AIBU to think USA has gone crazy - Karmelo Anthony is a murderer not a victim

[Neutralnames]

From what I have read, Karmelo Anthony (who is black African American) took a concealed knife to a track event. When it started raining he ran to another team's tent to shelter. He was told to leave by a white athlete called Austin Metcalfe. KA refused saying ' 'Touch me and see what happens', According to one account I read he was repeatedly told to leave and replied the same way each time. Austin Metcalfe then pushed KA to get him to leave and KA pulled out the knife and stabbed AM in the chest, killing him.

Apparently sections of America are outraged that KA has now been convicted of murder. Possible sentence range in America is 5 to 99 years for this offence and he got 35 years.

I don't understand how this is not murder. In UK law if you can run away you must, and he didn't. In UK law if you kill someone when you could have run, you will be tried for murder.

KA took a knife. He could have left (even if he thought it was a dick move to ask him to leave when it was raining - you can't murder people for being dickish about their gazebo) but chose to not to, escalating the situation with threatening language and then stabbed a young man in the chest.

I just think something has gone terribly wrong in USA society where this man is treated as a victim, not the person who he killed, and this case is regarded as an injustice against him. I hope the UK does not go down this route.

It’s not race-baiting to be appalled at members of the killer’s community trying to paint him as the victim.

When I lived in the US I found the race relations very hard to understand. There seemed so very often to be a simmering anger that was just waiting to be let out.

There was one little example that I saw that comes to mind here.

I was in a florist in Manhattan waiting while my bouquet was being arranged. The staff were all black women.

A middle-aged white man in a suit came in, having a conversation on his mobile.

He took it away from his ear, and said “I need a dozen red roses, back in a minute” then went back outside to continue his call. He was a little brusque, but quite normal in Manhattan for someone in a rush.

One of the assistants said to the other “that man was so racist.”

So you’re apolitical but think the right wing are fine and the left wing are nuts? Not both parties can be nuts?

And you defended Rittenhouse after he took a gun out, got psyched up and wanted to join in the chaos? And that’s fine because he was being chased? So one guy takes out a knife, not okay, and one takes out a gun, okay. Not, both were looking for trouble and both should have been convicted?

Riiiiight.

That’s what I heard the protesters saying to the journalist.

if a white teen had taken a knife to a sports event and stabbed a black kid during an argument, there would be riots in that state right now.

He will be eligible for parole in 17 years.

OP, this is not the first and won't be the last case like this. Michael Brown was the first time I became aware of these sorts of dynamics in the US. Critical race theory is a poison and unfortunately the US is infected with it and has been for a long, long time.

When I lived in the US I found the race relations very hard to understand. There seemed so very often to be a simmering anger that was just waiting to be let out

So exactly what’s happening right now in the UK every time someone is attacked by an asylum seeker/an immigrant. The tensions are high and the anger simmering.

Nate the lawyer (amoungst others) has done many youtube videos on this going back a year.

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He speaks about what the OP is going on about.

It’s true as someone who used to be formerly on the Left, I am appalled by what the Left has become ( particularly the progressive left). There is a sense of betrayal from those you thought were your own that has been hard to go through. I do find the left have embraced perhaps the most insane and some of the most intolerant ideas of the modern day. I don’t support right wing parties either though, though I am impressed by Kemi Badenoch.

As for criticizing aspects of Muslim culture. Yes, there are aspects of Muslim culture I criticize just as there are aspects of our modern Western predominantly white culture I have criticized on many posts, such as gender ideology ( regular name changer), and aspects of Christian culture. So sorry, am I meant to exclude Muslims from criticism because ( you see them as being) brown or because they are Muslim? Do you make pointed comments trying to catch people out who criticize aspects of Christianity too? Just trying to understand why you think Muslims are immune from any aspect of their culture being criticized. There are two billion of them so that’s an awful lot of diversity not to be allowed to criticize any of it.

Oh my goodness, another poster with comprehension difficulties. I said the nutty side of the left. Have a think about what the phrasing means. Cos it sure as hell doesn’t mean what you conveniently misinterpreted it as.

I also didn’t defend Ritten whatever his name was. I asked ‘wasn’t he being chased by a mob?’. And the poster confirmed he was. The point being there were quite significant differences in those cases which makes it not very sensible to compare them. And certainly doesn’t take away from the fact that KA clearly murdered someone in a situation no sane person could think had justification.

Oh and by the way, if KA had been being chased by a mob of white men ( or men of any race) , I think he would have been reasonable to use a knife in self defence, and it’s likely a jury would too. Hope that helps.

And Kyle Rittenhouse murdered two. What difference does make if he was being chased or not? The premise was the same; they both took weapons out and when someone pushed back they murdered them. Why would you ask if he was being chased at all? Why would it matter? They both went out armed and murdered, but you automatically came up with an excuse for the white one (whose first victim was alone and unarmed).

And to say ‘being right wing is fine/nutty left’ in the same sentence is so telling, no matter how many fake flappy ‘oh my goodnesses’ you do. This whistle is so low people over 100 can hear it.

Again, Rittenhouse shot an alone and unarmed man. That was his first victim. But he was white and he cried and everyone said ‘No worries’ and has gone on to say some horrific things in public. But of course these two cases are different.

And don’t bother with the ‘hope that helps’ stuff with me, it weakens your argument.

Again, I did not say I agreed. I was just explaining what the argument was.

Why are you pretending you can’t see a difference between someone being chased by a mob intent on kicking the crap out of you, and someone between told to leave a gazebo and refusing to? I just don’t believe you can’t see that obvious difference. Your politics just aren’t allowing you to admit you can see it.

It’s unfortunate your black and white thinking doesn’t allow you to understand the rest of it. Thats on you, not me.

Because, and I don’t think I can make this any clearer, his first victim
wasnt part of a mob. He was alone and unarmed. He tried to grab Rittenhouse’s gun so Rittenhouse shot him and murdered him.

I cannot see how you think that is different when the two cases are extremely similar.

You don’t know my politics because I haven’t revealed them.

The UK is not the US and it's unhelpful in the UK context to compare the two. The history and current circumstances are completely different.

Tensions are high and anger is simmering, I 100% agree. But we are not the same by any stretch.

its taken a while for that detail to come out from you. And as I think I’ve made clear I don’t know much about this case, hence me asking ‘ wasn’t he being chased by a mob’?

But you’ve said yourself that this makes no difference as to whether he was being chased by a mob whereas most sane people can see the difference between the two.

I have no interest in the Ritten whatsoever his name case to be honest. It makes no difference to the fact that KA was not acting in self defence and there is no justification or excuse for what he did. It was cold blooded murder and he deserves to go to jail and the people reframing him as victim are terrible people.

No, but he did chase him and cornered him, then grabbed his gun.

Oh and @MyTwinklyMoose I’ve only ever heard one political side throw around the term ‘dog whistle’ at others so it’s a pretty clear indication of your politics.

Yes, he chased him and grabbed his gun. That’s still an alone and unarmed man. In this case, the victim pushed KA away and shouted at him.

The two are very similar, two armed men went out looking for trouble and When someone, unarmed, stood up to them, they murdered them, except one was convicted of murder and one was not, when they BOTH should have been. Rittenhouse being let off is me of the reasons for the unrest, so it’s important to understand the similarities.

Okay, make assumptions about me all you want, but then you can’t shout when I make them about you. Only one side calls the left ‘nutty’ and says ‘being right wing is okay’ whilst pretending to be apolitical or centrist.

Apparently his family spent all the money raised for his defence on themselves and left him with the public defender.

Oh, lynchings still happening? Wow. Who knew?!!

KA wasn’t chased. He was asked to leave. It doesn’t matter how much you pretend this difference is irrelevant, it isn’t. It’s crucial. KA could have walked away. And nothing would have happened. If R was chased, then he was trying to get away, and the chaser prevented that. Obviously, I was not on the juries but based on that fact alone, you can see how that crucial fact could lead to different jury decisions.