To do 9 hour round trip or tell ds to stick it out?

[briefinnopo]

I have 2 DS’s, ages 14 and 15 and about 18mths/2 years ago he got a new job and moved to Scotland
The boys have completely different personalities, youngest is very into marvel and comics and is quiter. Eldest is loud and into football (ds2 also is but only the team he supports he doesn't care about other teams or playing it) eldest is also a nightmare behaviour wise right now

They don't see their dad much. Initially he would come here to visit but now he says they must visit him as there old enough and capable. They did a few weekends but it was a bit pointless due to the distance and youngest is a ball boy for the football team he supports which is a commitment obvioushe couldn't constantly miss it

They went on Saturday until the 10th of August and there was issues at the beginning as youngest needed the toilet at the train station and ds1 walked off and he panicked - we live on the outskirts of Manchester and this was at Manchester Piccadilly on a Saturday so was very busyt which ds1 found it hilarious

Ds2 has told me their dad took them to a football match on Sunday and then a different team Tuesday and he took them to nandos but they haven't done much else and he asked if they can see the new spiderman film and his dad told him no because he or ds1 go and they argued and ex told him to go on his own and when he said he would he got shouted at again and told he's not going anywhere. He's also been told off for playing his music apparently

Obviously this is only ds2’s words on a text message and I'm not there but he's saying he wants to come home. Problem is he would struggle with the train journey on his own yes he's 14 and not ND but he's never done it on his own and he is immature. It's also a 4.5 hour car journey traffic permitting (it says this right now) so 9 hour round trip. Maybe more maybe less but I don't know

Would you tell him to stick it out or go and pick him up?

Must be hard if they don't see their df much to be stuck there till the 10th of August. I'd suggest he sticks it out but if he's still miserable surely his df will stick him on the train and you meet him off it?
Your ex sounds awful, he moved he should be doing the trek to visit. Doesnt he have family he could stay with locally if theres a next time?

Well I don't know your ex and whether you are able to talk with him in a civil way about contact arrangements. But what needs to be communicated is:

• Ds2 is having a miserable time and currently wants to come home early
• it would be best for him to start having a nice time and change his mind, rather than coming home early
• if he continues having a miserable time, he is old enough for his views to be respected if he chooses not to come again, so Ex has only a few days to start putting some effort into treating his sons equally

He needs to stick it out he can’t come running home every time there’s an issue and I’m amazed a 14 year old in this day and age can’t/wont figure out the trains to get home.

It doesn't sound like the best time for him, but also not dangerous or harmful. So I would probably tell him to stick it out and find a way to enjoy himself. But it really depends on how confident I was in that "not dangerous or harmful" assessment and on everything else going on in his life. For instance, whether he's at risk of feeling left out in every aspect of life, or if it's just his dad and brother he's rejected by. I wouldn't go tonight, and try and drive straight back though. That does sound dangerous!

I can't have a conversation with ex about it as he's always of the opinion that ds has to “man up” and stop being so sensitive etc. And hell likely blame me for putting ideas into his head which I haven't done

He makes no effort with them which is a reason we split in the first place but it's even less now he's moved to Scotland. He's not working as he's a teacher

He said no to the cinema because neither he or ds1 have an interest in spiderman but ds2 doesn't have an interest in any of the football team's he's seen play but he's put up with it and hasn't done anything for him in nearly a week. He wouldnt put him on a train or take him to the station. He didn't even meet them from the station on Saturday they had to get the bus with all their stuff

he asked if they can see the new spiderman film and his dad told him no because he or ds1 go and they argued and ex told him to go on his own and when he said he would he got shouted at again and told he's not going anywhere.

What does ‘ he or ds1 go’ mean? Ex asked them to both go together and they argued and then ex asked ds2 to go on his own and then changed his mind again and said he is not going anywhere?

In any case, your ex is not very nice. He is not very thoughtful of his sons and is lazy. He dont come visit them and now is not flexible enough to do something your son wants and has made a small request into an argument and opportunity to shout.

You should pick your sons. What are they supposed to do for next 12 days till 10th Aug there with no friends, their normal routine, with a moody father? I also think a 14 year should be able to take a train from Scotland to Manchester without panicking much. Does he have a mobile phone? Maybe you need to help him increase his confidence once this issue is sorted.

Please pick him up. It’s not a nice environment for your son to waste his precious holidays. Go this weekend and collect both your sons or atleast ds2, and going forward don’t facilitate your sons’ visit to their father. If father wants to see them, he has to make an effort.

Stick out for 2 weeks in that environment? I don’t think it’s fair.

I agree with your point about trains but he should not be penalised now for his parents not help him build his confidence. Op can help him with this later but I really think he should come back home. It’s still almost 2 weeks till 10 aug. He can’t even listen to music at his father’s home. No point staying with a dominator for another 2 weeks.

I'd suggest he gives it over the weekend and sees if things improve.

If not, can you arrange for a taxi/uber to take him from Dads to the station? Then as a PP suggested, if there's a change and he's not confident meet him halfway coming back.

It might actually do him good to have a bit of an achievable challenge.

I meant he said no because his dad or ds1 don't want to go. It's only ds2 that does and he told him to go on his own if he's that bothered and when he said he would his dad shouted at him and said he's not going anywhere and he can go to the cinema all he wants when he's home. He isn't familiar with Scotland but I don't think thats why he said no as he was happy for them both to go to his from the train station

He does have a phone and I think would be capable of getting a train and sitting there on his own its just the station where he panics esp big ones (Edinburgh waverly and Manchester Piccadilly) he also rarely goes out on his own even here so he's not used to it

I’d just drive up and get him if necessary stop overnight somewhere with him and drive back the next day if you don’t feel up to doing both ways at once . I’d let your ex know in advance though and check that the older one is ok to get home on his own if he wants to stay . Your kids are old enough to choose who they want to see .

No! It's dad's time and he can deal with them. This sounds like typical holiday moaning and getting used to a new situation. Unless you think the dad is not trustworthy they need to suck it up.

OP doesn't have to save DS2 every time he's in a not great situation. Generally, it's good for kids to realise they can get through something unpleasant without it being a disaster. But I caveated my answer because sometimes it's too much and becomes damaging.

Edinburgh Waverley isn’t that big a station at all, it’s very easy to navigate.

I think you should go get him. It's not teaching him resilience or anything of value just that you are happy to leave him in the company of a man who doesn't seem to like him much. It's not normal holiday moaning he's literally not doing anything that interests him and is being shouted at too. I wouldn't stay in that situation so he shouldn't either.

He's supposed to be on holiday with his dad. It shouldn't be unpleasant. I agree it could be damaging to leave him there and affect his relationship with his mum if she just leaves him there.

They’ve gone for a visit to their dad’s so I’m not sure I’d intervene just yet. You said they don’t see much of their dad and to be honest, he sounds quite useless, so maybe if DS sticks it out, he’ll see his dad for who he is and won’t want to visit after this one.

It's only going to be damaging to him if the rest of his life is a battle to be accepted too. His relationship with his Dad and maybe his brother is damaged either way, possibly not enough if he can just call on his mum to pick up the pieces after his Dad every time. Otherwise it's just two weeks of wishing he was elsewhere and then it'll be over and he'll have the rest of the summer to do his own thing at hoe.

I’m in the middle on this
i think the length of time at their dads is far to long, they hardly see him, they don’t have their friends and normal routines
I do also think the are overly encouraged to tell you every detail, my kids life with their dad at that age was not something I expected me to micro detail
i would suggest they do this weekend and come home, chalk it up to being too long for a visit

but really, they need to grow up. I have 3 sons and there is no way they couldn’t have gone to a station loo or got a train long distance at 14

What’s your gut feeling telling you?

You know your ds best- will this make him want to never visit dad again or could it ‘make’ him get the confidence he could do with?

When I was 13 my family moved house 15 miles away and I had to get 3 busses 1 way and it was terrifying at first but I was basically told the bus numbers and to ask the driver where to get off and wait for the next one 😳 I was terrified but I was made to do it and it probably gave me the push I needed as before that I had lifts everywhere.

Although my school was obviously closer than Scotland!

I think you need to follow your gut- will DS get depressed or low in mood (concerning low) or will he cope the rest of the time there and moan when home but be ok?

After this I would take your son on the train and teach him to navigate them. Trainline website is fantastic. It’s tells you the time and platform and where the train is and if it’s been delayed. It’s really that easy.

in truth I don’t know what I’d do. He’s there for a long time and a big chunk of his holiday. However, he does need to learn the majority will often win when it comes to doing what people want. The dad imo should if he can afford take him to the cinema so his youngest gets to do what they like to. The oldest can stay at home. But you can’t make the ex do it and in that regard your powerless

I would give it a bit longer. Have you spoken to your oldest son to find out his take on it?

I don’t understand why he’s not allowed to go to the cinema on his own. 2.5 weeks is way too long, a week would have been much better.

I would get him to ask his dad to put him on a certain train and then meet him on the platform. For a kid that age I would not be doing a nine hour round-trip.

Ffs he couldn't take his child he hardly sees to a marvel movie? I'm going to paw patrol next week and I can assure you I 'havent much interest' either but that's being a a parent.

'man up'? He needs to man up himself