Reform want to cut PIP

[Daygloboo]

Reform want to cut benefits for disabled people. They want businesses to pay more towards sickness etc. I find it repulsive that they want to do this. When will people understand that they are a bunch of self interested sharks who want to make a stack of dosh for themselves while in govt and that they font give a damn about anyone in need. Why cant the most vulnerable ppl who vote for them see thus. It's astonishing. It's ac joke. I eish ppl who get what Reform.iscreally about and how it manipulates would make sn extra effort to tslk to.ppl who dont seem to get it.

they can't just scrap it without replacing it with an alternative. many use PIP to pay towards care. I guess if they sort social care out and make the care free, then that could allow them to reduce payments for some.
As someone upthread said it's odd how PIP is meant to be for the extra costs of a disability yet many can have zero extra cost and still claim significant amounts.

I have to say that I'm pleased MNHQ are on the ball today on this thread with deletions. That comment to you was really pathetic and nasty and deserved to be deleted. Meanwhile, Nigel's £5m problem isn't going away ...

"you have a car so you can access the community"

This is what a disabled pensioner friend of mine was told when he was visited by Adult Social Care He was asking about the possibility of storage for a mobility scooter and to have his shower turned into a walk in one. "we havent got the money" he was told
He did point out that Dunelm Tesco etc might take a dim view of him driving his car through their windows and down the aisles.

Essex County Council now run by Reform "we need to look after our own"

Because the tax threshold hasn't increased for years but minimum wage increases mean more people end up paying tax.

Wrong. As I said, the only diagnosis they have is anxiety. They have difficulties with money, cooking and bathing because of their anxiety. Cooking - they are anxious about things such as using the hob, using a knife, touching food, knowing when food is off, knowing when food is cooked… Money - they are anxious about spending money, about knowing how much to spend and what needs to be earmarked for other things, about being scammed, about getting the right change, about using a card or ATM… Bathing - they need prompting their anxiety means they need prompting to move along with the task rather than get stuck.

@placemats
Not strictly true. PIP continues after state pension age if a claimant has claimed before state pension age. If it isn't an indefinite award then they will have to complete a review just as those under SPA do. Attendance Allowance is only for people over SPA who haven’t previously claimed a health related benefit, or those who haven’t for a period of time.

I think you’ve hit the nail on the head. Most people think of social care as elderly care, but unless they’ve engaged with it themselves or on behalf of a disabled friend or relative they generally don’t think about the disability support it covers. Or about how much the combination of PIP and carers allowance saves the tax payer - in my experience of MN most of the discussion around CA revolves around tightening up of eligibility and regular (and expensive) checks to ensure carers are doing their full hours - 35 hours a week for the princely sum of £86 a week. That’s less than £3 a week folks, but let’s make sure the tax payer gets their money’s worth from people who are very often horribly overworked and under supported.

And these threads always end up slagging off Motability. Strangely, it always seems to be those who demonstrably know the least about the scheme who have the most to say !!

We know that a government can't scrap disability support benefits without giving an alternative. Reform would like us to think that such a thing is eminently possible and they achieve that by telling their voters that there are a lot of fraudulent claimants, that disabled people are almost always capable of and always better off in work because that is how you demonstrate your authenticity as a disabled person - by striving to overcome your disability. I have little patience for those who are willing too believe all that.

As for the last part of your post, well, it's not really for you to say is it?

This study was done over 50 years ago, and a LOT has changed since then Much more is known aabout psychiatric illnesses now. For example, the physiological aspects of schizophrenia were only just beginning to be discovered at that time. Moreover, the study was about people being placed in mental hospitals, and the criteria for such placements have changed TOTALLY since then. Then, it was rather too easy to assign people to mental hospitals, and too often some social nonconformity was sufficient. Nowadays, there are often insufficient places even for acutely ill people who may pose a danger to themselves and/or to others.

And people are not diagnosed with depression or anxiety disorders just on the basis of filling in questionnaires, though such questionnaires may play a part. But they need a comprehensive medical examination to be diagnosed. Diagnostic manuals include a list of criteria that must be met. Yes, some people could fake them, but people can also put a thermometer in hot water to fake a fever.

Free care isn’t free though, in fact it’s considerably more expensive to pay carers than it is to support family members through the benefits system. Swapping a benefits bill of £40 billion for a social care bill of £184 billion is absolute lunacy.

I wonder if we're likely to see a problem arising in the new and used car markets in the next few years? Myths and false beliefs around motability have led to such stringent restrictions within the scheme that it's no longer viable for many, which will have a knock on effect on both demand for brand new cars and the supply of decent three year old used cars.

I'm not splitting hairs here, honest, @Onbdy, just trying to fully understand the rules. By 'indefinite award' do you mean 'ongoing award', which I've seen in a recent PIP letter?

Spot on. And in addition, those PIP claimants who continue to claim after SPA can’t be awarded an element of the benefit for the first time after reaching SPA. So for example, if you weren’t getting mobility component before reaching SPA you can’t be awarded it after that point.

Yes, indefinite, open ended and ongoing all mean the same thing. In practice it usually means ten years, after which there is a light touch review with minimal paperwork for the claimant. These awards are generally only made when it’s clear that the claimant’s condition is permanent and unlikely to change for the better, but there are still checks.

Because not all PIP is extensible and claimable in the effect.

Many of us are still supporting disabled children who have become adults.

We’ve taken a hit with our careers which has saved linemen H and S care. We continue to work less hours or poorly paid jobs due to that and saving the tax payer. We continue to save the tax payer through that work pattern.

Therefore one of the extra costs of PIP is income. So where you have someone who needs someone to support with cooking or support with bathing and therefore works 6 instead of 8 hours a day. How’s that claimable and extensible?

Unless the person doing that caring because it’s been agreed through a PIP assessment that need exists claims the care at NMW. The government pay their tax and NI and also a pension contribution towards a private pension?

I would would go for that. I’d have much more money coming in being able to claim for the hours to provide that care and also claim back the costs of equipment that can cost between £100-300 a time. Considering the rate of enhanced PIP is £778 every 4 weeks. In fact just the expenses for my time for agreed need would be £22k a year before tax (£1886 a month)

Bless your sweet innocent heart.

Absolutely. PIP isn't mean tested so you could be on £200,000 plus a year and still get it. It's mainly an on-line form so much easier to lie than in person. You should not get PIP for mild anxiety and depression - only for severe mental health conditions. This government is totally naive to think a small number of people are abusing the system. Everyone I know knows at least one person scamming the system. I work in mental health so see it first hand.

Open policies are only available to those who need multiple rotating paid carers. Most people are restricted to named driver policies.

Don't be so sure!

Thank you.

So perhaps Reform plan to use the 'Ongoing' category to sift claimants, and decide who gets put in their new 'very disabled indeed, by jove' benefit category? And everyone else gets to take their chances with a near-bankrupt council? Triffic.

Meanwhile Reform have to set up a new assessment, review and appeal system that costs more than PIP? It'll keep the courts & tribunals even more overwhelmed on their toes, I suppose.

This is disgustingly short sighted, what will happen to the vast majority of people that rely upon medical equipment, carers and other resources which the PIP helps cover?

Saw a guy getting on the bus not long ago, dropped his walking stick and bent down to get it quicker than I could, then trotted up the bus waving it and saying to me and anyone else within earshot, "Can"t lose my Pip Stick! "He seemed proud to be attached to the free money teat as if he had achieved something, the sooner loads of weed smoking chancers are ripped off this teat and made to work the better.

They will still get help.

Absolutely spot on, @itsgettingweird ❤

Well that's wrong.