Am I being horrible or do I need to say no?

[onemoredress]

DS is 26 and autistic/adhd and lives a few streets away in a shared house, he lived with us until 2 years ago but we asked him to move out as he was straining our marriage, constant mess in the kitchen was causing arguments and he was with us 24/7 as he never went out other than to work, no gf and very few friends.

Since moving out he would turn up most nights unexpectedly and let himself in and sit with us until bedtime, this caused more arguments between me and his dad as he felt uncomfortable he would walk in any time he wanted so I kindly explained that it would be nice if he could let us know when he was coming so we were expecting him.

Now he calls on his way home from work and says would you like me to come and see you?
Of course I say yes, every time even if I would rather spend a quiet night with Dh but I don’t like to say no.

I admit I do feel it’s a bit of an intrusion to have him around so many nights a week but I don’t like to say no, Dh says I need to say no, he’s happy to say no, but if we have ever said no I feel really guilty and ds gets quite huffy so I like to keep the peace and don’t want him not to feel welcome.
We both agree it would be lovely to see him a couple of times a week for a couple of hours instead of him coming in most nights and then not leaving until we go to bed, he doesn’t understand social hints and has rejection sensitivity so if we tell him directly he gets offended.

I feel like whatever I do I will upset someone. It’s not that his dad doesn’t want to see him, he just doesn’t want him here all the time and when he comes home some nights and it’s still sunny outside so he buys some drinks for the garden and expects to chill out with just me and then ds calls and says he is on his way and he feels his evening plans go out the window because ds doesn’t drink and I don’t like to drink with him there so leave it for another time.

Is Dh right and I should say no so we can have some evenings just ourselves or is that cruel and unreasonable and he should be able to come over when ever he wants?

He has autism. Was it really necessary to say "mummy and daddy" this implying some childish attachment?

I’d suggest a routine to him say mon weds fri he comes round after work and Sunday once a month th for tea or similar. He might like the plan and feel comfortable knowing what will happen

You kicked him out of your house to get privacy and now you're worried it's rude to ask him not to come round every night. Not sure this makes sense. Just explain nicely that you want him to make friends and pursue his own social life. And/or tell him that you want privacy with your other half. Explain it's normal for children to leave the nest and not call round more than once a week.

Also, just say no when he asks if he should come. But if you don't reassure him that it's not personal, that will be why he's taking it personally.

I agree that it may be a good idea to try to help him find groups/activities, if they haven’t already done this.

Also with the idea of having specific nights that he comes over.

It sounds hard. I would struggle to say no to my son as well.

'Am I being horrible or do I need to say no?'
You are not being horrible and you do need to say no.
But it sounds as though you are incapable of saying no. Have you asked yourself why you can't say no? Your DS getting huffy isn't the end of the world. His not liking to drink so you forego a drink with your husband - why? Are you afraid your son won't cope? He coped with moving out. He'll need to adjust a bit to reduced hours at yours. With help from you and your husband, he'll broaden his horizons. Visit him and play a board game, maybe with one of his flatmates. You and husband take it in turns once a week. Go to the pub with him once a week for an hour. Mix it up so you're all out of the rut and help DS to gradually become more self-reliant.

Unless you decide to change things, there's really no point asking for advice, sorry. If your husband can say no, then pass the phone to him or let him answer it. You've received masses of really good advice, OP. The question is, will you act on it?

Set a couple of nights aside that you’re busy. Otherwise enjoy that your DS wants to be with you and feels comfortable in his old home.

My DC is autistic and I’m not anticipating independent living in years to come unless it’s very well managed. I think you should focus on whether the set up he has is working for his needs, rather than focusing on your alone time. It sounds like the house share is not a good fit, if he doesn’t want to be there.

In the best interests of your DS he needs to be better educated in social graces.
Yes, you do need to discuss.
Commend DS for phoning each time but explain that the reason one phones is to be prepared for a NO or a YES.. Tell him you are going to help him react politely to a NO sometimes.

Say NO twice a week.
Also phone him once a week and visit him. Remind him that he can say NO to you visiting him and ensure he sometimes does that.
Slow steps.
Show him how to walk in the park, sometimes with others sometimes alone.
Would your son be a good dog owner?

Autistic adults, in particular male, need many more years at home than NT people. 26 is young for an autistic male to have moved out imo. He clearly isn’t ready. How big is your house? I would have him back and focus on getting him some space in the house where he can enjoy himself and not be in your hair so much. He is lost and he needs you. That is frustrating when comparing to peers, but it’s just how it is.

What makes you think gender comes into the age and adult can live independently? That doesn't seem right to me.

My BIL isn't autistic but he had a crisis a few years ago and lived at home. It was stressful for my in-laws to have him back home, disagreements with him etc.

Now he's in his own house but comes over once a week for lunch and goes shopping with my MIL one or two times a week.

A shared house of working adults is nothing like a student house. They dont as a rule really make friends and socialise together. They are pretty grim soulless places to live.
He is undoubtedly lonely. Its a very sad situation where you don't feel you can relax around your own son and that he isnt welcome in his childhood home.

I agree with you as a professional and as someone with lived experience. I'd tell any professional who told me I was doing my child a disservice by allowing them to be home to go away and get a clue. The problem isn't that they are living at home, it's the lack of simultaneously planning for their future in the context of their dependency. It can be done. It's a problem if parents stick their heads in the sand and don't plan. Unfortunately, this isn't that uncommon as it's not easy to think about.

What a ridiculous attitude! Do you think you (and OP and her DH) are going to live forever, never get seriously ill and require care? What happens then to the SEN child who has forged no life for themselves outside of their parents' home? If you wish to be a martyr then that is your prerogative, but you won't be doing your child any favours.

This, I’d be going to a pub with a beer garden with dh regularly, or a movie.

You’ve got to support him to get a hobby. Start by you and dh going out regularly then say you’d like that for him too and look into hobbies he can go to. Currently you’re just modelling sitting around at home every evening. Also why don’t you drink in front of him? I can see why your dh is annoyed by that!

Fucking hell, I mean aren’t most working adults tired from work during the week? I know I am! But this is your son, not some random acquaintance.

Poor lad, I can’t imagine my parents being unhappy with me spending time with them 😔

I think you need to message him that dad gets tired after work so he can come no more than twice a week for an hour. As long as you make him feel welcome that should be fine.

As your son is ND I would set a timetable as this would be easier for him to process and have less anxiety about evenings.

You can sit him down, explain that you love him and will always support him. However you want him to come round and visit on Tuesdays / Thursdays/ Saturdays for normal days. Birthdays aren’t included and will be on a ad hoc basis depending on the day they fall.

Then everyone’s aware of what’s happening when, it’s limiting his visits and being fair to everyone.

If he asks why you can say that you want some date nights with DH and you are looking at starting a club

DD with AUDHD here. Sorry but you are pandering to your DH at the detriment to your DS. DS needs a bit more guidance to try and get a new routine going, a book club, swimming, gym or whatever and dinner at yours twice a week then meet you down the pub for a drink at the weekend. Just chucking him into a shared house and expecting him to launch his life is stupid.

I don’t think you need to feel any guilt OP, I’m sure you’ve spent a lifetime looking after him and his needs . He needs to function as an adult now and that includes being used to doing things independently with or without friends . I would invite him for two set evenings a week , tea and catchup , and make very clear those evenings will be set aside especially for him .

This seems to be the modern way. I house shared in the 1980s with people who were initially strangers but who became friends (I still see one from time to time). We had communal rooms, watched television together and often socialised together.

When my daughter moved to London after graduating, she initially rented a flat with friends but over time they others either moved away or moved in with partners and she ended up in a series of HMOs. Her experience was completely different from mine. In most cases the only communal room was the kitchen. People took their food back to their rooms to eat and watched whatever they wanted on their own devices. She found it very lonely and I assume your son is the same.

He has autism. It changes things. He’s obviously very lonely and finding it hard being on his own. Sometime ‘mummy and daddy’ is what he needs. My son has autism and he would never cope alone so I expect him to live with us forever. Don’t be a dick

Are you making enough effort with him? It’s clear he values your time together. Could you respond with things like - I can’t tonight but do you want to come for tea on Thursday? Alternatively throw in going for an evening walk and a talk. It’s become his routine coming over and you probably need to disrupt it. But if he’s always the one to suggest things you’re going to struggle to change it. Could you also have a specific day where he comes over for tea? Maybe you go for a walk together or something first whilst DH cooks?

If you only say no infrequently, he will have a bigger reaction on the occasions you do.
However I think if you start doing it more often he will get more used to it.
I agree with the previous posters that him being at your house all the time is meaning he doesn't/can't find his own new ways of filling his time.
Does he have a special interest? Maybe he could do something related to that. I had some training about autism recently and the autistic person running it said they go to this meet-up for autistic people.

Lots of good suggestions here for putting him off for a night or setting up a schedule. I’d second helping him find a hobby or alternative activity, could he join a gym ? Do you have a Cineworld near you ? They do an Unlimited membership for example or a local sports team to watch eg football?