxed with you and more likely to be friendly. Seriously. Please try it.

Cheer yourself up by watching
Motherland - the school gates can be insane, that's why there's a comedy about it. The second you genuinely give up with them, they'll want to be friendly.

They don't include you because either they don't want to or you're just not on their radar. 🤷🏼‍♀️
I don't have many people talking to me at the school gates because I'm socially awkward, intense and am prone to oversharing (I'm AuDHD, which explains part of it).

Sure, it can feel hurtful/awkward when no-one talks to you, but you've got to stop caring so much.

The school gate hover became far better for me when I stopped trying and just accepted things for how they are.

@JudyTeeny thank you so much, such lovely advice x

@HotToast thank you so much for your lovely advice too! Thank you for understanding x

I never want to chat to anyone - I’m either on my way to work or knackered from work. I try to hide/actively avoid being spotted 🤣 But I’m not rude and will say hello if people say hello to me/chat to me. I have a full on busy job and socialise with my own friends and I get socialision fatigue. Maybe some of the parents are like that. Some will be ND. Some will be shy. Some will be stressed or depressed. Some will have terrible stuff going on in their lives. Some will have social anxiety. Some will have known each other for years for other reasons. It’s not all about you OP 😅

🤣🤣🤣 “A school mum tribe” WTF is that?!

This 100% .
I have dcs ranging adults to infants. I've never got into the school mum drama. I spoke to 3 with the eldest and were still friends now. None really with the middle ones. Then 3 with youngest.
I arrive 1 min before door opens for collection. Then drop off is a 10 min window. Doors open 8.40 until 8 50. I arrive around 8.47. As by then majority of people are gone.
I really can't be bothered with small talk , same with WhatsApp messages ' what day are they back to school ' ' can they wear black instead of grey ' etc. Just check the emails ! Then 10 people reply the same thing.
Maybe it's because I'm mid 40s and i just don't need ' school mum friends '
Don't get me wrong if I pass people we say hi and that's it.

You need to relax. These are just 5 minute chats and you’re reading waaay too much into them and sound quite paranoid/needy. It may be a viscous cycle as you may then be giving off waves of anxiety and desperation which never helps.

Just go with the flow, be welcoming to everyone, think of interesting topics to bring up and talk about, be jokey and funny and mainly just relax. It takes time to build friendships.

Completely agree with this, OP! Basic manners.
The other mums are just different and sometimes we all read too much into things but sensitive & well educated souls like us do go through moments like that in life x

I’m not talking about people have to talk to me! I’m talking about being EXCLUDED from the little groups.

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I sound like I'm on commission but once I started doing it mums who had always blanked me suddenly wanted to be my friend and messaged me for advice. I was polite but kept them at arms length because they weren't the right people for me to trust and make quality friendships out of. But it made the playground small talk more enjoyable. Try it. What have you got to lose?

I agree with this. I talk to the mums I know well and outside of that I can't even say I notice anyone else.

But your use of EXCLUDED is a little insane. They're not excluding you, they are having a conversation with other people. They don't have to talk to you but it also doesn't mean they don't like you or you are being shunned. I second a PP, you are very intense and overthinking this massively.

Someone said you’re intense. Not in my book, you’re just being friendly and polite. I don’t have any advice unfortunately because I had to deal with similar when my kids were at school (now adults). I lived in the US for a while where it was normal to be friendly and I took a long time to get re-used to how it is here. People are just weird, one day they speak, the next they don’t. Hard to figure out. When my youngest was old enough to find her way out of the playground I would wait outside the gates with the dog and this had the effect of having fellow dog walkers coming up to me for a chat plus parents with their children who wanted to say hello to the dog. It felt much more relaxed. Keep being you and hopefully you will find regular people who will want to chat each day.

I'm the same. I'd love to be friendly and able to chat but I just freeze and the school playground is the place where it happens the most. My eldest is nearly 18, youngest still in primary school so around 13 years of doing it and I've made zero mum friends in that time.

OP I've encountered this in similar settings on occasion and I'm a very sociable person with plenty of friends, get on well with my colleagues and many other mums. I honestly just put it down to rudeness/self importance/cliqueyness on the part of the mums that made me feel that way and I'd not want to be friends with them in any case! You sound lovely to me!

Agree with this
Its very off putting when people are anxious and needy
You say you are friendly and say hello to everyone
It can be a bit off putting if you come on too strong with a please like me vibe to everyone

You need to ask yourself why you're so bothered by this. Seriously. My dc are grown up now. I'm still friends with some of the mums from one of my dc's year group. My other dc year group were not my bag. Nice enough, and we'd chat at pick up and drop off, but I had no wish to be in their group. Stop caring so much! These people are of no importance to you.

@Schooolm Hi OP! Ha you sound exactly like me. I think I know where you are coming from. I too pick up my DC from school (3 form entry too funnily enough) and the whole year group are particularly unfriendly - and I’m not the only one who thinks it. I think we have been unlucky in our year as other years in school get on very well. I am super confident, and like you dont want to be best buddies with them BUT do want polite interactions and to get on. The way I see it some people are just not like you and me… they like to crack on or stick with people they ‘have always known’ the safe option. It’s a lot to do with people’s confidence I have realised and their social awareness. I’ve found that people who went to the nursery part of school dont like to get involved with anyone who joined in say reception or year 1 because well, that’s too much effort. Take your time, still make the effort…find the nice decent ones… I am doing this…. but don’t bother with the frosty lot and waste your kind energy… that’s my plan anyway. Don’t let the miserable ones get you down. Maybe organise a social and show them how inclusive you are. You definitely sound it! Good luck! xxx