Welfarisation has made people utterly entitled and unable to take responsibility for themselves and their families.

[hagchic]

I grew up in a working class family. The values I was taught were that you stood on your own two feet and it was no one else's job to do what you could do for yourself.

If you were hurt, you were expected to get up and go and clean yourself up - and stop whining about it unless it was actually serious. If you were ill, you went to bed and if you were lucky some magic lucozade appeared.

If you were sad, then you were sad. If life was unfair then that was just how life was and you needed to deal with it.

You never ever sought charity or took benefits when you were able to work or put up with less. You lived to your own means, not to what you saw on TV or at school - and if you wanted that lifestyle it was up to you to get it.

Today everyone has the expectation that someone must help them, that they are obliged to help them - even before they have made any attempt to actually do the work of helping themselves. They expect luxuries like holidays, pets, new clothes and treats when they do nothing to earn this.

I think self sufficiency is a value that needs to return to our society.

If you opt out: then no social safeguards at all via taxpayers money. Possibly some charity will provide support

Good idea!

These replies prove your point OP.

The welfare system has got out of control though. I have a friend who doesn’t work, partner also doesn’t work, full house is on disability and they go more holidays and have more nights out than I do even though I work full time. The disabilities being undiagnosed adhd/autism.

I was brought up to take what I could from the system. Neither my mum or dad worked. If they did it was a cash in hand on the side whilst still claiming full benefits. I was taught to get myself a cash in hand job, have kids to secure a council house and that was the best I was going to get. Thankfully me and my siblings didn’t want that life and whilst I’ve had spells of using the benefit system the goal has always been to lift myself out of it. And I like to think I’ve shown my own children a good work ethic that I wasn’t shown. My brother has a good job that he worked hard for. But there’s plenty more families like mine out there.

What a hideous, unkind and threatening post! That poster is gainfully employed but has a disability from birth that requires physical aids in order for her to lead a full life and PIP unlocks her eligibility for that help. I presume that you would prefer to sweep away the whole welfare state and go back to Victorian levels of poverty.

We are all one illness/accident away from being disabled. I doubt that you have the level of wealth that would shield you in those circumstances. Be careful what you wish for.

I didn’t wish for anything and the poster shouldn’t be on here gloating about how she gets PIp and is in the higher tax bracket … and previously stated. What is it? A badge of honour?!?

Dubai has an excellent welfare state that works for its citizens: the emiratis live lives of ease, their every need catered for, while all the work and wealth generation is done by immigrants, who are kicked out the moment they lose their jobs, are too sick to work, or when they reach retirement age.

i certainly did feel threatened by the post. I feel doxxed, especially given that the poster claimed to be making a report about me. More than one. Thank you.

I claim pip because it’s a benefit provided for the state to help with the extra living costs caused by long term physical or mental health conditions. My income from work is not taken into account.

that’s why. It doesn’t even touch the sides of what my disability costs me.

Also. For those saying the op didn’t mean disability benefits, I’d like to point out - again - that her paragraph 4 began with

You never ever sought charity or took benefits when you were able to work

which to me, is a direct reference to PIP.

Have you ever received any money from the state? Did you receive child benefit? Were you at any point a stay at home mother so received automatic NI contributions? Will your NI contributions fully cover the cost of your state pension? Have you given birth on the NHS?

You sound very much like the right-wing American writer and philosopher, Ayn Rand, who was a fierce critic of the welfare state and any government funded support but who still claimed Social Security and Medicare with the aid of a social worker in her old age. Most posters with your extreme views tend to be hypocrites.

That poster obviously wasn't gloating. She was giving herself as an example of someone who is employed in a professional job and so contributing to society and the Exchequer but who still requires financial support from the state due to significant disabilities, to try and counteract your very clichéd view of benefit claimants as lazy scroungers.

Exactly this.

PIP is a gateway benefit - it enables me to have a car adapted for me that I couldn’t otherwise afford. It also let me get my BB so that I can actually get out and about in said car.

it also made the process of adaptations at work much easier.

I use the money as it is intended - to pay for things that are additional costs due to my disabilities. If I was gloating I’d have said I spent it on sky tele, nails and take always or some such nonsense.

adding for clarity before I get jumped on I don’t have sky, I never get my nails done and I don’t remember the last time I had a take away.

I do pay £7.50 a month to Sainsbury’s for grocery deliveries. And, as I said,I have prime which is just for ease of purchasing items and comes with tv as a plus.

I think @BuildbyNumbere feels a bit threatened or inadequate at the thought of someone with a significant disability working in a career that’s well-paid enough that she “shouldn’t need” PIP.

Attitude says far more about her than it does about @Bbcsounds!

OP has inspired me to start taking Lucozade to fix my daily seizures. Also I just need to sleep off my Epilepsy and get back to work after a seizure.

Medical issues can all be fixed by hard work and Lucozade, thanks OP..

Maybe the real benefit scroungers (MPs) should pay for everything off their own wages instead of "expenses" from the taxpayer. Amazing how they get subsidised meals and alcohol in Westminster, paid for by the tax payer. Oh and the House of Lords? If you're one of them you can turn up, stay for ten minutes or have a wee snooze, leave, and get paid over 300 quid for absolutely nothing........

Is there a word for the working class equivalent of internalised misogyny?

It really sickens me that there are people who climbed the ladder and then want to kick it out from under them. My father was a miner who left school at 14 to work in the pits like my Grandfather. The unions sent him to night school and then he went to Ruskin College, Oxford, because the unions paid for him. His had opportunities because of other working people helping him out and collective labour helping other working men. He worked all his life and did not begrudge another human being being helped as we were comfortable and had all we wanted and a bit more. When he fell terminally ill, the NHS and benefits system supported my mother and his four daughters. I want to live in a country where people do not opt out of taking care of the most vulnerable in society, where there is a safety net that means that we do not have massive disparities of wealth, life expectancy and opportunities based on where you live, where you are born or who you are born to. The right wing press always have the drip drip drip of outliers that try and ‘prove’ their agenda to dismantle the safety net, to privatise the NHS and to deregulate commerce to remove the rights of people, so that they can have another yacht or another mansion. The era of austerity, privatisation and neoliberalism has heralded the worst set of outcomes for humans and and economists have shown that the worst levels of economic growth and income disparities, yet the right wing press have propagandised people so much that they do not blame the people who caused these issues but the people who are the most vulnerable in society who are suffering the most, the ill, the disabled, the immigrants and the unemployed. There is a massive information paucity and powers that be have become adept at directing people’s anger the wrong way so that people vote against their self interest and do not see the real villains in this story.

Part of me wants to flame you but actually I agree that no good comes of thinking you are owed this and that and life should always be fair.

Not sure what this has to do with benefits though. Getting disability because you can’t work isn’t the same as wanting a luxury holiday you can’t afford is it? 😕

Everyone benefits from an educated healthy workforce. Indeed health is very much a public issue - infectious diseases need a society to work together. Private schools might dominate your lawyers and journalists and bankers but state school are keeping the national grid and water running to your house in highly technical jobs

The irony of you talking about rage bait whilst quoting the bible on a site which is frequented primarily by women.

Spectacular.

And educated by the state perhaps too?

There was a similar thread recently about someone feeling sorry for her friends lottery win as she’d lose benefits, ridiculous

Your point is exactly ? It’s irrelevant whether it’s men or women ! the poster has come on to start a hate conversation to bad mouth others who don’t do as she does .

what a sad life someone must have to want to start a thread of hate 🤷‍♀️

Oh here we go, picking on the poor and disabled again. Shall I tell my body to stop being crap so I can go to work?, surprise...it doesn't work. I worked for 15+ just to please other people, then I burnt out and my health hasn't been the same since. Yay 🙄

Benefits make people weak and easier to control.

The difference between now though and say, the 1980"s, is that any ordinary person can DYOR in seconds and educate themselves, there is no excuse for getting caught in a mortgage debt trap then saying "I didn"t understand that rates also go up".

AB has got some quite funky ideas about tax and spending, he is definitely good for a bond market meltdown IMO.

www.bankrate.com/banking/what-is-an-inverted-yield-curve/