Aibu to think that clean eating isn’t that bad?

[arethereanyleftatall]

DD, 17, only eats ‘clean’. She eats like this because she says she feels much better on it, and for her that’s a priority above all else. And, to be fair to her, she’s thriving. Doing well at alevels, volunteering, working, and generally a wonderfully bright and joyous person to be around. This is in stark contrast to the gcse years with school refusal, period pains, excessive sleeping, no homework completed ever.
if it’s relevant, and so as not to drip feed, she ticks every adhd box at the top, but not diagnosed although we’re 4 years in now on the nhs list, and she’s got through the first few stages, and probably autism, but is able to mask so much, that that isn’t noticeable to the outside world.
daily menu for her would be steak, eggs, salmon, about 4 different fruits/veg, honey, all organic, and meat/fish/eggs only cooked in a special non Teflon pan with tallow. Drinks are filtered water only, and a hot drink with ginger, lemon.
I didn’t think this was too bad, expensive yes but I can afford it, but many of her peers are eating junk on the daily, and drinking alcohol, so compared to that, I feel like she’s ok. Yes, I know there’s lots in between that and balance would be key but I can’t force any near adult to eat, and certainly not DD for whom telling her what to do has the exact opposite effect.
anyway. On here last night, i discovered there’s a diagnosis for this - orthorexia, and it scared me. Oh, one last thing, it doesn’t stop her eating out socially, she’ll order steak and chips and I’ll eat her chips.

She needs carbs though.

None at all. She eats piles of blueberries etc I don’t think she’s constipated at all, she never mentions it

For a day or so, no, she wouldn’t. It’s never been tested beyond that, and I guess that is what I must work out.

I’d assume boyfriend does know and perhaps also similar diet. Hopefully she’s planning to buy her own food, a houseguest eating steak and salmon isn’t cheap.
You’ve mentioned 4 fruits and veg a few times that sounds very restrictive.
Realistically she’ll need a studio at uni I can’t see her coping in a shared halls kitchen. I’d be extremely worried about her being away I think you’ll need to go and visit regularly. I try to go a couple of times a semester and check cupboards, do a big food shop. She has her own air fryer.

Watch the film Dark Waters.

I eat exactly like this. It's not orthorexia, it's respect for my body! Like your DD, if I eat rubbish I feel terrible, whereas eating 'clean' gives me a lot of energy and satiation.

I saw that post you are referring to and the OP on there seemed to have quite an extremely restrictive diet, not just orthorexia, based on her later comments. That isn't the same as eating well.

The issue would be if your daughter become obsessive about it.

This would ring alarm bells for me. I don’t know much about orthorexia, but I know a lot about OCD and, to me, the roots of eating disorders and OCD are not dissimilar. With, for example, contamination related OCD, it starts out with good hygiene. At least on the surface that’s what it looks like. But inside the person’s head there is a whole explosion going on around every decision as they plan how to deal with all eventualities. If, for example, your daughter is managing anomalous mealtimes where she can’t access her usual diet by delaying/fasting/starving, then I think you have good reason to wonder if all is ok.

What is 'clean' about red meat and dripping?
What is 'dirty' about, say, lentils, or chickpeas, or a good sourdough or multigrain loaf?

I do think carbs are important and I do eat them - I missed that from your OP - but there's a massive 'trend' for 'carnivore style'/low carb eating on socials at the mo, which may be feeding into it. It's not for me but I don't know that there is anything wrong with this per se.

I don't really like to use 'clean' or 'dirty' as descriptors for food, which is why I put it in inverted commas, as I was using OP's wording. Personally I just don't eat processed foods or those which I don't see as having useful nutritional value. I do love a glass of wine or two though.

There is nothing wrong whatsoever with these foods. I make my own sourdough and eat sourdough/lentils/chickpeas/grains etc. often. As I mentioned in my follow up, I hadn't seen from the OP that her daughter doesn't eat carbs. I don't agree with this personally as carbs are important for energy, brain activity etc. However I think OP's daughter is following the current online trend of having a lot of red meat/fruits/eggs and no carbs (inspired by uncle Eddie etc).

I used to eat like that - it's disordered eating. But it's way better than eating chicken shop chips everyday and drinking buzz balls..

She probably doesn’t know her daughter’s exact weight… why would she?

Being obsessive and perfectionist is a common feature of neurodivergence.

No, me either, which is why I also used inverted commas; it was just a shorthand.
I missed your follow-up about not seeing the no-carbs thing; apologies.
I don't get how people can eat no carbs and function. I can feel myself slowing down mentally and physically if for some reason I am low on them.

EDITED: typos

I suspect what you are seeing is tip of iceberg. Secrecy goes hand in hand with ED. Are her periods regular?
She’s only had to cope for 1 day away in past on her diet.
3 weeks away at boyfriend’s is a big jump. Have you chatted how that will work. What will she do if boyfriend’s mum makes family meals eg a nice homemade lasagne and salad or a roast dinner.

It's a strange trend at the moment! I don't want to speak on the carnivore diet too much as I'm not educated on the various pros and cons. I would definitely prefer to eat in that way than eat lots of processed/'junk' foods but my ideal diet includes carbs, protein, healthy fats, and fibre.

my ideal diet includes carbs, protein, healthy fats, and fibre.
That's still the model advised by dieticians AFAIK.

sounds like she's following the Paleolithic @arethereanyleftatall

Pros and Cons

OK, a fiction.
That's not how chemistry works.

Will she show you plan or guidelines she’s basing her diet on?
If you look on tik tok you’ll probably see the content she’s accessing. From a quick look at carnivore diet uk it’s lots of young women showing flat stomach off so definitely looks motivated.

I think this is the issue. There's nothing wrong with 'clean eating' as you put it, it's much healthier than what a lot of teens choose to eat! However, it does start to border on being a problem if she wouldn't eat anything at all if she weren't able to eat in this way.

As she’s 17 and you are funding this diet my worry would be that when she goes to uni which you said she is doing, if she can’t afford this plan which is extremely high cost - noted you’ve included oysters and steak, will she then not eat? You’ve said if she can’t access that food she won’t eat till she can. This would be a worry that I would try to get ahead of.
from my non professional view this is definitely a form of disordered eating and also obsessive behaviour. It must take up a lot of brain space for her too. I’m sure any dietician would encourage balance which it doesn’t seem like she has.
Also from personal experience high protein diets can have a huge impact internally which we’re not being told about. Yes there’s huge benefit to protein including weight loss, muscle maintaince etc. but high animal protein can be harmful on the heart and kidneys.

You've had some good advice/points raised on this thread OP.

Personally I'd say this is all about context (which is what a lot of posters are getting at) - what else is going on in her life, does she have any specific vulnerabilities etc. That's why it's almost not relevant that there are fully-grown, fit and healthy women on here saying that they eat the same - that's great, but generally fully grown women's brains are more developed. They have been through adolescence and come out the other side and are more likely to have the life experience and critical thinking skills needed to reign in excesses, if that makes sense.

The main challenge as I see it at the moment is that "clean eating" is so massive on social media that these ideas are staring to become normalised, at least amongst a lot of Gen Z. That can effectively mask what could certainly be worrying behaviour in some of that generation.

also, just to add re Paleo

Paleo dieters avoid Teflon (PTFE) because it is a synthetic, heavily processed material containing human-made chemicals. The philosophy mandates consuming only whole, natural, and unprocessed foods while strictly eliminating industrial chemicals and artificial ingredients.

That your daughter would rather starve herself because only "wrong" foods are available, suggests discretely, keeping a close eye @arethereanyleftatall

She sounds like she is basically carnivore and thrives because of it, it's a great way to eat. I did it and was thriving on it but stopped due to a while host of mental complications surrounding it (my abusive ex forced me into it and while I was thriving, I started eating other foods as a means of regaining control over myself).

Careful though, my ex who forced it onto me still does it to this day and heavily, heavily suffers with orthorexia because of it. One he was locked into this way of eating, it consumed him. Albeit he is also extremely narcisstic, so tired to push it on everyone around him, and anyone not doing it he abused. It was awful to witness this downfall that ultimately caused our separation.

I'm not saying this is or will be your DD, but just be vigilant. It was only since starting that WOE that he became like that. I've seen it happen to others doing it as well. She does sound like she's doing great though so kudos to her to be so responsible at such a young age!