To let you know the axe and machete girl WAS defending herself against her now convicted attacker.

[alittleprivacy]

A lot of posters here need to see the conclusion of this story about the clearly terrified child, that so many people were quick to be awful about. You all owe this extremely vulnerable child you participated in the defamation of, a massive fucking apology. I'm genuinely so angry about how so many grown women denigrated a hurt and scared child. Her fear was so evident in her voice and demeanor and so many mothers here were quick to throw her under a bus. Well you've all been proven wrong now, with the man she was trying to defend herself from found guilty of assault.

Honestly, just think about what you people did, defending a man who assaulted a child just because she was of a class you deem beneath you. I hope you're very, very ashamed and take stock before more girls like her suffer worse.

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/uk/bulgarian-man-guilty-of-assaulting-12-year-old-girl/a/156878498.html

How was the Bulgarian man acting in self-defence?

I didnt say he was. I said encouraging young girls to carry deadly weapons for their own protection is the wrong approach, overall. We seem to know that when we tell young urban boys in danger of being attacked not to carry weapons for protection because it actually increases the risk that something awful will happen to them (jail or death).

We also aren't as sympathetic to their fear.

I see that someone posted a photograph of one of the girls on Julie Bindel's X account yesterday (12 June, under 'I got this one wrong'). Nasty looking injuries to the girl's forehead and around her eye - no wonder the girl was taken to hospital after the assault.

If that was your point you chose a completely unsuitable link to illustrate it and then doubled-down on why you chose that particular example.

@ChunkyMonkey36 you know what’s interesting is there’s another thread on this that I just done reading and there’s other people on there who grew up poor like you did who agree with me that she did nothing wrong defending herself and her sister and they’re saying it’s middle class people who disagree but on this thread it’s the other way round you saying I can’t have an opinion because I grew up middle class (until 16 when they pretty much disowned me)

Either way I don’t think any of this class stuff matters I’d be saying the same thing if princess charlotte scared Andrew off with a hatchet.
It’s even illegal for a female to carry pepper spray for her own protection in this country which rarely sentences rapists and if they do they’re out in a few years.

Anyway a post from the other thread that might interest you :

First they were subjected to disgusting sexual remarks from an adult male, then they were bombarded with cruel abuse from strangers on the internet. The salt of classism rubbed into the wound of sexual harassment.
To me, there is no mystery whatsoever as to why the girls were not only disbelieved but mocked, mauled and treated as if they were the perpetrators. It’s because they are working-class. It’s because they are ‘white trash’. It was a searing testament to the modern left’s haughty disgust for the ‘riff raff’ that they would take the word of a 22-year-old Bulgarian male over the word of scared Scottish girls.
Their gross caricatures of these supposedly feral girls necking Irn Bru and wielding axes at innocent immigrants completely fell apart in court. The sheriff described the girls’ evidence as ‘eloquent’. Their case was true and well put, he said. Eternal shame on every keyboard bigot who saw one clip of these girls and instantly decided they were the scum of the earth.
The slandering of ‘Sophie of Dundee’ was like a replay, on a smaller scale, of the state’s vile denialism when working-class girls said they’d been raped by gangs of primarily Muslim men. Then, too, the men were often believed over the girls. Well, they were from an ‘oppressed’ minority whereas the girls were just classless ruffians hanging out in places they shouldn’t have been. That was the odious prejudice on which the grooming-gang scandal was built.'

Mumsnet pearl clutching at its finest.
Apologists for dirty bastard child abusers.
You should hang your heads in shame, but no, much easier to judge a CHILD who felt she had no other means of protecting herself, and other children.
You're probably the same achingly tedious posters who wonder what to do when your precious children are caught using weed or stealing but don't want to face it because it might harm their chances of going to a top university/make them not want to be your friend anymore.
But a working class girl trying to keep safe?
Nah, you're no better than the rape gang apologists.

@teethyblinders nails it

Love, it’s been over 12 hours.

I’ve been to bed and packed half a house up since then, why are you still tagging me in nonsense and looking for more?

I’m not reading that, I’m busy, and don’t require a lecture about being working class from you.

Working class, frightened, covered in purple spots, leave your hatchet at home.

Go and do something more useful with your Saturday.

Not a lecture don’t care what class anyone is, unlike you hung up on people who have more money than you.

Hopefully a grown creep of a man dosent follow your daughter around. Then you’ll find out how useful calling the police is.

Okay, thanks.

No i didn't. It was someone who brought a knife to a conflict which was then used against them and the person who used the knife was deemed to be defending themselves

Yes you did, you chose an adult male, the [alleged] leader of a violent, criminal gang, who robbed someone in the street, who was then killed in the subsequent skirmish.

Then, in your last post you say;

'I said encouraging young girls to carry deadly weapons for their own protection is the wrong approach, overall.'

The dead man was deemed to be the aggressor - I can't see how this comparison relates to the 12-year-old girl.

Since the dead man had already been implicated in a murder himself, although acquitted, some people might wonder if he got his comeuppance in the end.

The act of carrying a weapon for any reason increase your risk of physical harm. That is why we tell people not to arm themselves irrespective of whether there is a legitimate need to defend themselves.

Can't you link to an example where the deceased wasn't the leader of a violent criminal gang? Perhaps you admired this guy and his drill music and didn't realise he was a nasty piece of work?

I prefer grime. Drill is a bit young for me.

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200809/cmselect/cmhaff/112/11207.html

https://www.london.gov.uk/programmes-strategies/mayors-office-policing-and-crime-mopac/mopac-guidance-and-resources/carrying-knife-makes-it-more-likely-someone-will-harm-you

This has been public safety advice since I was in secondary school in the 90s-00s

At first glance, your second link somewhat contradicts your original point;

self-defence is no defence in the eyes of the law

TheHateUGive
This has been public safety advice since I was in secondary school in the 90s-00s

No one is disputing that - however, you were creating a scenario where the Bulgarian man killed the 12-year-old in self-defence.

It’s not really the same issue is it? Young boys and teens carrying knives, because other young boys and teens (and adults) are carrying them clearly is an awful self perpetuating problem.

one girl doing this is not a systematic issue, unlike migrant men sexually harassing young girls (and sometimes boys) which actually is a widespread issue, up and down the country.

they are not the same problem and don’t have the same route cause, so it’s not a good comparison.

peo aren’t saying they think that it’s a good idea that young girls start carrying weapons on the whole, obviously. But in this specific situation it probably saved her from being abused.

Yes, many people on here cause me absolute revulsion. An actual physical reaction to their cruelty and stupidity.

They think they are in the right, and on the side of good and fair.

And then those very same people sit around being confused and horrified by the 'rise of the far right', when they can not see they are causing it themselves.

Some utter fuckwit/handmaidens around, which would be funny, if it didn't support raped and dead kids.

And she could have ended up in prison which you could argue would be just as serious an outcome

The weapons only came out after the assault though I believe?

we can’t know for certain, but it’s a pattern over and over again. And do you really think he would have been sentenced without media attention?

migrant men are harassing children up and down the country. It’s a problem in many many places.

Just a quick list of examples for @ChunkyMonkey36 demonstrating that the rape gangs were not confined to Rochdale (far from it). Please note the following non-exhaustive list of child sex abuse rings by Asian men as successfully prosecuted in court:

• Aylesbury
• Banbury
• Bristol
• Derby
• Halifax
• Huddersfield
• Keighley
• Manchester
• Newcastle
• North Wales
• Oxford
• Peterborough
• Rotherham
• Telford

I'd say that's a widespread pattern not only of this happening but of girls not being believed.

It's a comforting thought that it was only happening 'elsewhere' but that's not supported by the evidence, unfortunately.

It's possible these two girls have their own experience to add to the general national pattern, too of course.

I don't for one second think that carrying weapons is a good thing and something to be encouraged, but I think it's childishly naive to suggest that they had no reason not to go to the police and no reason to think they wouldn't be believed and helped.

They did, and in truth I think that made it worse for them.

The police responded to a call from a man claiming to be the victim of attack, and when they arrived the girls who were alleged to have attacked him had hidden weapons and told them where to find them.

Do we really not think that shaped how they saw the situation; at first assessment?

Absolutely nobody should be excusing the man’s behaviour; or his lying about the incident, but surely we have to accept that if the police turn up and you have a hatchet; you do look like you’re the aggressor.

That’s a list of crimes committed by Asians. The man was Bulgarian. That’s a really obvious difference.

The only links are “migrant/not British,” or “male” which would suggest the children were taught, encouraged or permitted to take weapons onto the street with them because foreigners are dangerous, or because men exist.

I don’t think that’s a sensible thing to do, or to allow children to believe, generally.

In reality, most working class teenagers wouldn’t ring the police because they’re the enemy.

Not because of the grooming gangs, or because they’re racist; but because when you or those around you spend your childhood committing low level crimes (drinking on the street, shoplifting, vandalism etc) you very quickly start seeing the police as the problem.

A grooming gang of Balkan gypsy men were caught in Dundee a few months ago. The man in this incident we’re talking about described himself as a gangster gypsys king and talked about making whores get in his car on social media.

And no I have nothing against gypsys I have a lot of gypsys ancestry.
But it’s the same concept with the police not wanting to protect white girls because they don’t want to seem racist to minority groups so you keep saying he was Bulgarian not Asian is irrelevant