AIBU to challenge the school’s wording about pupils rolling skirts up?

[GreenSalon]

Weekly newsletter today from DC’s secondary school contained a paragraph on uniform including the fact that there have been complaints from the public about “pupils who choose to wear skirts” rolling them up to wear them extremely short. It finishes with asking parents to speak to their children about why this is “not a good idea”.

Now, apart from the fact I assume that they must mean girls, is this not clearly implying that short skirts = making themselves vulnerable and if is, then if anything bad happens as a result it is their own fault? I thought we had moved beyond this kind of nonsense.

I only have boys at the school not girls but want to write to the head to point out how utterly sexist this is. DH agrees with me pov but thinks I shouldn’t write. AIBU?

My stepson used to find it really uncomfortable when girls at school were walking up the stairs ahead of him because everything was on display and he didn’t know where to look for fear of being accused of inappropriate behaviour. You wouldn’t expect the school to allow them to come in wearing a bikini top so why do you think they are wrong to ask them not to have their knickers on show?

Yes thats a fair point

There is no clear slut shaming, So id leave it

This is not the point. Men cannot always make a difference. It is a naked bum to them...how often on this site men are called pervs

I wouldn't blame male classmates for looking either

Literally a man is a visual and sexual being. They do like bums. What is not to understand why young ladies should not be doing this to men

I agree with you

Oh please the women to tell me who is that man who knows which bum is over 16 and which not so he knows where to look.....this is despicable and then the men are called pervs

No that’s not the point. It’s not about men. It’s not a girls’ responsibility to spare men from being pervs. It is their responsibility not to have their bums hanging out at school. It would be the same if boys were wearing their trousers half way down their bums. I’m a female teacher and I don’t want to see anyone’s arse at school, male or female, teacher or student.

My daughter is only 12, looks 16, showed me some cropped tops and shorts. I said a total No, you are not wearing those, about uniform I am much more and properly stricter

This.

Uniform, particularly in secondary school is there to teach you that there are times and places in life where you have to be professional. Showing your butt cheeks is not professional.

It’s not about pull your skirt down because men will look at you. It’s pull your skirt down because nobody needs to see your butt.

I am a woman and will notice things like cheeks hanging out of shorts, or bright red g-string under white leggings, on an escalator - doesn’t make me a perv, it does draw attention. Now in adults women who understand that and are happy with it, happy days. But with a school girl this makes me uncomfortable because they are a minor.

It’s giving you, the parent, the chance to choose why you say it’s unacceptable. That could be ‘it’s against school rules’ or ‘nobody wants to see your arse’.

Sorry but I disagree. Sanitary pads are both much thinner and much more absorbent than they were in the past and there is no reason why they should show under trousers.

I know a secondary chool that introduced pinafores to stop girls rolling their skirts and so that the girls who can't/won't wear trousers don't have to. Surprisingly the girls who couldn't wear trousers for "medical reasons" somehow can now when the other option is looking like you escaped from Malory Towers.

My daughter is 12 and rolls her skirt. I tell her off, school tells her off. She can't even articulate why she has to wear it rolled up and it's definitely not bum revealing but it's still well above the knee. Her answer is just "well all the girls do". So next year she will have to have trousers. I've told her again and again that she's breaking the rules and if she gets detention then it's her problem

I would take that to mean that only some girls choose to wear skirts (others wear trousers).

I wouldn't mind receiving this email.

Girls roll their skirts after they've left the sight of their parents, which is precisely why either:

a) All teachers need to enforce the rules strictly - departure from dress code means an immediate detention - with a strict female teacher so the girls don't put it down to a male teacher being predatory and weird. Same rule for trousers hanging down. Basically, regardless of your gender or clothes, if you expose or almost expose your underwear (including darker part of tights), you get a detention.

Or

b) trousers only. Seriously, why do we have skirts at all in this day and age? They are completely impractical and unnecessary. None of the girls are wearing skirts at the weekend. This would take away the peer pressure completely. Instead of a logo'd skirt, they could have standard issue tailored trousers (like they wear in air cadets) with standard belt. For everyone. Isn't that the point of a uniform anyway? That then also removes all the angst about gender as all uniform is gender neutral. The only difference between boys and girls trousers would be the tailoring to accommodate whatever body parts they've got. The difference in the tailoring wouldn't be discernible to a teenager.

I sent my eldest girl into school in a regulation length skirt and she got ribbed mercilessly for it. She's a strong character and very feminist and the ribbing made her more obstinate about refusing to roll it up (much). She is very tall so the skirts weren't super long on her anyway. She noticed teachers (particularly PE teachers) excusing girls who had deliberately altered their skirts to be shorter, saying "their legs were so long, it wasn't their fault", when those girls were much shorter than she was. Some teachers (particularly PE teachers) were actively encouraging the peer pressure.

When it came to sending my youngest in, the mothers of the other girls in her primary class made no secret that they were planning to spend the summer deliberately hemming their 11yr old girls' skirts so they would be substantially shorter than regulation - so they had a chance at being popular. It was insane. As a result I bought my daughter a regulation length skirt and my eldest daughter coached her on rolling it just the right amount to not be a social pariah. It is now getting shorter by the year in her attempts to fit in.

What chance have girls got when some parents are actively encouraging it, and the school don't enforce the rules (apart from 3 days in September)!

School should either enforce the rules or change the rules so they don't have to!

challenge the school’s wording

Of all things you could “challenge”, you are thinking of challenging the school’s perfectly appropriately worded newsletter encouraging parents to communicate with their children about this issue in a way that works for them.

Sometimes you read an OP and you just know how they come across in RL. This OP being one.

The reasons why they are asked to keep their skirts to a moderate length is irrelevant. It's the rule and that's that! Boys wouldn't be allowed to come in with shirts unbuttoned to the waist, or wearing their flies undone to show their pants. The reasons are all the same. It's not because the opposite sex might lose control of themselves, it's about looking respectable and modest. Same rules for boys and girls. End of!

Only difference is boys don't come in revealing themselves but girls have rolled their skirts up since time began...

I’m a straight female and I feel super uncomfortable when I see a lot of the local high school girls with their arse showing.

Agree with the school too.

I don’t want to see underwear and bum cheeks. We do unfortunately see it a lot around here as the girls roll them so high.

They have, me and my DDs included. But there’s a line I don’t think should be crossed in terms of being able to see bum cheeks or knickers

I know my dd wore shorts under hers, still does when she goes out

It's seen as empowering for women to show off their underwear, flash their skins. But shout "oh perv. Don't look" if anyone complains.

Its asking you as the parent to explain to your own child why 'it's not a good idea'.
This gives you complete liberty to explain to your child anything from "It's too short to be appropriate for the occasion according to social norms" to "I think its looks fantastic Darling, did the same myself, your body your choice but the school are stuffy old bores and its not a good idea to do something that gets you told off".