To refuse to lend DS £1,200 when he's still booked to go on holiday?

[Jaxonus]

I don't know what to do for the best as whatever I do frrls wrong
It's been a nightmare few years (probably 4) with DS and I thought we were through the other side but now I don't know

It's too long to list but something changed and he didn't care about his behaviour or school, he wasn't ever academic and was much better at practical type lessons but he was well behaved up until then but he seemed to enjoy being the class cleon and no matter what punishment he got he didn't care and in fact found it funny. He was also fixated on girls and I spoke to him multiple times about how he was treating them but that didn't go in either

When he was 16 announced he had a gf and she was pregnant but was cagy and defensive about other details and told me to stop questioning him. In the end it turned out he was lying and on a dating app and his gf was 22, she apparently knew his real age and didn't mind which I didn't believe but it later turned our that it was true.

She already had a child and ds seemed to have taken on the father role for both children. I know people will judge me especially because of the age gap but I didn't know what to do and if I went all in with anger and disapproval it would have just pushed him away when we didn't have the best relationship as it was. He’d just turned 16 and I found out about 2 months before she gave birth and he would have been 15 when baby was conceived and I did call his school and tried to speak to safeguarding as he was under the age of consent but nothing really was done and he ended up failing his gcses

He spent a year doing nothing pretty much apart from the bare minimum at college but his attendance was atrocious, he gave up rugby and he spent most of his time with her and if not in his room

Then last year he got an apprenticeship in carpentry and he seemed to enjoy it and I thought great, I bought him decent boots, gave him lifts on the odd few occasions he needed me to if the buses were unreliable due to the weather or something, lend him money if he was short until payday etc. And it was going great but he ended up losing it a few weeks ago die to health and safety, there wasn't a huge incident it was a bunch of things and his bosses were probably more patient than some would've been but he threw it back into their faces

He’d been spoken to multiple times about not having the right gear, taking shortcuts, climbing where he shouldn't, stupid little things that he shouldve known better for. According to him everyone else did it but whether they did or not is here nor there as they kept warning him until they'd had enough. He's convinced they just wanted rid of him and are using this as an excuse

Since then, he says he's applied for a few jobs but then circles back and says there's no jobs anyway. He's back to spending most his time in his room or with his gf even during weekdays when the children are at school or nursery as his gf doesn't work dur to a health condition. I've always been polite to her for my grandchild's sake but I don't agree with the choices they make

He still lives here officially and came home yesterday and asked me to lend him money, apparently £1,200 for his gf as she needs it for bills and there's some issue with child maintenance for the older child's dad, he kept saying it was only temporary and he/she would pay me back, I said no and he's turned it on me saying I don't care and he's weaponsing contact with the grandchildren now

The thing is, I could potentially do it but i’d be stretched but the reason I said no was because in a few weeks he's booked to go to Italy with her and the children, he booked it using his government trust fund he got at 18, which I told him to be careful with but no he knows best and booked a holiday

I mentioned it yesterday and he said it's different as it's already been booked and the children are excited and I can't tell him to upset a 5 and 2 year old by csncelling and they'd lose some money anyway. They've never been abroad and want to make memories etc (which they could do here and go next year or when they have more money)

I'm not made of money but I'm careful because I have to be and I do have money put away for emergencies like car repairs or things like that. He's barely spoken to me and apparently I'm unsupportive. I've mentioned jobs again and he said he'll look properly after their holiday but repeated there's no jobs anywhere

If he'd actually been looking and cancelled id maybe I wouldn't have hesitated but he isn't helping himself or anyone But he's accused of me making the children suffer but I don't see how I am

AIBU for refusing?

Don’t lend him the money. He and his gf need to step up and start acting like adults. The children are their responsibility, not yours and you are not a charity. I know it sounds harsh, but they both need a wake up call!

He is asking you to rectify an issue caused by himself and another man, who seemingly don't want to demonstrate actual responsibility to their young children. But then tell you that you are the problem, due to not bailing out an adult child.
I totally understand it is hard as he is and always will be your baby. But he is an adult with his own family and it is not your responsibility to save him.

Does he know you have the money? If not then honestly I would just lie and say you do not have the money. Or you could give a little bit of an inch and offer to loan them £100 or something and say that is all you can do. That can then test the water as to what he does with it and see if he pays you back?
Tbh even though i understand your principle of cancelling the holiday, he realistically won't get money back for it now?

What i will say is try not to give up hope on his future turning around. When I was his age I was terrible. Now I am married and own my own house with two kids, a profession and I have 3 degrees. So things can change and turnaround once his frontal lobe is developed.

No

I think he’s out of order but I’d give him maybe 300 or 400 and say Îm sorry I can’t afford anymore. Sort of a middle ground. I’d find it hard to cut him off because apart from him being my son and still very young I’d be worried about loosing contact with the children. Very hard situation. Hope you manage to work it out op.

Also it’s probably better to pay for the odd supermarket shop or school shoes / coat or whatever than hand over chunks of money. I’d help if I could afford it, but I’d prefer to buy actual stuff.

Don't lend him the money. But also...why is this woman not being investigated as ped0phile..if she was 22 and he was 15...how has this gone unnoticed... surely he was groomed and taken advantage of, she sounds disgusting and if that was a 22M with a 15F i bet things would be very different

So neither of them have a job and they are going on holiday to Italy 🤯 spending his savings and then asking you for money to pay her bills the absolute brass neck of this. You need to step back OP, these two are adults with children and responsibilities and need to start acting accordingly. Offer to help with school uniform shopping or other essentials for your GC but nothing more.

Both are adults.
Both are putting luxuries above bill.
Where are you in this picture?
Where are your responsibilities?
What did you do to bring about this scenario?

Where is the fairness in all this?
Are they blackmailing you?

This is not your doing. They do not need your money. They do not need to holiday. The Mum can get money from her first child's father. Your son can work. She can work. That is 4 sources of income. Do not cover their expenses. Buy the children an ice cream or little treats that you can easily afford. They can feed/clothe/house their children themselves. That is what responsible parents do.

You are being manipulated. He will respect you more if you set boundaries. Unless you want to support him and his family until they run you dry. He has a child. He needs to grow up and behave like an adult with all the responsibilities and sacrifices that being a responsible adult entails. Stop enabling his behaviour. Really. You are not responsible for him, his choices, his partner, their children. If he uses your grandchild as a bargaining chip, you need to show it wont work. Walk away. Its emotional blackmail. Stay strong.