Teenager refusing to follow school rules on make-up and piercings

[IcarusFallingDown]

Any suggestions (if any) for a rebellious teenager who doesn’t care about school rules?

My DD is 16, very well behaved in other areas (doesn’t drink, vape, go out late). Generally respectful at home apart from some teenage strops.

She has a real disregard for school rules. They aren’t allowed to wear makeup or false eye lashes at school, today she was asked to remove both, and told the teacher she won’t be doing so, neither now or in the future. We’ve also had a conversation at home and she’s repeated the same to me. I’m getting daily emails from school about makeup and eye lashes, I email the school saying I will discuss this with her, but I am not sure what else I am able to do?

She’s now decided she’s getting a lip piercing, which is against school policy, but again says the same and that she doesn’t care what the school says or does. I’ve told her I do not sanction this and she’s making life incredibly difficult, it will likely result in detentions from the school and emails home, but she just says she isn’t bothered and wants to express her individuality.

Has anybody been through this with their teenager? My eldest is a boy and was fastidious about school rules so I haven’t experienced this before, I’m sure it is common.

I agree with this. From the sounds of it, her make-up isn't outlandish and isn't affecting her school work or general conduct and has made her more confident. Workplaces don't tend to manage people's make up and if she's wanting a more arty careerr she's likely okay for piercings too. I'd leave her be.

Sure, and that was a strong bargaining chip you held. It was astute of you to realise this and use it to your advantage. Teenagers can be really good at things like this!

OP's DD's situation may be a bit different, but she can still think strategically. It may be that doing her GCSE year elsewhere turns out to be her best option - but she could do it as an active choice rather than being booted out.

Yes I think that's a wise way of looking at it
Ops DD needs to work out what her priorities are,.what power she has/does not have, and then decide her next steps

If she’s old enough to make these decisions then she is old enough to bear the consequences. I’d make it clear that whether she agrees or not her school has rules she needs to obey or they will decide what the consequences are. And worse case scenario is she is asked to leave. She could end up repeating another year but if she thinks wearing fake eyelashes is worth it then fine. Also I’d suggest if she’s grown up enough to decide all of this she’s grown up enough to get a job, do her washing and a chunk of house work. You don’t get to play at being an adult.

Whilst I am a big believer in what a child wears to school doesn't affect their learning so it shouldn't matter it is about learning that in life there are somethings we have to do whether we like it or not as it is the rules.

I would let school deal with it as it is their rules that she is breaking and therefore she needs to suffer the consequences.

I would respond to their email to say that you have spoken to her and that she is adamant she will not follow the rules so therefore they should deal with her as they see fit. If this means constant detentions or working in isolation then so be it. She has to learn that sometimes, whether we like it or not we have to follow rules.

However, if they decide to exclude her for it then I would be jumping in to disagree as that is a step too far!

It's a private school and I suspect they want her to leave.

I just spotted that it was a private school. I have no idea of how private schools work so maybe my suggestion of letting them deal with her is wrong.

I agree with you, I said similar further up thread. I would imagine being 16, knowing you are the oldest in the year group, and could be leaving school, but can't for another year, would piss off most 16 year olds! The OP's daughter has 'caught up' with her peers, being summer born, and is ready to leave school, like all the other 16 year olds. I would imagine it's embarrassing for her being the eldest, and people knowing she's older but has been held back a year. It's not going to do much for her self-esteem and self-confidence, so probably not surprising she's now rebelling.

If she's not prepared to bend that's the reality she's facing.

However, I do agree with your point. My daughter is at uni now but when she was at her strict grammar sixth form she (sort of) got away with murder because she was a really good student. It was a very strict school but she was able to bend (not completely break) the rules. So she could wear clothes that were more artsy than the 'business attire' rule. She had loads of piercings and strong make-up but she was so hard working and respectful not one teacher ever mentioned anything.

She might have a part-time job? My nieces that age do Saturdays and evenings at McDonald’s and the pay isn’t too bad.

Private schools usually believe that children's self-expression ought to take the form of skills that have been acquired through education: art, singing, instruments, debating, sports, dancing, positions of responsibility. Not through contemporary consumer culture: piercings and make-up.

I agree with you both, and I think it's the core of the problem.

My DDs school does not police make up or false lashes. Piercing beyond ears must be removed or replaced with a clear stud while healing. I dont think policing teens make up etc. is useful or has any impact on learning or how well they will transition to employment.

However, no school will ever completely match your values or preferences. Other positives may outweigh things you or your child are less keen on. You have said:
*You child is progressing well academically
*They have a good group of friends
*They are ND, but apart from this issue things are broadly ok & the school has provided a supportive envronment
She is 15 and will probably say her preferences are more inportant than any of this & she doesnt care if they kick her out etc etc. Is there an alternative setting without these rules that will provde equivalent support for her to achieve her GCSEs? If so I would consider moving her. If not I would be relentless in explaining I think she should comply as the benefits are more important than her preferences about her appearance. I think the appearance rules arent needed, but i would see the other benefits of the school as outweghing them. Sometimes you have to comply with stuff you dont like in orgnisations. I also wouldnt financially support choices that would jeapodise her school place.

If she wont accept the argument she will have to accept the consequences that may ultimately lead to the place being withdrawn. If you think she is making the wrong choices all you can do is explain that and not offer financial or practical support for them. If it got as far as them considering removing her place, I would be clear I was very disappointed that she was willing to sabbotage her educational opportunities over make up style and piercings during the school day. In the end though you cant make teens do something, all you can do is explain that actions can have consequences rhey may regret.

It seems a bit of a waste, £200,000+ to send her to a private school that she doesn’t like in order for her to leave school at sixteen and work doing people’s waxing.

At the end of the day, you can't force her to do anything if she's that determined.

I strongly advocate the route of being totally frank with her about what you were like at that age, and why you now wish you'd behaved differently, and exactly what the possible consequences will be if she keeps doing it. Perhaps try and help her find ways to contravene the rules without getting caught, such as a more natural look (I mean, it's a bit of makeup, not exactly high treason) - but be clear that even doing that, she still might get caught and if she does, it'll be fair cop and she'll have to accept any punishment gracefully. And then.... just leave her to it. And I mean really leave her to it. Stop stressing out. Leave her to suffer the consequences at school, whether that's having to go and wash it all off, having to sit out of class or whatever - it's her problem, not yours. And if she gets kicked out then she gets kicked out - if she's intelligent then she'll probably still be able to sit and pass her exams anyway and go to college. I had friends who were very rebellious in year 10/11 but thrived at college where they had more independence and autonomy. At the end of the day, 16 year olds are nearly adults; my grandparents had all been out at work earning money for a year or two by time they were that age, so it's natural that many of them start to feel frustrated with being treated like children. If she's otherwise an intelligent girl with everything else together, then I suspect that if you treat her like an adult, talk to her frankly (including being honest about your own youth) and give her the autonomy, then she'll eventually be alright (even if the path she takes to successful adulthood is a winding one).
On the other hand, if she's that headstrong, then warring with her over it and treating her like a child (grounding, taking her makeup away) will probably push her to greater rebellion.

Are you in Scotland? I’m just wondering why she was kept back a year when she’s already 16 and it’s only June that’s all. Usually summer babies are kept back a year when they’re born in August, perhaps July at a push.

Also should say on the lip piercing front, I still have the holes to this day. You should warn her of this, then skin doesn’t close up fully. I’m lucky my bottom lip protrudes so it isn’t massively obvious.

Wow, snobby much? A former school friend of mine owns her own hairdressing/beauty salon and is far richer than me, a PhD holding academic!

Snobby how? You don’t need an expensive private education if your aspiration is to leave at sixteen and do waxing.

What’s snobby about it?

My children go to state school precisely because we are not snobby and know that it’s not needed for children as bright as they are.

So a private education is only reserved for academic children who plan to go to Oxbridge then? Parents send their kids to private school for all sorts of reasons and their outcomes are varied. Lots of them go on to own their own businesses like hair salons. My DH went to private school and one of his friends owns a yoghurt company for example! They don’t all end up getting a PhD.

It is pretty pointless to speculate whether defering was the right decision. You cant turn back time.
It would be very difficult to get a school place for Y11 and moving halfway through gcses is going to be less than ideal to say rhe least. If she drops out with no GCSEs things wont be easy. She will probably have to go to college do a level 2 course and sit gcse maths and english. That is going to be a very different environment to her current private school. She really needs to just tone the make up down wait on the piercing for 12 months and start appreciating the educational opportunities she has. However, when your a naive 15 year old sometimes you just push back against everything. Maybe it wont get to the stage of them withdrawing the place in which case she'll just have to get on with the detentions etc.

This. The point of private schools is not to pursue a career in academia so much as to receive a much broader (hence more expensive) education than the public purse can fund.

How to tell people you’re a decades long pain in the hole without showing us your “I am in pain in the hole” tattoo.

Don't be nasty. I'd rather have tattoos and show some kindness than sit and sneer and judge others

At our school, failure to follow school rules repeatedly, would mean she was kicked out. Also a private school.

If she doesn’t think rules apply to her, she’s going to struggle in life because she’ll no doubt find some other rules petty. Some rules are petty, but sometimes you have to follow them, or challenge them in way that’s appropriate, not just do what you like and ignore them.

You could try talking to the school and saying about possible PDA and see what their SEN team can do to help, but failing that, it may be that this isn’t the school for her. There are private schools with more relaxed rules which may suit your daughter better if she has PDA, so moving may be the only and/or best option.