To think Dsis is overeacting after SS hit niece?

[PapaSteel]

I've been with my partner for 8 years and we have dc together, he has a son from his previous relationship. He's 15 and not his bio son but he's been in his life since he was young and he sees him as his dad

Alot happened when we got together as his ex would tell SS that DP didn't want to see him anymore now he was dating me which wasn't true at all. She was physically & verbally abusive towards him and he's been living with us since he was 13 (after he told school about howHe has a lot of trauma and anger which school are supportive about and outside of school he gets help on how to manage the anger and he is a lot better than he was but the anger is still there so we are just patient with him

We're currently on holiday with my sister and her 2 dc and have been here since Monday. There was issues almost straight away as ss got angry at the claw machine but he and dp left the arcade and went for a walk to calm down as the arcade was busy so there was no way he'd have been able to calm down whilst in the arcade. My sister described him as a tantrumming toddler who didn't get his own way and said partner wasn't doing him any favours. I ignored her

He loves drawing and usually if you ask he will show what he's drawing but earlier he was at the table drawing and my niece (10) kept asking what he was drawing. He told her but she kept saying “show me show me” despite him saying no, she pulled his sketch book away from him which caused him to shout at her and she “accidentally” spilt her water on it. He was clearly very angry/upset and walked off to go to his room and she followed him and called him a baby, asked if he was going to cry etc, and he turned round and hit her and now he's being made out to be the bad guy

During this my sister was out with her other dc, my dp was in the shower and I was telling her multiple times to leave him alone and do something else even when she was repeatedly telling him to show her his drawing and she ignored me

My sister is now back and furious, she said she doesn't want her children to share a space with a “violent man”, and has even mentioned going to the police and social services on us if we're happy to have him around our children as he's not related to us when asked where he should go she just replied care

AIBU to think she's overreacting? I know SS shouldn't have hit her and he knows this too but she hasn't apologised for her part in deliberatly winding him up and sister says she doesn't need to as she's a child and he's nearly an adult

Equally in the wrong? Do you hear yourself? Do you justify domestic abuse saying the woman probably wound the man up?!

It’s not working.

You can't be serious? Your SS was out of order, being a little shit. Your DN is 10. 100% your DSIS is not overreacting. You are not acting appropriately, at all. It's like blaming a child when a dog bites. No.

There is no way in hell any of my daughters would be apologising for provoking someone (an older bigger male) into hitting them. No way would I be in any way letting them think that anything they did made it ok for a male to hit them.
This thread is wild.

So his fixation is justified but your 10 year old niece deserves to be hit for hers?!

Of course he was in the wrong and his violent reaction needs addressed

she was also in the wrong for her behaviour which amounts to criminal damage if she were an adult. All 10 year olds know not to damage property of others

you were in the wrong for allowing it to escalate. The girl should have been admonished for her taunting and removed

you sis is entirely in the wrong for threatening you with SS. how dare she think she gets to dictate this boy has to leave your lives and for him to be separated from the only father he knows. Out of all above her behaviour is unforgivable

Nobody is trying to to justify it

the point is she was provoking someone irrespective of how it ended she needs to be told off for that

Hindsight is wonderful - I think I would have been verbally firm with the niece rather than a more standard polite, maybe speaking to her like a much younger child. I'd have started a conversation about men's mental health and how crying is a perfectly appropriate way to express feelings if I'd heard her try to make fun of a boy for crying.

10 year olds are annoying. A fifteen year old hitting a 10 year old is deeply worrying. If you don't get this under control, the next time he escalates to physical violence, he'll probably get arrested. Despite his adverse childhood experiences.

Your niece sounds like little shit. Equally Your ss has anger issues and you shouldn't be down playing him hitting her.

If only the NHS knew of the countless experts on mumsnet that were available for diagnosing neurodiversities. They could clear the waiting lists for assessment in no time!

Reasons and excuses are not the same thing!
I absolutely agree that the 15 year old needs intervention and help in order to prevent him from ending up as someone who hits when frustrated. And OP and her dh are trying to ensure that happens. But I do think there has to be some understanding that this is a process and not write him off just yet. His background will have affected him and he's got to unlearn all of that. He's not just some 'normal' kid who doesn't give a shit - there are things going on in his brain that are affecting him all the time.

At the same time nieces behaviour needs to be addressed. It's possible to say that the son shouldn't have hit her and that she behaved really badly and her refusal to let him walk away has led to him lashing out. She does need to learn that she cannot go through life wrecking other peoples property, ignoring instructions and taunting people because those actions have consequences. The adults in her life are failing her if they only focus on what the son did wrong and ignore her own part in it because she came out worse.

An adult needed to step in and end the situation and certainly keep the 10yo away from the 15yo as her provocation sounds extreme (and she is responsible for destroying his property and taunting him which suggests she is herself either lacking in skills or being taught very wrong at home).

Both are children; both are old enough to have criminal responsibility in the UK FWIW.

As there can't be adequate supervision, this holiday is a terrible idea that needs to end prematurely.

The girl's mothers comments are inexcusable and she is not doing her daughter any favours in the long run if she doesn't address her behaviour.

Your stepson needs intensive support and this holiday is not in his interests.

I am sorry there are so many pressures and difficulties but you can't suit everyone here or do the right thing -- I would focus on the children you can help and stop fostering the broader unsafe family relationships.

He is obviously not a small child but he isnt "nearly an adult".

Probably not. Hence why the risk to himself is probably also increased. But you can’t really mitigate for that.

What is the actual point in spending years teaching kids to say ‘no I don’t like that’ if we aren’t also teaching them that no or stop does actually mean stop. Not stop if you are a boy Carry on if you are a girl or younger than the person you are winding up beyond the point where everyone is finding it a game.

I suspect if the sexes were reversed here fewer people would think all the blame lies with the one child.

She wasn't just being annoying

So why did you not intervene on your SS's behalf? Feeding a baby is not really an excuse to let all that play out, her pestering him, him shouting at her, her following him, her name calling, him hitting her .. you were the responsible adult and you did absolutely nothing.

It's almost like you did nothing because you knew SS would meter out his own justice and you would then feel justified in blaming her for the outcome.

I have experienced it being hit. I've also experienced emotional abuse. The emotional was much worse and many victims say the same.
I didn't say hitting isn't a crime, I said the opposite to that.
Odd that you say people can't think critically and then when I point out you're not thinking critically because you can't see beyond the law you reference the law and tell me I'm overthinking it.

Wow!

Why wow?

That's a stretch and not what I meant, but whatever.

There is no excuse, ever, for male on female violence.

It's like the judges who let men off for rape because she was 'asking for it' for being drunk and wearing revealing clothing.

she needs to be told off for that.

She should have been told off at the time, by OP, as soon as she ignored her requests to stop pestering. It takes two people to escalate a confrontation which is what happened here, it didn't magically leap to her spilling water and him hitting her.. it was an escalation that should not have been allowed to happen in the first place.

Nope it’s arsehole behaviour as I said.

What about when the sexes are reversed?

Your niece is a brat. She was tormenting him and not understanding people’s boundaries and that no means no.

I think most kids would’ve lashed out at her tbh.

your SS is only human, there’s only so much someone can take before enough is enough.

it does sound like he has anger issues as he reacted badly to an arcade machine but he did remove himself from the situation with your niece. She followed him and gave him no escape when he was removing himself from the situation so I’m not surprised he lashed out, as I said further up most kids would’ve done the same.

i would just explain to my sister that he’s apologised, she’s not hurt, she’s learnt nothing and that’s the end of it.

i would refuse to engage in this anymore

the closest I have to that would be my 12 year old daughter hitting the 8 year old son of my friend, who we holiday with.
if he was on the wind up and she hit him, ALL of my focus would be on her hitting him, I certainly wouldn’t be demanding apologies from him.

HTH